Prius worst car in history in winter

Not sure -- the ones that came with the car. I'll have to check once it stops snowing.

 

I'd check the tires and see how they are rated for snow and rain. Some tires are downright horrible in bad weather conditions. Rather than just going and buying new tires it would be nice to know what you currently have.

 

And just having a Mud and Snow rating doesn't mean much. I've driven on some truly awful M&S tires. You need to check the reviews, or get a recommendation from someone you trust.

Tom

 

One point that I haven't seen in any threads is that poor driving skills done in a Prius probably make the winter drop in gas mileage worse compared to driving another type of car. In other words, if you do jack-rabbit starts and tailgated the car in front of you in a Buick, your gas mileage might drop 20% in the summer and 30% in the winter, compared to using common-sense good driving habits. But in a Prius, poor driving habits probably the mileage 20% in the summer and something like 50% in the winter. People who don't know how to drive are certainly prone to not liking a Prius, especially in the winter.

And the guy who got stuck in the his driveway with a 2 inch berm of snow in front of the tires.... !?!

So if you don't really care about driving a Prius with some respect, don't bother complaining in the winter time and PLEASE don't waste our time with inflammatory titles 'I hate my Prius' and 'Worst Car in History'.

I wish the moderators could install filters to delete unprofessional titles. This would help reduce the number of Ford and GM employees posting bogus complaints.

 

That's a thought....
.... or perhaps, juuust perhaps we can engage in a dialogue with people with differing points of view to try and educate them, and maybe learn a thing or two ourselves.
I've spent time in countries that deal with apostates with the "more rocks, bigger rocks" solution, and I can tell you that it does work...if your only goal in life is to surround yourself with people who (say that they) think juuuuuuust like you do.

Priuses and I have come a long way together since my arranged marriage with 'my' G3. Although I've never hated Priuses per-se (I'd never thought about it enough to care one way or the other) I did have to approach the whole Prius driving experience with an open mind and learn a little about the car, before I decided whether to like it or hate it.
There's not much of a middle ground for this car, if some of my co-workers are any indication.

All I'm saying is....rather than getting your bloomers in a bunch, a more reasoned approach might be in order. You know....."Just Give Peace a Chance", and all like that.

You can always pick up the rocks later.....

 

The problems are low post count (or single post) trolls that use inflammatory language and titles in their posts (much of which is inaccurate), sometimes to never return aka "throwing a grenade". The proper education (which has been given countless times here on PC) was already given in the 1st two pages of this thread.

Let's reexamine the first post in this thread and the title...

 

I'll just speak from personal experience. Last week the street in front of my house was glazed with wet ice (I doubt cold ice is more slick). The street is steep enough to attract kids for sledding. I started up the hill with my 2008 Prius (with Michelin Harmonies with 15,000 miles (which are not known for extreme traction)). With care I could accelerate up the hill from a dead stop. Later I attemped the same with our Odyssey (also with Harmonies). Not possible! I had to back down the hill to get a start. The Prius gives much finer torque control with the electric motors. I rate it about the same as an 'ordinary' front wheel drive car. Braking on ice is reasonable if you use care. But don't try to drive with six inches of snow on the road--there is too little ground clearance. Down here in NC we have snow plows to take care of that problem!

 

I too have noticed a big hit because of the heater. I have no doubt that other cars take a big hit in the winter as well, but I'm also pretty sure their hit is nowhere near as big. I've experimented at cold temperatures of -20C (-4F) and colder (we get lots of those days in the winter). If I run the heater fan the ICE runs A LOT more. Easily twice as much even once the car is warmed. As an experiment, many times when the ICE kicks in I turn the heater fan off and the ICE immediately stops.

In any case, this coupled with short 10 km (6 mile) trips, lots of snow and lots of bumper to bumper slow winter traffic because of the snow has left me with abysmal mileage (yes, my bottom grill is about 90% blocked and my tires are at recommended). I even had one tank worse than 7.8 l/100 km (30 mpg) - lot's of idling in traffic at cold temperatures with the heater running. I'm waiting for an opportunity to travel on the highway for a half hour or so to give a fairer comparison.

 

Finally my concern of low clearance is addressed. I remember getting hung up on the snow ridges the snow plows make and having to get out and shovel. If I move back north, I probably would use my gen 1 Honda CRV on bad snow days and live with its terrible 22 mpg. Surprised the original poster didn't throw low clearance in as an issue, maybe they don't get that much snow in New Jersey. Jersey is in the coastal Atlantic jet stream, so maybe they just get a chill and not much snow.

