US religious landscape shifting

I doubt pedophilia is getting worse but instead is starting to be reported more.

As to your previous comment connecting pedophilia to pornography; there simply isn't a connection. Pornography isn't new, it goes back as long as we have human records. Wanting to molest or have sex with children has nothing to do with looking at pictures, video, or stone engravings of adults having sex.

 

Shouldn't the USA be under native tribal law, when you go to a foreign country you should do as the locals do ...

I understood from the discussion a Shari court would only act in civil matters where both parties in dispute agree to use the court but UK courts would administer criminal law.

 

I think we have that already. It's called "Judge Judy".

Tom

 

Sure, I'll chill, no problem. Just don't expect me to give various "churches" and "religions" a "get out of jail free" card for encouraging, sheltering, and protecting pedophile "priests"

 

That's one hot woman purrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

 

Jayman, really! Why would I expect you or anyone else to to give a pedophile regardless of their title, position, religion, or beliefs a "get out of jail free" card? Wow, that's almost offensive to me that you'd say that. Do you really think I would defend someone "religious" over one who isn't? Are they any less accountable to the law because they claim religion? Their only religion is their own depravity.

 

No, I would never suggest you *personally* would do that, you seem innocent enough. You do seem to have a difficult time accepting that religion appears explicitly or at least implicitly responsible for this

I have noted a *trend* with various so-called "religions" and "churches" - note my use of quotation marks, that's what I think of them - to shelter pedophiles, and to actively reject victims, cast doubt upon victims, etc

 

"Innocent enough"...not sure what that means , but I'll take it as a compliment if I may. You're right though, I do have a hard time accepting that religion is responsible for this, I blame the humans. They are the ones who corrupt religion. (Of course, I only speak of Judeo-Christian beliefs when I refer to religion, though I'm sure the Muslim faith would have some bad things in store for pedophiles as well.) And yes, any religion or church that would shelter pedophiles and reject the victim in any way is a fraud.

 

I would disagree, and as of now I don't have the statistics to back that up, so at least we agree to disagree.

I don't believe anyone will disagree that pornography has been around for millenia or that pedophilia hasn't been around for just as long. I think it's stretching it a bit to say pornography has no connection to pedophilia. Accessibility to pornography, especially on the internet, will undoubtedly expose one to child pornography whether by accident or not. Exposure to child pornography would certainly have a positive correlation to an increase in pedophilia and thus an increase in predators.

NCPCA Child Sexual Exploitation Update Newsletter Volume 1, Number 3, 2004

News - Europe: Online pedophilia up 300 percent

 

Child pornography, wrong as it is, doesn't create pedophiles. Pedophiles create child pornography. You have your cause and effect reversed.

As for ordinary pornography, there is absolutely no evidence that it creates sexual deviants. That's just wishful thinking from narrow minded prudes. On the other hand, there is ample evidence that sexual repression does create deviants, the Catholic church being a good example.

Tom

 

So you're saying that exposure to child pornography absolutely can't spark pedophilia in an otherwise "normal kinda guy"?
I certainly do agree with you that sexual repression does increase deviant behavior, even God acknowledges and addresses that in the Bible.
On another note. You know, Tom, when you continuously attach negative and/or derogatory labels to people who think different than you, it kinda makes you seem a little "narrow minded" yourself.

 

Well, I'll stop my unapologetic, negative, and derogatory attacks on "religion," "churches," and - my favorite - "priests" when they stop their attacks on victims of church-sponsored pedophiles

 

I only attach negative and derogatory labels to people with bad ideas and poor thinking. When someone is pushing a bad idea or blatantly wrong information they deserve a negative label. In this country we have somehow arrived at the silly idea that all sides of a debate deserve equal respect and consideration, even if the ideas are ridiculous. News programs do this all of the time, where they find a nut in a tinfoil hat and give him equal time to spout absolute rubbish. This is considered fair and balanced. We need to stop doing this.

As for differing ideas, I am happy to hear them as long as they have merit. Presented intelligently, I will give them the respect they deserve.

Getting back to pornography, a "normal kinda guy" isn't going to view child pornography. It is evil, disgusting, and repugnant. A "normal kinda guy" will not be drawn to the dark side because he won't even look at that crap. The making of child pornography is abusive, which is why it is illegal and should remain illegal.

Regular pornography and erotica, on the other hand, gets a bad rap. I am talking about erotica and pornography made by and viewed by consenting adults. We have a strong puritanical hold-over in this country, and people with puritanical leanings want to believe that pornography turns otherwise good men into rapists, or god forbid, homosexuals. Viewing pornography will make you a sexual deviant with horns and a forked tail. Everyone knows that.

Just wanting something doesn't make it so. The puritanical group wants people to be punished for enjoying sex. I'm going to be narrow minded again and state that this is a dumb idea. Just because they are hung up about sex doesn't make it bad. It's a natural part of being alive, so I prefer to calibrate sex and enjoy it. It is a good thing. Pornography, if it works for you, is fun and stimulating. If it doesn't, try something else, perhaps romance novels. Neither of them are going to hurt you.

Tom

 

Maybe you should direct your energy to the perpetrators (including those who ostracize victims, aren't they just as bad?). Jayman, I think it is great that you have such zealousness against this social abomination and those who tolerate it. Within you is a warrior for the rights of others, especially children. And you said you can't stand children, I think that was you that said that once, correct me if I'm wrong please. You have a great potential to be the strength for those who have none. Sitting on the bench throwing words against these villains isn't really helping anyone is it? Get involved, I'm sure there are many ways in which you can help fight this!
You might just find that those who truly take God's Word seriously are on your side!

 

Stop talking about me in public

Just kidding

Agree 100% with your rant

 

Um ... yes, they are and I already have covered that. Eg, my latest post on that topic "Well, I'll stop my unapologetic, negative, and derogatory attacks on "religion," "churches," and - my favorite - "priests" when they stop their attacks on victims of church-sponsored pedophiles "

In previous posts on this thread I have discussed how even zealot church goers turn against the victims of pedophile priests. There is no god looking out for these victims, they are outcasts not only in their church but also in our society

Eg: if a man in his 20's comes out admitting a priest played with his genitals when he was 10, most of us in society think "ewwwwww he might do that to me ewwwwwwwwww."

Such a crock of s***

I personally have never been married, have never produced offspring - at least none that I know of, and I just KNOW I'm setting myself up for a surprise by putting this in writing - but that doesn't mean I don't stick up for those who are figuratively and literally f***ed

The reason why I am such a zealot - that actually applies so is a good word to use in my case - is due to a guy I knew in the Army. He had a lot of problems and thought joining the Army would "cure" him

Yeah, when he was around 12, a very trusted member in his church (As a hint: he was born and raised in southern Utah so use your imagination) took him on a camping trip. It turned into a horror of sodomy, oral sex, etc etc.

He made the "mistake" of immediately telling everybody when they got back. Of course, he was "making it up" and he was a "bad boy." Everybody labeled him a "fag." Quite frankly, whether he was gay or not is/was his business, nobody else's. All bulls*** on the part of that "church" how they protected the pedophile

He had a lot of personal demons to deal with as a result of that figuratively and literally f***ed up camping orgy trip with the pervert. Well, one day at the range, he stood up during live fire, turned around his sixteen, ate the barrel, and pulled the trigger

Could I have done more to prevent it? F*** knows, I'll live with that image the rest of my days, and it haunts me. Most things I have a "live and let live" attitude but you mention child sexual abuse, I get hot right now. I'm not a weakling either, once I pop my cork, I can be dangerous

Thing is, that kid had balls to get as far as he did. He had courage and balls, way more balls than any of the armchair quarterbacks - who have never worn fatigues for even 5 minutes their entire life - who send kids off to war with a giggle

So when somebody tells me they are "shocked" to hear of a "trusted church member" f***ing little boys, and that shock turns - naturally - to disbelief, I call bulls***.

In the case of any bible-thumper zealot, I always wonder why they even ask the question, fearing what the answer really is? The truth isn't always a pleasant thing, you know.

Those of us firmly grounded in reality have enough noodles in our brain to recognize the Real World isn't a very pleasant place. There is no mystical magical being out there protecting little boys from pedophiles with a deranged lust and a hard on.

There is no mystical magical being in the sky to make our lives cheery, sunny, and wonderful. That's up to us. Once we turn authority over to a mystical magical being, working through a proxy here on Planet Earth, we are screwed

In a figurative and even sometimes even in a very literal sense

So, I should find myself the nearest pedophile and cut Captain Winky off? With a dull, rusty knife? Okey pokey, I'd go along with that. Let's start rounding up these church pedophiles and I'll make sure to leave a knife outside for a week in the rain, so it gets good and rusty

What I would like to see is that guy in the Vatican with the pointy hat to quit using the church to shelter and protect pedophiles. Actually, I'd like to see a law passed where if *any* so-called "church" shelters pedophiles, then the entire leadership is castrated and jailed for life.

Nope, just the opposite.

Plenty of bible-thumper zealots are simply aghast when I talk like this. I've had bible thumpers tell me TO MY FACE that "oh the kid will forget about it, they can't remember." Then they offer to "pray" for the priest .... oh, and they'll even "pray" for the victim, maybe hoping the little bugger keeps his mouth shut

Holy s***!

Yep, it's a cancer on the world. Time to cut it out before it grows further

 

I'm shocked and appalled that the girls in the local Catholic high school here in Victoria are not allowed to wear pants!!! Even in the winter, when it's really cold, they are expected to wear skirts. Total bulls**t rule for the benefit of the pervs in charge. A total disgrace. And pretty much everyone just goes along with it. I can't believe it.

 

About the only advantage is that the girls are probably *safer* than the boys are! If the church could change the rules, the girls would be wearing pants, and the boys would be wearing skirts ...

 

Everyone knows that the only good sex is the well calibrated sex.

 

I like the sound of this, but I'm not sure I know what it means?

Tom