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Help! Front 12 Volt outlet not working

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Audio and Electronics' started by Rick Grahn, Jun 25, 2008.

  1. Rick Grahn

    Rick Grahn New Member

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    Okay, I plugged in a DC:AC power converter into the front 12 volt outlet to power a charger for a small item. I also had my DVD play running off of the wires going to that DC power outlet. After a short time, it behaved as if I had blown a fuse...neither the 12 volt outlet nor the DVD player worked.
    I checked the front 12 volt mini-fuse under the steering wheel and it "looked" fine.

    Is there another in-line fuse or a relay of some kind I could have messed up or is it just that the mini-fuses may be blown but it not be obvious?

    Any help would be appreciated.

    Rick
     
  2. bbald123

    bbald123 Thermodynamics Law Enforcement

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    Check the fuse with an ohm meter. Odds are it's not fine.
     
  3. Rick Grahn

    Rick Grahn New Member

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    I checked the fuse, it was fine, but I replaced it anyway. Still no power to the front 12 volt outlet.

    Any other ideas?
    Is there an in-line fuse somewhere that is not obvious?
    Please help!

    Thanks everyone!
     
  4. bbald123

    bbald123 Thermodynamics Law Enforcement

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    There are often fuses in the plugs that go into the outlet. It's possible, but improbable, that the current got high enough to take out a wire or connector before the fuse blew.

    There are several places offering wiring diagrams: prius wiring diagram - Google Search

    And you can always use the Toyota Technical Information System to order a copy: https://techinfo.toyota.com
     
  5. DaveinOlyWA

    DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!!

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    well after 4 years (actually its been 4 years and 2 days!!) of driving a Pri... the only real problem i have had was the front 12 volt plug. in the old days, i was using a Mac Laptop with Route 66 mapping software and a portable BT GPS unit for my navigation needs. couple that with my cellphone and ipod plugged in, on paper anyway, i was drawing less than half of the max. but i blew a fuse. it was not an inline fuse, it was in the fuse panel under the dash that needed replacing.
     
  6. Rick Grahn

    Rick Grahn New Member

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    Any other suggestions? Does anyone know if there is another fuse in-line or a relay of some sort that I may have damaged?

    Thanks,
    RJG
     
  7. DougSlug

    DougSlug Member

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    Rick,

    There are two fuses in the driver side junction box, one labeled "PWR OUTLET" and "PWR OUTLET FR", both of which are involved in getting power to the outlet. The one labeled "PWR OUTLET" controls the Power Outlet Relay, the contacts of which connects power through the "PWR OUTLET FR" fuse to the front outlet #1. The Power Outlet Relay also appears to be located in the same junction box. I'm getting this from the wiring diagrams; I haven't looked in my Prius yet.

    How did you determine that you are not getting 12V to the outlet? Do other 12V devices plugged into that outlet work? There could be a fuse in the inverter that also blew. You usually get it out by unscrewing the tip where the spring loaded pin is. If the Prius' fuses was good and other devices work, then it's definitely the fuse built into the inverter, or the inverter failed altogether.

    By "inverter" I mean the DC-AC converter you plugged in, not the main three-phase high voltage inverter under the hood!

    - Doug
     
  8. Rick Grahn

    Rick Grahn New Member

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    Thanks Doug. I've checked both fuses in the fuse box near driver's left knee. Both are okay.

    I wonder what the power outlet relay is.

    FYI, the outlet in the center counsole works fine. I have tried several devices in the front one and none work.

    Any other ideas anyone?

    RJG
     
  9. Rick Grahn

    Rick Grahn New Member

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    Doug (and others),
    I found another symptom: The window up down switch for the drivers side window has the word "auto" written on it. I never noticed it before but at night it is lit (the word "auto"). I just noticed that the light for the word is going off and on (2-3 times every 5 seconds or so). Also, when all is quiet, I hear a clicking sound coming from what seems to be under the dash). The more I think about it, the more I am wondering if it is a relay. can you tell me exactly where the relay is for the power outlet ("The Power Outlet Relay also appears to be located in the same junction box. I'm getting this from the wiring diagrams")? There are some smaller boxes on the fuse box...could it be one of them? I wonder what other things are not working that I do not know about?
     
