when you replace the battery

Jaymann you are the oricle. Man I tell you, you have an answer for everything. Did you invent cracking units? Maybe you should take your findings to the government. Wait, you already did and they didnt need your help did they. They just want to make oil tied republicans richer. Whos the richest man in the US now? Is he a republican? Who's the majority leader and why haven't they solved this energy crisis and fuel prices?
Natural occurrences of sulfur particles spewing into the stratosphere from major volcanic eruptions, such as Mount Pinatubo in the Philipines in 1991, have reduced surface temperatures on Earth for the several-year period of enhanced aerosol loading.
Not Sulfer Dioxide
Whoops

 

+1. Couldn't agree more.

I believe a person has to have certain moral and ethical principles. If that person is witness to, participates in, or is privy to, things that are immoral, unethical, even downright sinister, what do you do?

Do you do this:

:lalala:

Or do you trust your inner voice, your Moral Compass, and do what is best to help you sleep at night? Wouldn't be the first time a person chose exile over perpetuating a lie, hurting other people by order, etc

They had my nice person for ten years. I lost count the number of times I could have been sent back to my folks in a box. So we're even, enough said of that. I also did things I'm ashamed of, by direct order

That's why I don't believe the attacks were part of a conspiracy. It was just good luck, like somebody filling out a lottery ticket, changing their mind, throwing the paper on the floor, and you pick it up and run the numbers. And win the PowerBall. Dubya won the lottery, but he then blew it.

That stunt didn't benefit Canadian farmers either

Actually it's best to start in grade school. A normal young adult able to think freely can very easily pick and chose what college to go to, what to listen to, and what not to listen to. It's not like "they" put psychedelics in the water to put everybody into a trance state

If I had to bet, I'd bet on Obama simply because a lot of folks are put off by McCain. Does that make him the "better man?" Beats me. I think he was bs'ing about NAFTA, it would cost too much to tear it up. That was just a sound bite to get folks charged up

Scroll down to "Automotive Manufacturing Subsidies" near the bottom of the page:

Subsidies

I like the CTF, they appear to understand the important issues regarding debt, deficits, and subsidies

News Releases - CTF Opposes Cash for Car Makers Lottery Win

Pretty good reporting here. How does half a billion in subsidies grab you?

globeandmail.com: As auto strategies go, Ontario's is humming

As you can see, the Canadian Taxpayer generously helps support the Big Three.

 

Of course not, but I do provide consulting services to all the major petrochemical companies. My largest project to date was consulting provided to SECCO of Shanghai

What "findings?" Hydrotreating is a well-established refinery practise. The trick is in coming up with new catalysts that enhance performance, extend time between regeneration, and reduce bottlenecking

I think you know the answer to that. First, demand in India and China is through the roof compared to 10 years ago. It's projected to increase much more

We had plenty of warning and plenty of time to do something about this. I was a young teenager during the first OPEC crisis, and everybody swore they would never drive big cars again, would turn to solar, would simplify their lives ... we're back in the same fire. Too bad, so sad

In the interest of Fair Disclosure, I should tell you that the majority of my investments are in petrochemical-related fields. They are doing quite well right now. Actually, no matter what the US does, China and India will more than make up for any small drop in demand

Um, no

I had to dig around but found a fairly simple explanation

EO Library: Ultraviolet Radiation Fact Sheet Page 3

I think what you are referring to are volcanic sulfates, correct? The sulfur emissions from transport is entirely different. Actually, there is a lot of debate regarding volcanic sulfates

This is heavy reading, so you're forewarned

3.1 Sulfate Aerosol

This is some research done by DOE

Information Bridge: DOE Scientific and Technical Information - - Document #10108343

 

Damn pods, how many tabs you got opened for searches. Are those government findings or environmental findings? You know how the government is. We had 3,000 acres takin from us because of a migrating bird from mexico. The government said the cattle would destroy their nests, oh they migrated there for only 3 months out of the year. Good ole' environmentalist. You can search it "Balcones Canyanlands National Wildlife Refuge". Since you got the tabs opened. Man I thought liberals where supposed to be compassionate!

 

Not too pround of Reagen either. The defense buildup left us a massive debt. Remember those magic budget surpluses of the US and Canada in the mid 1990's? Despite spending staying the same or increasing?

