Block Heater Question (Leaving Car Overnight)

(See: http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-ii-...gured-out-how-install-my-block-heater-13.html for a really nice install - mine is ugly )

I don't have pics yet... Basically it's a black Male plug, sticking out from the front grill some 3 inches. It's permanent.

A nicer setup is making a hole in the front bumper with a recessed plug & cover, like for the PHEV setup. But those cost more $$ and winter is not the best time to install it.

I'll live with the increased 0.01 drag of the plug.

Internal heater -> I put the black wire (it's thin) out the front driver window and close the door over it. The cord then reaches the extension cord, which also plugs into the EBH.
(It's not a permanent install - here's a pic)

The little indoors heater - it has a thermostat - I just put it High and 3/4 heat on the thermostat. It turns off on it's own. One hour makes the inside nice & toasty.
*** Warm Steering Wheel *** and no inside window scraping !

The extension cord has a triple head. I taped over the middle one. I will run 1-2 hours before I leave in the morning. IE, I usually leave at 7:30am, so I put the timer On for 6am.
Start it earlier when I know it's colder than usual.

(Or use existing extension cord with an outdoor head multiplier, like this: )

 

I see I need to take some road trips into Canada.

Wayne

 

I also put a heater inside my cab of my pick up truck, to keep my equipment warm for work
Carrying five cases of stuff everyday pain in the nice person
Have look into getting a heater that will heats the coolant of night

 

That is a bit hard to follow. Are you looking for a coolant heater for your Prius, or for your pickup?

There are aftermarket choices now for the 2004-2009 Prius and other Toyota's that use the cartridge-style heater. A Canadian source of such a heater is Phillips-Temro, their ZeroStart product line

Engine Block Heaters

Odds are, they carry what you need

 

Probably the pick up, and if I start use the Prius more for work I may get in the Prius

 

What make and model of pickup? In some cases, you have better results with a V8 motor, if you have one frost plug heater per side. Eg: an older Chevy pickup with a 350 V8, I had a 600 watt heater per bank, for a total of 1,200 watts

Or, a circulating coolant heater will also work better than a single frost plug heater

 

GMC Sierra 4x4 5.3L extended cab

 

I had a 2000, had to replace the heater once. It just quit on me, but it was under warranty so let the dealership take care of it

I believe after 2002/2003, the heater has an extra sensor wire. Something to do with emissions control. The older heater for the 5.3 Vortec will work, but will also set the Check Engine Light

So make sure you select the correct heater from that link I provided

 

Because there are valuable natural resources up there. We need those servants, or uh, "helpers" to dig up the resources and ship them down to us here in the warmer areas.

 

Hi Mark, I am a new Prius owner, a second-hand 2008 model living in Montreal. Could you provide the contact info for your garage where you got your EBH installed? Was the EBH also purchased there or from a dealership? I am not too happy with the services of the Chasse Toyota dealership garage where I purchased my Prius. Also, what do you mean by the "pad thing"?

To winterize my 2008 Prius, I have recently blocked the front grills and inflated my winter tires to 42F and 40B, and I have noticed a significant difference in mileage efficiency.Thanks for all the great info on this forum

 

I went to a local garage, located in the West Island on boul. Pfds (Chicoine). He (the ower) simply bought it from Toyota and sold it back to me with installation, for *CHEAPER* than what the dealership quoted me.

I have a 3-prong extension cord, so I plug the EBH + a internal ceramic car heater bought for 30$ from Canadian Tire.
The wire hangs outside the driver door when plugged in.

I plan this summer to do a better cable management setup by passing the heater's electric cord through the firewall out the front, and installing a PHEV-type plug in the front bumper for a "Clean" setup.
That, I have to do myself. If I ever do it.

 

Thankfully I don't have to deal with that kind of cold anymore, but there used to be a circulating type of coolant heater available that circulated the coolant in the engine and the heater core thereby heating both the interior of the car and the engine.
Really meant for enviroments where it got so cold that if you didn't heat the interior the plastic would get so cold it would simply break things when you got into the car.
These circulating heaters pull a lot of current, they have to to heat both the engine and the interior. I think around 1500 watts or so. Best to use a timer. You can get a good timer at Walmart, just be sure to get one meant for coffee pots as those are high amp timers. The ones meant to turn the lamp on and off while your gone won't hold the current a heater pulls.
It's real common when pre-heating airplane engines to wrap the engine cowling in a thick blanket to hold the heat in. Pretty sure placing a good sleeping bag on top of a Prius engine and then closing the hood would do the same, plus then you have a good sleeping bag in the car for emergencies if you need it.

 

I called up the Chasse Toyota dealership and got a quote of about 90$CDn for the EBH plus installation service of 1hr-1.5 hr at 85$1hr, for a max cost of about 240$CDN.

I was thinking of just buying the EBH and having it installed cheaper elsewhere but I was afraid that this may void any warranties I have for the EBH or even the Prius?

