Driving across the country today,listening to "Radio Times" on WHYY I think on Sat Radio, there was a 1 hour call in with to folks whose names escape me right now. They were talking about Google's plan for offshore wind and power generation up and down the east coast. There was a lot of very interesting info, but few things stuck with me. The first was if we (as a society) were to build ~4 million wind turbines we could generate ~98% of the electrical power the world currently uses. Another thing was a series of studies that they had done that suggested that by building a string of wind farms, scattered along the coast, the diversity of siting, and the sheer number of turbines would give near 100% reliability given a small modicum of excess capacity. One other note was, the same issues are related to PV solar. If you build solar farms and site them in enough varied locations, you even out the supply to the point of near 100% reliability. One final note was on the cost of wind. At current prices it is about 1.5 times the KWH price of gas or coal fired systems that are on line today. But it was pointed out that if you were to build any production facility that is already on line today, it too would be more expensive. In other words, it is neither fair or reasonable to compare current production costs of wind energy vs decades old coal fire plants that have been bought and paid for. (Not to mention the "free energy" going forward. There was much more, so I suggest, once again, if you are interested, I suggest you listen for yourself. http://whyy.org/cms/radiotimes/2010/10/27/are-the-winds-favorable-for-renewable-energy/ Doing a quick calc, while driving across Southern Alberta, Sask, and Manitoba, past hundreds of oil wells in the past couple of days my wife and I guessed at the price of an average wind mill. WAG of $5,000,000 per copy, 4 million would translate to ~$20 trillion dollars. Assuming the US needs say 30% of the worlds capacity, that would be ~1 million turbines or ~ $7 trillion. How much have we spent in Iraq to protect oil? Now that I have google this: How much do wind turbines cost? | Windustry I find the average cost is ~$3.5 million per turbine installed (2 mw average size). But it is too late for me to do all that math. I think you can get the idea. Off shore wind might come at a bit higher cost, but it might indeed come at a lower cost too,, something else to look into. Icarus
Recently people's been viciously fighting the government's plan of building wind turbines off the shore of lake ontario, claiming all sorts of ill effects to the environment, ecosystem, destroying the beauty of the scenery, health issues caused by the constant low frequency sound, etc, etc. 4 million wind turbines? I'm sure they'll scream murder. Wind turbine plan blows in controversy | Toronto & GTA | News | Toronto Sun
Agreed, However there is a great difference between off shore sea coast wind and it's impact and great lakes off shore wind. A big issue with lake Ontario (and Erie) is bird migration, although modern wind turbines have an average bird kill rate of under 10 per year if memory serves. (cited in the above link) unlike the older, faster rotating variety. (How many birds have been killed in the Ft. Mac tar sands tailing ponds in the last day alone?) There is also a big NIMBY syndrome, but if you site these 20+ miles off shore then it diminishes considerably. Additionally, we really have to begin to look at the consequences of our other energy choices. For example, it was cited in the above interview that ~20,000 people die each year from the effects of coal fired power plant air pollution. (Not counting climate change effects) I think he said that in Delaware alone (may have the state wrong) that 100 people die each year from those effects. If you had a serial killer on the loose killing 100 people per year, there would be a national effort to find the culprit. Why not the same for this?
there is a project soon to be launched to provide windmills off the Atlantic Coast that will be tied to power onshore. they purposely positioned far enough off the coast to reduce the number of regulatory agencies involved. also to quell the screams from coastal dwellers over the "destruction" of the view. now we have enough wind and 10 times the space required to do this, but its not in a convenient place. problems arise when most power is needed in the areas that have the least amount of space and the most amount of people who want a say so. that simply creates a regulatory nightmare. now we as a society have gotten into this mindset that we have rights to do whatever we want no matter what the long term consequences of our actions and we are destroying ourselves because of it in an attempt to cater to every little faction of our world in order to be "politically correct" until we change that simple little fact; we will never come to an agreement on anything.
let remember to call them turbines... they don't mill anything!! Interesting stuff, icarus. Must people are completely ignorant of the cost of fossil fuels. They know the price is low and that's all they seem to care about... or have the will/energy to understand. The cost of renewables is regularly compared to the price of fossil fuels... the cost of fossil fuels is rarely used in mainstream discussions.
