I would hope THIS is a joke. The '10 Prius has "sudden unintended acceleration" in reverse? And "others have noticed this bug"? What the??? If not a joke - what's the story? Imagine backing out of a parking space, this occurs and you suddenly back into a stroller or such before able to brake harder to compensate. Can someone substantiate this supposed software bug --- or debunk???
No clue what this person is talking about. There are definitely some cases of grabbing brakes in reverse - it has happened to me - but that was a case of stronger than desired braking, not sudden acceleration. There is no acceleration at all in that situation as a matter of fact, just sudden stopping. This is the very first claim of sudden acceleration I've seen on the forum. Likely a misunderstanding of the grabbing brakes issue. Otherwise, probably just a person that hit the wrong pedal and tried to blame it on the car.
Yep, grabbing brakes sometimes in reverse is the only thing I've heard about and experienced. This is the first mention of any type of unintended acceleration.
No. We are all going to die a horrid, yet spectacular flaming death behind the wheels of a Prius. :scared: :car: eep: :target: :flame::mad2: ray: :rip: ray2:
Guess what? You can buy a red start/stop button for the Gen III right this very moment! $199 from Sigma Automotive, Toyota Prius 2010 ZVW30 Performance, Handling & Electronic Accessories :: Sigma Automotive Wonder if it is a retro-fit to the Gen II.
While it true that the brakes will indeed hold the car stationary, I'm not so sure they could stop a car from high speed as well as the engine being at full power. Remember brakes work by converting kinetic energy into heat, they may not be able to handle that much heat if you were going say 70 or 80 MPH and accelerated 10 MPH or so before you recognized the problem and applied corrective action.
The Prius is an automated machine. Runaway Mode is a failure mode, your car has one. Hopefully you never see it. I have been behind the wheel of a runaway car before. The gas pedal cable stuck. Lucky that I had time and my speed was lower when it happen. Shifted to neutral , stopped and then turned off the key to stop the engine. The gas pedal cable was frozen because of ice. Here are my reasons for wanting a switch. 2 sec to neutral at 60 mph = 176 feet 3 sec to push the power button at 60 mph = 264 feet 5 sec to try both neutral and the power button = 440 feet plus That's a long way before the car even starts to slow down. The idea of a switch (The big stop E-stop ha ha...) Is to be quick...not what should I do first, neutral or power button...by than you will have travel another 176 feet. In some peoples cases they just resign to the fact that they are gone to die and forget about neutral or the power button. I have worked with and have designed control systems using the Big red E-stops. They are a requried part of any automated machine. I can sleep at night, know that the equipment which I have designed will and can be shut down when thing go wrong. Sure an E-stop system can fail or may not be ideal, that just another fact about automated equipment. If I get a chance to upload the electrical schematics, hacking in a switch maybe a simple task. Just thought someone may have done this before... and I could just wire the switch. The safety red flip cover is a good idea.
Hi BlueIce and gbee.., A start would be a red cover on the PARK button. Ultimately, a true E-stop button would have to disconnect 12 V from the ignition coils (there are 4) and pull the hybrid battery interlock (which is on the battery box). An alternative for the battery interlock would be to pull the relay that trips the battery contactor. Not 100 % fail-proof, but probably 99.9%. It would be easy to wire a E-stop switch inline with the battery contactor coil. You can read about which relay this is in the emergency responder instructions published by Toyota. And similarily one could wire a NC contactor off the E-stop switch to the 12 V fuse that goes to the Engine ECU (or whereever the 12 V for the ignition coils comes from). Pretty easy for anybody with any electrical background. Which makes the way you approached this discussion suspicious BlueIce. A better comment might have been to just propose the above, rather than to make it a question. Indeed, the ignition power thing could be done to all cars. Why has it not ? I know in the 70's and 80's peope used to hide a toggle switch under the dash to avoid car theft. It basically did the same thing. And this was done even on cars without engine control computers. And lets not forget that there were a fair number of carborator cars that would go full throttle when something broke. I seem to remember some GM product where the butterfly valve was not counterweighted - for like maybe $.50, and that when the throtte springs broke the throttles just fell full open.
If people are that afraid of push button start that they want to hack in a big panic switch, why the heck would they buy the car in the first place? I mean seriously, not liking the NAV system or being unimpressed with the seat comfort... these are minor things a person might overlook for the rest of the features they like. But if you are really that concerned that the thing is a rolling deathtrap and you feel the need to re-engineer the basic safety systems so you don't die a fiery death in some imaginary "runaway mode", then what could possibly have possessed you to buy such a dangerous car in the first place? This whole post is the peak of trolldom, if you ask me. Nothing but a deliberate attempt to create fear and stir the pot. Pathetic.
P-E-O-P-L-E ------ Seriously? Have we seriously run out of reasonable things to post about? What a rediculous thread! Agreed that it's important to have an emergency shut-down procedure. And the Prius has one. All you do is push a button for 3 seconds. Better than what's available on conventional vehicles. OP -- If you really want what you're asking for, just get some red paint and go nuts on your push-start button. I hate to sound so crass.....but this has got to be one of the dumbest things I've ever seen on Prius Chat!
But Tom, it's not RED and it doesn't have a big "E" on it. So how do you expect your average "highly trained professional driver" to find it in an emergency? We're doomed I tell ya, DOOMED! :scared: :car: eep: :target: :flame::mad2: ray: :rip: ray2:
Thanks, It interesting that no one answered the question on the top of this thread. I had know idea that others would take this to heart. Pushing Park is not a normal thing for someone to do when a car is traveling at 60 mph. Currently I know very little about the controls system of the prius that why I posted a question. Thanks again for your information. The Big Red E-stop was just for fun. Controls fail, If it can it will happen.
There is almost always room for improvement with controls and human interfaces, so I can't argue with the notion that a more intuitive shutdown button could be provided. That said, the main thing I take away from this thread is that we make it entirely too easy to get a driver's license in this country. Drivers should know how to drive, and they should know the vehicle they are driving. No sane pilot ever jumps into an unfamiliar aircraft and flies off. You get checked out first, which means studying the specifications and control layout of the aircraft, and flying with an instructor until you are reasonably familiar with the aircraft. Yet people do it all the time in automobiles. As a pilot, let me assure you that things go wrong in a car a lot faster than they do in an airplane. Almost all driving is done inches from death. All you have to do is wander from your lane a bit and it's curtains. For those of us old enough to have driven a variety of manual transmissions, I have to point out that there has never been much standardization with the layouts. There was three on the tree, three speed floor shifters, four speed, five speed, and others. Reverse was in a variety of locations. Sometimes it had a lockout, sometimes not. After reading this thread, I now wonder how we managed all of those various transmissions without bright orange warning labels. It's a wonder any of us survived. Tom
Selection bias. The very many who didn't survive are not here to read and post. I could start listing names ... But you are right, very few of those who are no longer with us departed due to nonstandard shift layouts. But a clutch is fairly standard, and does disengage the engine.
Thank goodness that at least the pedal layout is standardized. Can you imagine the chaos if they weren't? It's bad enough just having one missing when you first drive an automatic transmission. My 1972 Jeep C-J5 had its share of pedal problems. The clutch linkage would occasionally fall out, making it impossible to clutch the engine. Worse still, on at least one occasion the retaining clip fell off of the brake master cylinder push rod, allowing the brake pedal to pull up to a horizontal position. Fortunately I never lost the brakes and clutch at the same time. These weren't maintenance problems, but simply bad design. On the other hand, you never had to worry about floor mats catching in the pedals. There were no floor mats, and the pedals were a half a foot from the floor. Tom
+1 Period correct, but politically incorrect joke: What do you call a double date? A four on the floor. I remember a very embarrassing moment involving non-standardized manual shifters. I drove my girl friend to my grandmother's house one day in my four speed manual. After some short but awkward conversation, Grandmother asked me to move her car for some now long-forgotten reason. It was a cute little Hillman sedan. I got out to the car and the damn thing had the shifter on the column. How many speeds I couldn't tell, but I only needed to find one of them. But, for the life of me, I couldn't find reverse. For Christ's sake, it had to be there somewhere! There were at least 17 possible locations for it, and I tried them all... Nothing but high revving engine sounds, or the grinding of gears as the car inched forward, deeper and deeper into the lilacs. There was only one thing to do. Go back into the house and in front of the GF, admit to my Grandmother that I didn't know how to drive her car. Maybe I could maneuver Gran off into the next room so the GF wouldn't hear. Fat chance! So I tried the 17 possibilities again, and while frantically stirring the shifter around I thought that I found three more... still nothing! I happened to glance in the rear view mirror Despite the brutal stinging in my eyes from beads of sweat rolling down my forehead, oh God, I saw Grandmother and the GF coming out of the house to see what the problem was. Out of gas?... No! Dead battery?... No! Lost the key?... No! The gig was up, I had to admit to my Grandmother, and GF that I had never seen a three-on-the-tree before in my life. Uh, er, well, I can't find reverse... It's no big deal, really. What can you expect, the English drive on the wrong side of the road too. Grandmother was very gentle when she showed me what to do. But I couldn't help but see the GF's smirking, so-you-think-you're-so-smart smile...