A lot of that debt was refinanced to take advantage of the much lower interest rates by then. Can you guess which country now holds a lot of IOU's on Canada and the US? I'll give you a hint, they recently had a massive earthquake

No matter who gets in, it's a giant putrid s*** sandwich. All of us are going to have to take a big bite. The entire housing thing, the cheap credit, I fear was the straw that finally broke the camels back

BioFuel is the biggest scam out there. Sure it benefits farmers, but it does nothing to address its stated purpose: to reduce Carbon emissions. Easy enough to find arguements that it either does nothing, or contributes more than fossil fuels

Of course, Brasil started cutting down rainforest to grow sugar cane, to run their cars on ethanol. GM, Ford, Dodge, even Toyota all sell vehicles in the Brasil market that run on pure ethanol. Is it "worth" it? Beats me

On the one had, they were able to wean themselves off expensive foreign oil, which literally had them over a barrel. Their currency was in crisis. That sounds very much like the direction the US is now heading

We have to do something. I don't think we need carbon taxes, or any other sort of direct government intervention. A pipeline problem in Alaska, a bombing in Saudi Arabia, whatever, will push fuel up again. Many are already making decisions to slow down, drive gently, or not drive at all.

 

There are proven health effects due to the smog formed by NMOG's, PM, Nox, etc. You can't "see" it but on the truck you mentioned, it's there

So why would somebody make that decision? I see no purpose, no need.

You want my personal *and* professional opinion regarding Dodge and Cummins? They screwed the pooch, big time. The emissions controls were not thrown at them with no warning, they knew *years* and advance.

They dragged their feet, hoped it wouldn't "really" go through, and at the 11th hour had to throw something together.

The Europeans also very recently decided to do something about diesel emissions. Current EuroIV diesel standards allow far more NOx, PM10, and NMOG than the EuroIV gasoline standards. EuroV tightens the diesel standards quite a bit, and most of the EU car makers are being put to the wall by it

However, they are meeting those standards. Why can they do the engineering, but we can't? Reminds me of the early 70's when the Big Three pissed and moaned, claiming it was impossible to meet the new emissions standards. Along came Honda with their CVCC motor, and they claimed it was easy to meet the standard

I fully support competitive manufacturing, and some regulatory push, to force the companies to design new better things. The Dodge with the Cummins is *not* a new, better thing, it's fairly old technology being forced to do something it really cannot

Why can Cummins meet the standards with their big highway motors? I have a neighbor near my hobby farm who has a fleet of 6 Kenworth T2000 tractors. It's a family operation, everything stays in the family, which is the only way to be successful

He ordered a new tractor last fall, it came with a Cummins ISX with the DPF. First few trips the mpg were almost 2 mpg lower than the other tractors. After 4 months of that, he stopped by a large Cummins shop in the states and complained.

They flashed the computer with an update, and he's now quite happy. His 7 month old tractor with emission controlled ISX gets the same fuel economy as the older tractors.

So whatever happened to good engineering?

 

Just one. Shaw Cable is *very* fast

Government. Again, there is a lot of debate over this. Large volcanic eruptions inject huge amounts of particles into the atmosphere, those can cause cooling. So can an impact. I'm unsure, is this what you are referring to, a massive eruption or a "normal" eruption?

For example

NASA Fact Sheets

Again, the sulfur I thought you were referring to was from transport fuels. That is entirely different from the sulfates in volcanic eruptions. Keep in mind the aerosols form very complex mixtures, many we don't understand.

I've been to China on business many times. Trust me on this, you do *not* want their mess. We really don't have to "force" them to clean up, their health issues will become so bad they'll either do something about it, or die

Every time there, I'm hawking up dark brown, even black, phlegmy stuff. Very nasty

Anyhoo, I'm calling it a night. Let's continue tomorrow

 

You are right, Matt, I am sorry I bought my Prius -- oh wait, that was my Ford Focus and its 23+ recalls. My bad.