What has been your experience with respect of warranties when your Prius was previously serviced by a non-authorized garage?

Thanks!

 

Oil changes and adding an EBH (that you can even do yourself) are not warranty-voiding activities. Same for wheel changes and brake pads, etc.
Stick to Toyota for anything related to electronics & propulsion.

I was already at the garage (Chicoine) for installing winter tires & rims, and an oil change.

However, the only reason it cost less, was the hourly rate difference. Toyota and the garage both quoted 1.5hrs, and it really took 1.5 to do.

Me, it was the convenience - the car was already in the shop. No need to go to two different places.

In your case, I'd just let Toyota do it, not worth the hassle over 20$.
(Most shops charge 48$/hr and Toyota is 65$/hr)

 

(Most shops charge 48$/hr and Toyota is 65$/hr)

WOW, that is cheap
I think the local Toyota dealer is $98, a BMW dealer is $125, but you have WIFI, goood coffee and the wash and vaccum the car
and the Indy guy I take my truck to is $65

 

Well, we went to the Toyota dealership today to get the EBH installed, but we were told by the mechanic that it was a waste of money because the Prius uses its electrical motor to start-up and that in their opinion an EBH made no difference

Confused by their contradictory opinion, I contacted the CanAutoAsso-Quebec who did an extensive report on the advantages of installing an EBH, even for a Prius, in their winter 2009 issue of Touring CAA-Q and their website at CAA-Quebec, Automobile, Tips and Tricks, Environment and Fuel economy, Block Heater ( since I have less than 5 posts, Priuschat won't let me post any URLS yet )

The CAA-Q expert I spoke to told me that although, the Prius starts up through the electrical motor, that it soon switches to the gas motor for driving, heating and other needs. So if the gas motor is already warmed-up by an EBH, it will run more efficiently and cleanly when switched over. According to their tests, at an average temp. of about -10.0 C over 2 months last winter 2008, an EBH saved the Prius test car about 15% on fuel efficiency. As well, on a more long-term basis there will be less mechanical wear and tear on a EBH warmed-up gas engine vs a cold gas engine, and its better for the environment because of less polluting exhaust emissions

What the CAA-Q expert explained to me makes senses, but I am still a bit hesitant because of the conflicting opinion of the Toyota dealership, who are usually more than happy to charge for extra services and parts. What do you guys think ?

 

I think the mechanic at the dealer might be brain dead. EBH will help with FE even in warm areas because the FE is best at normal operating temps.

 

This is correct: an EBH in a Prius is not needed to help start the ICE at low temps. Instead of having a smallish electric starter, the Prius uses its 40kW MG1, with power from its 100 pound traction battery.

I'm still compiling data to confirm the trend (only about 12 data points now, need to be more disciplined) but my own experience is that the EBH saves me about 0.5-0.9L/100km (consistent with the info you got from CAA Québec). Using linear regression (fuel consumption vs temperature), I get two almost perfectly parallel lines, with 0.6L/100km difference... not sure yet if the relation is really linear. I'm not yet satisfied with the quality of the data set to make a definitive conclusion (R2 without EBH at 0.99 but R2 with EBH only at 0,90...).

This is with:
- average distance of 14.4km (exact same commute)
- EBH set on average for 3.5h (a timer is used)
- Average savings per trip of 8,3¢ (Electricity @ 0,08$ / kWh and gas @ 103,3 ¢/L on average)
- traffic is not taken into account, which affect speed and often create a "slinky" effect
- rear defroster use is not taken into account (used only when needed)
- using OEM Toyota electronic block heater, 400W
- car heater set to 22°C, auto fan, vent to manual defrost&feet, without zealous manual on/off toggle to prevent engine from running
- lower grille fully blocked, upper grille at 50%
- car is left outside, no shelter, but not exposed to dominant winds (which could cool the car down as it is warmed by the EBH)
- from experience and readings I assume the summer tire (Bridgestone Ecopia, formerly used during summer) and winter tires (Michelin X-Ice2, currently on car) rolling resistance are almost the same

Using an EBH, the engine starts at a higher initial temp, and is therefore more efficient. The car heater also brings heat quicker (set to auto, the fan remained stopped until the ICE can provide heat). If your commute allows you to run on the electric motor only, having an EBH could also helps in letting the ICE stop more often (when stopped, going at low speeds, gliding, etc.).

So, at Québec gas/electricity prices, you should not lose money running an EBH (doesn't consider the initial buying/install cost), but... are you disciplined enough to plug/unplug it each day?

Next step for me will be to use an electric heater (120V) in conjunction with the EBH (heat the cabin enough with grid power to prevent the car heater from running the ICE/stealing heat from it at the beginning of my commute... but that is another business case to make...). Bought it (CanadianTire sale during the holiday) but not installed yet (finding a way through the firewall seems harder than first thought (grommet next to the gas pedal is easily accessed from inside but not sure how I can grab the other end in the engine compartment).