 

Regarding the winter mileage hit, yes, there was quite a colorful (for lack of better word) and emotional thread last year from a former Indiana area 2010 Prius owner bellyaching about the winter mileage drop. His solution, get rid of the Prius and replace it with car w/worse mileage.

Yes, besides the ICE taking long to warm up (possibly repeatedly) in cold weather, yes, the ICE running so much to provide cabin heat negates some of the advantages of having a hybrid.

As for your experiment, I and many others here have discovered the same thing. I have reproed this on the NAH, HS 250h and 3rd gen Prius too. Thus, it might be helpful to get a ScanGaugeII - Trip Computers + Digital Gauges + Scan Tool to monitor coolant temps (FWT [Fahrenheit Water Temperature] or CWT). On the 2nd gen, if heat is on HI and fan is on, ICE will run if FWT <=145 F. The 145F threshold varies depending on the temp setting.

For me, if I'm stopped or in low speed city traffic w/low acceleration demands, if I see FWT is <146, I leave the heat at max but shut the fan off, to prevent ICE from starting. If I have higher acceleration demands or must go above 42 mph, where the ICE must run anyway, I turn the fan back on.

I've gathered that the 3rd gen's temperature thresholds might be slightly different.

 

The new ECO mode allows the engine to remain off all the way down to a coolant temperture of 114°F.
.

 

I did also ask about the 3rd gen's ICE running to provide cabin heat behavior at http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-iii...6472-3rd-gen-vs-2nd-gen-questions-thread.html. Some 3rd gen folks did respond...

When I posted the question, I now realize I didn't fully understand my 2nd gen's behavior either. :redface: :embarassed: I now realize that the 145 F boundary on the 2nd gen is only for HI. If the HVAC's temp is set lower, the ICE running boundary temp is also lower. I haven't mapped it all out, but don't intend to either...

 

I'll step in and input my thoughts on cold weather. Right now I'm visiting friends in Fairbanks,Ak. Its currently -28f which I consider much colder than your lousy 20f. In this weather I can't Shut my car off because it would freeze solid. Therefore NJ is by no means a "Cold Climate." The end!

 

A couple of thoughts on winter mpg hit that people may not be considering:

MPG Scaling factor

1. On a 100 mile trip a Prius that dropped from 50 mpg to 40 mpg would use 0.5 gall extra (2.5 gall -2 gall)
2. Another car that dropped from 25 mpg to 20 mpg on the same trip would use 1 gall extra (5 gall - 4 gall)

In other words the Prius that drops 10 mpg is actually only using half as much extra gas as the other car that only drops 5 mpg.

Efficiency

1. Cars generally run their engines continuously and heat the cabin with waste heat
2. Being more efficient and cycling the engine, the Prius creates less waste heat so, in very cold weather it runs its engine a little more than usual to create some "waste" and keep you warm

 

I post this up quite a bit and never seem to get a response so either it is either a "No Duh" post or people just don't care. Then again I break it down so once people see numbers they just get bored and move on. lol

/copy

Additionally, you must keep in mind that a 10%-15% drop in avg. MPG appears larger with high MPG cars than low MPG cars. For example, a 15% drop in MPG for a 48mpg car will result in a 40.8mpg avg.. The same 15% drop on a 20mpg car will result in a 17mpg avg.. Most people would never notice the 3mpg difference in MPG unless they actually tracked how much they spent in gas during that change. Because the Prius has a nice big display that screams you've lost 7.2MPG, we tend to freak out.

1,000miles / 20mpg = 50ga x $3/ga = $150.00
1,000miles / 17mpg = 58.82ga x $3/ga = $176.47
The net difference is $26.47 for the 3mpg loss over 1,000miles
or

1,000miles /48mpg = 20.83ga x $3/ga =$62.50
1,000miles /40.8mpg 24.51ga x $3/ga = $73.53
The net difference is $11.03 for a 7.2mpg loss over 1,000miles

 

Living in Denmark where it has been freezing since late November, my Prius has performed as well or even better than my previous cars; granted - snow tires are a must-have - but that goes for any car in winter conditions IMHO.

 

Point well taken. The super high mpg with the prius in good weather causes folks to freak out when weather conditions reduce the readout. Even at it's worst, the mpg is still fantastic compared to almost anything else on the road.

 

Do you have pictures of being stuck?. My avatar shows me in 4 inches of snow - yes I measured it because that much snow in Texas is very noteworthy.

 

I must admit, I am so far quite satisfied with my 05, prius in the snow. I think the Hankook tires are amazing!!! The traction control sensitivity does suck; however, you must just be verry light on the throttle to start out.

Once your moving it goes great!!

 

I live in New Jersey and though we have had a lot of heavy snow this year, no problems yet with my Prius, even with stock tires.