Actually, if you got past those first two sentences then here is the serious side. I bought my Prius because I needed something to replace my Ford Focus and I went to the local Toyota dealership to look at a Prius. It was January and they had three in stock and were besides themselves so they offered me a great deal. I had been looking at hybrids for abouta year and was doing research but I really didn't know much about the Prius -- I knew more about the Honda Civic Hybrid. Consumer REPORTS kept saying good things about the Prius and it was about the same as the Civic so I bought one. Honestly, I bought more than I thought I did and I am more than happy. The Prius is not a truck or a minivan and can't really replace either one, but this is the best car I have ever owned. I wanted to stick with Ford but they really lost me with the Focus, all the recalls, and the poor workmanship. People have been driving Prii in NO VA for years and I haven't met one person with any of the problems you described and many of those folks own first generation Prii. I won't throw articles or research at you -- I simply cannot find anyone with complaints against their Prius except for the seats and the "Guess" guage. Also, I was suprised to look at the maintenance schedule. I am a shade-tree mechanic and was expecting more than I found. In fact, I kept looking for the missing pages (they don't exist). Essentially, most of the services occur every 5K miles and those services consist of 1. Oil change 2. Well there really isn't a two. The Prius doesn't use the actual brakepads to slow down most of the time and the Atkinson-cycle engine has much less wear and tear than an Otto-cycle engine. Also, I never had a hatchback before my Prius. I never really liked hatchbacks because they didn't have a proper trunk like normal cars. It turns out that I hate trunks and the hatchback design lets me put things like my mountainbike in the car and that wouls have been impossible in a car with a regular trunk.

Here is a kinda bad thing about the Prius. I mention it because you said you thought about getting one for grocery runs. The gas mileage stinks when you only make short distance trips. The Prius wants to warm everything up for various good reasons but it also means that fuel economy suffers. Stinky gas mileage for a Prius is about 35 MPG. That was the gas mileage I got when only driving to the commuter lot for two weeks. So you would probably be disappointed when you didn't get 45+ MPG. Was I disappointed with 35 MPG? You bet.

Even if you are correct and we have plenty of oil -- it is still over $4 a gallon and that just stinks when you have a family and they would rather spend the gas money on something else. One thing that isn't limitless -- our income.

I personally apologize if I wrote anything spiteful -- no excuses. I personally don't think you would enjoy buying a Prius so further posts would just be a sign that you just want to rile up some Prius owners that like their cars as much as you seem to like your truck.

Cheers

 

I got into this thread a little late. I just wanted to add a fact about SAFETY as I witnessed this first hand. Back in the year 2000 I was driving a tiny little 1997 Eagle Talon (its the exact same car as a Mitsubishi Eclipse if you are not familiar with it.) and I ran into a "Full Size" Chevy Silverado offset frontal crash. My front bumper needed replaced and my hood needed a slight dent popped and repainted. The Silverado was toast completely buckled up the front end into the wheel well. The driver of the truck was female and told me she hurt her knees but was ok and did not need medical attention, I had no injuries and I was able to drive my car home that day hers needed towed. To add to this how safe is that truck if it takes on damage like this at only 25 MPH as neither of our airbags even were set off by this collision.

I used to own a small Chevy S-10 p/u as a secondary vehicle that I actually bought by trading a weed eater for it (yes I'm a hillbilly currently living in Ohio, but formerly of Texas). I only ever used it to haul anything a handful of times like when I bought a new TV, Dryer, and a christmas tree or to help out a few friends move other then that it just sat in my driveway because I found it a waste to drive even at 22 MPG. Its unfortunate that the OP is the type of American that thinks its his/her god given right to be as wasteful as they want to be. I wonder if you figured out yet that the dirty looks that you get are because of the dirty looks you give the hybrid owner because you are mad about gas prices and that they are not suffering like you out of your denial that we live in a different world then before.

 

The only terminology I know is groundpounder, that referred to the US Armys' basic soldier. Devil Dogs, what is the significance?

 

Well, I'm leaving tomorrow on business, should be back in about a week

It's obvious the folks at the Dodge Cummins website believe they are right, and we are wrong. Of course, we believe we are right, and they are wrong.

I find it insulting and embarassing the language used at the Cummins forum. Refering to people as fags, queers, treehuggers, etc. If it was a private site, requiring a userid and password just to view the board, that would be their business

As anybody on the planet can view that site, especially the rantings, it only reinforces the negative opinion the rest of the world has against Americans in general, and Texans in particular

If somebody wants to believe every driver of a small car is a "treehugging fag," well it's a Free Country and that is their right to do so. Here in Canada, that might fall under the Hate Crimes Legislation and the site could be shut down.

If somebody wants to quote and believe thoroughly discredited "research" about the Prius (Life of traction battery, cost of traction battery, "damage" to Sudbury that actually happened +50 years ago, etc) that is also their business and their right.

However, again that only serves to reinforce a lot of the negative sterotypes regarding Americans: lack of quality public education system, ignorance/hatred of any viewpoint not specifically supporting their own, the world "owes" them, etc

I had to bring up some very harsh but true facts regarding oil subsidies that Canadian taxpayers are forced to apply - under NAFTA - to ensure the United States has a relatively cheap supply of oil. I'm sure I offended every American on PriusChat.

Well, it also offends Canadians when Americans have a remarkable ignorance of basic science, geopolitical events, trade treaty facts, and diplomacy. I'd withdraw my harsh comments, but only if the folks at the Cummins site do likewise. I don't see that happening, considering the flavor of the arguements there

A concern for every American should be the simple fact that a country that makes up a bit less than 5% of the global population, cannot continue to expect to consume 40% of global petroleum production. That equation isn't balanced. It's easy enough to believe that you deserve more than the rest of the world, even resort to calling them names: chinks, gooks, sand ni**ers, ni**ers, etc etc

It's also easy to blame Machiavellian conspiracies on things like high fuel prices, mortgage crisis, etc. It has been my experience that if you want to find the *true* source of most problems, go look in a mirror. Too bad, so sad, deal with it

If I were still living in the US, a particular concern I would have is if OPEC decides to go off greenbacks and start pricing in Euro's. There is a lot of talk about that recently. Currency collapse - or "hyperinflation" - has happened in other countries, no reason why it can't happen in the US

I could go on about why cheap credit is so bad, why nobody really deserves a vehicle or a house they can't afford to pay cash for, but that could also turn mean and ugly.

So let's move this to FHOP, and if anybody is still bothering to post in a week, I will continue participating, but with the mean and hurtful opinions toned down

 

Wow! I'm not sure what to make of this except that these are two drivers who have very different opinions and they are willing to badmouth and threaten/challenge each others opinions on a public forum for all to read. :wacko:

My main forums of choice are The Cummins Forum and The Diesel Garage as these two forums give me the information or at least a starting place for much of what I have questions about-specificaly my 2008 Dodge.

Now I'm reading posts from a Cummins Forum member as he spills his opinions and attitude here on the prius site. :rain: Then I continue reading and find that the Prius members who are responding to him seem to feel that the rest of us who drive larger vehicles have the same opinions/attitudes of Prius (or simular) owners. :blabla: I hope I don't come accross on these forums like that. And now to top it all off, we get into a patriotic discussion (term used loosely).:faint:

Ultimately we all make our decisions based on what we need or can afford and to serve the purposes/needs we have. Some buy trucks to do the job they need while others choose to drive more efficient vehicles such as those on this forum. It wouldn't suprise me to find some Prius owners who own a full size truck (maybe even a diesel :spy: ).

I don't own a Prius. I don't plan on owning a Prius. It won't do what I need a vehicle to do. You folks enjoy your vehicles. I'll enjoy mine.

I hope this forum is bennificial to you the way many of the posts on the forums I frequent have benifitted me.

 

I agree with much of what you said, in fact many of the Prii owners here own sports cars, luxury cars, classic muscle cars, pickup trucks, and SUV's. The point is that Prius owners in general are just like the drivers of all other vehicles. Most of us bought the vehicle because it met our wants and needs for a daily driven car. To most of us including myself fuel economy has always been a very important feature of a vehicle. Even when I was able to buy gas for .89 cents a gallon just 9 or 10 years ago it was important to me. When you select a car / truck there are always trade-offs unfortunately it usually looks like this.
Fuel economy or more horsepower
fuel economy or better handling and performance
fuel economy or more towing capacity

Everything about a truck is tuned completely against fuel economy.

High gas prices are apparently starting to hurt alot of us american guys feelings because having our pickup trucks is what really makes us a man.

 

Jayman, You can be assured that your knowledge and opinions are highly valued here on Priuschat.

 

+1

 

Great first post to PC. I think most of us agree with you.

 

If only that were the case. The problem is that a large segment of the population bases their decision on an irrational or psychologically erroneous basis that is resulting in harm to the environment and others. This is of course reinforced by advertising paid by car companies.

If you must buy a fuel inefficient vehicle like an SUV or pickup it should be as a last rational resort. Not because of irrational "patriotism" (by definition nationalism) or a false psychological need to display masculinity or financial worth.

 

Oh please, the "friendly" press is full of stories accounting that many, many Prius owners bought them in order to show off their environmental responsibility to their neighbors. That is no more a rational or responsible basis than the ones you so malign.

True enough, modern practice of economic thought is full of work on elements of the human decision process that don't fit the classic utility maximization model of economics. But it applies across the board, not just to those one despises.