  10. DougSlug

    DougSlug Member

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    I re-read your original post, and I noticed something I missed the first time. You say that the DVD player was running off the wires that go to the outlet. Does that mean you tapped into wires behind the panel? If so, depending on where you tapped, there might be other fuses involved, or perhaps you disturbed the wiring to the outlet somehow, and it eventually failed.

    The fact that it's totally dead while the fuses are OK is confusing. When that happens, I start suspecting connector problems. If you can, take a close look at all wire connections and contacts inside and behind the outlet (I haven't done this, so I don't know how hard it is--just applying basic troubleshooting steps here). The fact that the center console still works strongly suggest a problem with either the "PWR OUTLET FR" fuse, the Power Outlet Relay, or the connector itself.

    The Power Outlet Relay might be involved, although, assuming you didn't tap to something "outside" the protection of the fuses (if you even tapped at all--I'm presuming here pending your reply), the relay would have been designed to handle a load up to what the fuse is rated for. On the other hand, if your tap somehow shorted, and it is tied into another circuit, you would have blown the fuse for that circuit for sure, and it might not be obvious from the name which circuit that could be. A general inspection of fuses with an ohmmeter is in order.

    Upon further inspection of the diagrams, the Power Outlet Relay appears to be located further up and deeper inside the far left side of the dash relative to the fuse box.

    You might want to sign up for access to the Toyota Technical Information System (http://techinfo.toyota.com), where you can download wiring diagrams.

    Let me know how you make out.

    - Doug
     
  11. DougSlug

    DougSlug Member

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    Rick,

    I just saw your new post--my previous reply didn't take that new information into account.

    I haven't tried looking for the relay in question, but a more important question is why that relay failed in the first place.

    I'll look some more in the wiring diagrams using your new input, and I'll wait for your reply from my previous post.

    - Doug
     
  12. Rick Grahn

    Rick Grahn New Member

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    Thanks again, Doug.
    I did tap into the front power outlet wires to provide the DVD power just prior to them entering the power outlet. I visually inspected the outer connections of those the other day, but did not look closely. I will reinspect.

    Is there any connection between the light on the driver's window switch lighted "auto" word and the front power outlet?

    Maybe its tribbles?

    Rick
     
  13. smittylube

    smittylube Junior Member

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    I bought an ' 05 used- the front did not work - as you did, I suspected the fuse to be bad.. However upon investigating I found the connection at the socket to be bad. Check with a test light or voltmeter or plug in something- then reach behind it & push on the connector to see if it will work.

    Steve
     
  14. DougSlug

    DougSlug Member

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    You got a tricky one here, Rick.

    I tried to see how the window switch illumination was tied to the power outlet, and there isn't anything apparent that wouldn't cause other things to malfunction as well. Have you surveyed your electrical system to find out if anything else is affected? The fact that the little light goes on means that the fuse isn't blown. The clicking certainly sounds like a relay--like some kind of intermittent connection that isn't bad enough to pop the fuse. It doesn't seem like a relay is bad, but that there is something on the coil side that is bypassing the signal that normally controls it to another voltage source.

    It's also possible that these things are not related. I hate when that happens, because you try to find the commonality between them when there isn't one, and it leads you in circles and teases you with logical impossibilities.

    If they are related, my bet is that your tap has something to do with it. If they are not related, my money is on a faulty socket, especially after reading smittylube's post, but then I have no idea yet what might be causing the window switch issue.

    I'm just as anxious to find out what it is as you are! I tend to file these things away in my mind for future use (as an electrical engineer I often have to troubleshoot things like this). We tend to learn more from failures than from successes, right? I know...not much consolation when it's your car that's messed up.

    Good luck and keep us posted.

    - Doug
     
  15. Rick Grahn

    Rick Grahn New Member

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    Thanks Doug (and others).
    I may have to take it in. The connection is (I think) good. I think it is an issue before the connection as the DVD player gets its power from the same wires going to the socket...and it has no power either.

    Thanks anyway everyone!
     
  16. longterm

    longterm Member

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    Your solution is under the hood. There's a box under there that has the fuse you want.

    bob
     
  17. