Letter from Toyota Re: Headlight problem

Dave I see youre from Sacramento. Where exactly did you go, "100 miles" out?

 

Replacing the whole light has never been an issue, They are saying the cost is because the whole bumper has to come off to get to the light and replace the bulbs, which is rediculus in the first place. I would like for 1 of the designers to reply with their reasoning on this, BUT... that will never happen because they are too embarrassed for their screw up, and why should they care, they don't have to do the work.

 

If you do your own work you don't need to remove the bumper. I suspect Toyota created that procedure for two reasons: 1) Service departments have tools that will quickly remove and replace a bumper, and 2) They assumed that HID capsules would last a long time.

Many PC members have swapped out HID capsules with the bumper in place. The full procedure can be found on PC.

Tom

 

I have posted this before but just in case, the front bumper (on a Gen II) need not come off to remove a headlight. Dublin Toyota pulled the top bolts in my bumper and the corner bolts in the fender well and rolled the bumper down to get the headlights out. Took maybe 10 to 15 minutes. So if they are trying to charge you several hours I suspect they may be taking advantage of customers.

 

I have an 09 Prius and I just got a letter too. Toyota admits there can be problems and that they were over charging for repairs. What really bothers me is that they recomend using the headlights less to extend the life of the bulb. That sucks! It is a known safety feature that driving with your lights on during the daytime reduces accidents. I ALWAYS drive with my headlights on all the time. Toyota advises that turning the headlights ONwhen they are already hot... (i.e. stop and go driving while shopping, etc.) will reduce the life of the headlight.

I've got a call in to my dealer right now. Has anyone brought this up with their dealer? What's the best solution?

 

That is outrageous. We shouldn't have to live in fear like that. As some people have previously said, some never have an issue with their HID headlights. Maybe it's luck, maybe it is or isn't correlated to however long you use them for.

I wish I knew the answer to your question, please let the rest of us know when you find out.

 

Cairo, so how much did this cost in the end? (Did you buy their HID bulb or your own? And then what was the cost of labor.) Thanks!

 

Is the HID headlight problem limited to earlier model years? Does it apply to the 2009 Prius?

I only ask because we have two 2009 Priuses with HID headlights and haven't received any such letters.

 

My 2008 with HID and 36,800 miles was apparently holding out for the Toyota letter and the end of my warranty before it started winking on and off. Passenger side only, driver's side was replaced under warranty at about 15,000 miles. I had noticed that the passenger side was considerably more yellow than the newer driver's side lamp. I called my dealership service rep and left a voice mail. Called again later that day and found out that he no longer works there - jeez, kill the voicemail box, will 'ya. Another service rep had me bring the car in the next morning and they replaced the faulty lamp for labor only at $75. I'm a long time customer who does just about everything himself but I throw them a $26 oil change every now and then to stay in the system. I found the YouTube video on how to do it yourself (the hard way) and was ready to walk if the price was over $100. Toyota obviously has a major problem and they are desperately trying to avoid a very expensive recall at a time when when their profits are way down. Having my headlights go out at midnight on a winding mountain road would certainly scare the hell out of me if I lived to talk about it. Please report your complaint to NHTSA.gov and maybe they'll finally initiate the recall process. Almost a thousand owners have complained already but it's government and what's the hurry? While they're at it, maybe Toyota can fix the premature tire wear problem too.

 

I have an 2009, and got my letter today.

 

My apologies if this has been discussed before, but my search didn't find it.
Has any serious thought been given (we must have attorneys driving Prius's, and
people who while not attorneys are familiar with this area of law) to look into
a class-action lawsuit over the headlights?

It's partly financial, but also leaves one with HIDs wondering if this will be
the night they lose half their illumination. Regardless of the statements in
the warranty book about how long they warranty light bulbs for, what we're
facing seems to be bulbs, on average, over a large number of units, delivering
only a fraction of the lifetime they should.

And, as others have noted, the Custimer Support Letter basically tells me not to
leave my headlights on during the day as DRLs, to sit patiently before turning
the lights on again after stopping somewhere, and so forth. This is not a fair
position to be put into.

It leave me, with a 2009 Touring, wondering if Toyota was smart enough to make a
running change in the bulbs used ... and if so, after what VIN number is your
exposure to failure limited. Worded otherwise, was Toyota so dumb as to keep
using the same parts in, say, 2008 & 2009 models, as it had in earlier years
where the pattern of failure was already clear?

Lastly, has anyone heard of a similar HID problem for other vehicle
manufacturers? If there isn't, it appears Toyota stands out ... on a limb all
by itself.

 

My '09 is still under warranty. I called Toyota and they said that headlights are not covered under warranty and unless they fail within the warranty period, I would have to pay to have them changed. I called the dealership and they said all we have to do is tell them that we have experienced "flickering," and they will change them at no cost. I asked them if the replacements are any better than the originals, and they said they didn't know, but said they haven't had anyone who got the replacements come back with any issues, yet.

 

Thanks for finding this out, I can only hope it is company-wide policy.

But I'm still totally confused when Toyota would claim responsibility!! What is the difference between the headlights "failing" at the fault of the driver and failing (or "flickering") by themselves???

 

I haven't scheduled the appointment yet, but I hope the dealership doesn't change their story after I get there. I'm going to wait until I am due for an oil change and get it done the same day. It shouldn't really matter to the dealerhip. As long as the car is under warrenty, they are just going to bill Toyota for the work anyway.

 

If you choose to be proactive, and I hope you do, you should file a complaint online with NHTSA.gov and join the class action suit at Girard Gibbs law firm. I did both. Remember that a class action suit reaps millions for the law firm and a free manicure with your next oil change for you so don't get your hopes up. However, keep your receipts! There's a good article on allaboutprius.com but PC won't let me post links. I found a 2-pack of the generic HID lamps/bulbs for $49.99 online so I'm not concerned about future replacements. They are fairly easy to replace following instructions on this forum or YouTube (more difficult).
Early on, some unscrupulous or just ignorant dealers were charging customers for an entire headlight assembly plus the ECU that cleverly levels the headlight aim when your Prius trunk is full of gold bullion. Totally unnecessary but very profitable.
The best approach is to express your concern and complaint to your dealer's service department. You must mention "intermittent" or "flickering" to get the correct response. Contact the dealership's general manager if you are not satisfied. Next is the Toyota rep handling that dealership. If still no comp, write or email some executives at Toyota, even the CEO. The squeaky wheel gets oiled first. I always get results but I am reasonable enough to pay a small fee ($50-75) for the service. Ask for your customer loyalty discount, senior citizen, dislocated worker and mental incapacity if you ever voted for George W.
Lastly, The Prius is compact sized and I drive with my headlights on for safety - period. I will give no consideration to when I turn the lights on and off, you must be joking Toyota. The faulty electronics must be replaced at no cost to the customer since they are clearly defective.
PS: I love my Prius and my wife even though both have some shortcomings. Hey, where's my new floormat and gas pedal?

 

Perhaps it's not fair, but that is standard advice for all HID lamps. All HID lamps suffer in this way. Unfortunately, Toyota used a bunch of bad capsules and as a consequence there have been a lot of premature failures. Toyota's new replacement capsules have been fairing better.

As for the letter, I got mine yesterday.

Tom

 

I've posted about this before but in short....

At less than 20,000 miles, my 2008 began having the now-you-see-them-now-you-don't headlight problems.

Dealer said they could not recreate the problem, therefore, there must not be a problem.

Happened again (this time, on parkway at night, both lights went out briefly. Was NOT happy), took it back to dealer and demanded a better look. Also called Toyota HQ. The latter said 'don't let the dealer replace the ECW, (or was it ECU? I forget) it's not the culprit.'

Anyway, I made sure to mention this at the dealer and guess what they did? Replaced it. Did not solve problem. Made another plea to Toyota, which contacted the dealer. Had them replace both bulbs and I wish I could tell you what else was done but my impression was, not much.

Was not charged for any of this.

Still, have not had a problem with the headlights since. But will I hang onto the letter I received from Toyota last week? You bet.

 

My '07 with 52,000 miles just started having this issue last week with the passenger headlight. I received a letter from Toyota on the water pump, but not for the headlights. When I called my service center to schedule for the water pump, I told them I also wanted the issue with my flickering headlights resolved at no charge. They didn't say no, but my appointment is next Thursday. I did tell them that I spoke with someone at Toyota customer care and they said the repair should be covered (no doubt because of the lawsuit.)

I am one to leave the headlights run at all times, so after the repair I will start turning them off before I turn off the car. I did that with my Rav4 and never had issues, but that vehicle did not have HID lights. I'll post my results next week.