Dead battery after 2.5 weeks

Hello Prius People,

I have been lurking these electrical posts for a couple of weeks now. Funny how I always return to Prius Chat to answer questions I have. This time it seems that my frequent need to jump start my 05 (w/SKS & 56K miles - SORRY signature not updated) is not an unusual problem. In fact, it may be coming more common as this generation ages.

I too have the original 12 V battery. In October, my wife fell asleep listening to the radio in ACC mode and I needed my first jump. I have probably needed a jump start half a dozen times since then, most recently, last night.

I have used the battery test procedure recommended in this thread (found at http://www.elearnaid.com/12vo1topraub.html) Last night while waiting for AAA to jump start me I found that my 12V was reading 9.6V. Today, I spent nearly $200 on the Optima battery and installation kit. Considering that my dealer quoted me $167.83 for the Toyota replacement battery (without installation) I think I can install the newer, better deeper charging battery myself on a Saturday. With some luck, I may actually improve my gas mileage.

I’ll keep you posted on my progress.

 

Just like to point out: once you discharge a lead acid battery, it is damaged... and will lose alot of capacity.

 

I'm sorry to say that I think you wasted your money buying the Optima. Your mileage won't improve, and the battery longevity won't improve (enough) to justify the cost.

The reality is that lead acid batteries don't like deep discharges, and they especially don't like being left in a semi-charged state. Every time you draw down a battery more than ~ 20% you are taking life away,, quickly. A conventional battery can survive this once or twice, but more than that and you are murdering it. Charging poor batteries adds a strain on the alternator as well as to the battery itself, as it's internal resistance changes

The Optima won't give you any better draw down performance and because it is a sealed battery, you can't monitor it's water usage to see.

If if it were me, I would buy the proper battery, from an aftermarket source.

Icarus

For those that are interested:

Car and Deep Cycle Battery FAQ
Car and Deep Cycle Battery FAQ
Battery Tutorial | BatteryStuff.com
Deep Cycle Battery FAQ

 

Note that the Prius will automatically switch to IG-OFF one hour after it is left ACC-ON. If your car needed a jumpstart after the stereo was on for only one hour in ACC-ON mode, then the battery is due for retirement.

Good luck with the replacement installation, pls let us know whether you have any trouble installing the new positive battery terminal on the fuse block.

If the "proper battery" means a replacement with the GS label, I am not aware of any sources other than Toyota dealers. The original equipment battery for SE/SS vehicles has a black case and is AGM, so in principle there's no free liquid level to look at.

 

Patrick,

Thank you for that,

I wasn't aware that the battery was an AGM. I just assumed that someone made and OEM spec aftermarket battery. Not Johnson Controls or Interstate or someone?

My real point is that I don't think there is any advantage to be had by gettting a Optima over the OEM.

Icarus

 

Hi Icarus,

Yes, the GS battery is manufactured in Japan and is supposed to be AGM although some posters have reported their particular battery is the normal flooded type. I checked the batteries in my 2001 and 2004 and both were AGM.

Japan sourcing is one reason why the battery is relatively expensive when purchased at Toyota dealers. I am not aware of any aftermarket replacement that is suitable regarding battery terminal size. Usually it is possible to meet capacity and physical dimensions criteria (sometimes using a spacer of some sort) and the terminal connectors have to be replaced.

 

Considering what the dealer was charging for the OEM battery. I think the cost of the Optima is a "good deal". If the reports here of better prove to be true, I can easily justify the "upgrade".

 

As an observation, I looked at my 2007 pkg 2 with SKS and backup cam, but no navig, and it has the white GS battery. I also saw the original battery for $122 from a Toyota dealer online, without shipping. That isn't bad for an agm, it's in line with aftermarket.

I fail to understand, in layman's terms, how the 12v can effect mpg, it seems that if significant current is always entering the defective 12v from the traction battery, it would overheat and possibly burst.

 

This is interesting, if your car has the Smart system, then you are supposed to have the larger GS battery with a black case - unless they switched the large battery production to using white cases.

The online price is good, however after you pay $30-40 for shipping you'd might as well buy from your local dealer...

 

as i previously stated in this or another thread, my '06 OEM battery would not hold a charge. the display test listed on eLearnaid website consistently showed 9.7 volts or less after 30 minutes of driving.

i ordered my Optima yellow top on Tuesday-1/27 and received on Thursday-1/29. i installed last night via the complete instructions. took abt an hour and did not lose any data on NAV or radio.
$193.05 with free shipping, the special cable/connection package, and sales tax...

i have since performed the test on the Optima after 30 minutes of driving... 11.9 volts

now i can sit in the vehicle with accessories running w/out fear of draining battery.

i'm happy with my purchase

 

If you just installed a new battery ( any kind) it should be reading much better than 11.9V. Did you go to display, signal check on the MFD for that reading? Also I never sit in the car and listen to the radio in Acc mode, I think it's a bad practice. Put the car in ready and park and let the HV charge the battery. It does not use much gasoline.

 

Continued from Post # 40. Way back from Reno. Thick frost all over car, especially windshield.temp at Castle Peak 18F, used CC very little, kept car in D and accelerated slowly downhill to ~75 or 80MPH, which allowed car to climb small hills easier. Total drop in altitude = ~7500 feet. MPG went from 41MPG to 54MPG. Current MPG showed predominently 99.9 upon descent. So much for Winter driving.

 

An observation I have made since getting a Scan Gauge II is the charge voltage drops from 13.6 - 13.7 volts right after start up, to 13.2 volts after a short time IF there is no added load on the 12 volt electrical system. That is, all lights off, radio off, heater fan off, wipers off, etc. If I turn any accessory on the voltage goes instantly to 13.6 again.
I'm guessing this is a float charge situation once the DC-DC converter determines the 12v battery is fully charged. This may account for improved mileage with a battery minder but I doubt it would account for a big increase. Of course if the battery was faulty it may cause the DC-DC converter to work harder increasing load on the system. That is a new battery could be responsible, or maybe the driver has just worked out how to drive for economy?

 

It is a Feb 07 production car, delivered in CA, SKS, and has white case GS. Probably just my luck to get the few ones with the smaller size and SKS. The aftermarket battery might be the best deal. Hopefully someday they will start having generic replacements. I am used to, like everyone, paying $50-70 at Costco or such place.

It may be an invention to make a shaving tool to reduce the diameter of an American size battery post

 

Maybe I missed it, but whenever you get a new battery, it's really important to fully charge it before installing it. I use a DMM and it claims in Ready, around 13.6 vdc all accessories and lights off. OTOH, my FJ will idle at around 13.9 vdc under similar conditions

 

Right on, I don't thing the OP did that. He thinks his problem is fixed.........until next time.

 

i did the display test as instructed on eLearnaid while sitting in garage with the Prii in ACC mode immediately following driving for about 30 minutes.
it starts at 12.1, then moves to 12.0, then drops for a bit to 11.9, then goes back to 12.0

it's a 12 volt battery that shows 11.9-12.0 volts while sitting in static mode.

what am i missing?

 

I've never used the display test method. I have a calibrated Fluke DMM that I trust, and have recorded the values I mentioned while in Ready.

Note: I also use a VDC Battery Minder on the 12 vdc battery when the car is parked in my garage. My battery is still quite strong, as a test I left the VDC unplugged for a couple of days and my battery still had 12.8 vdc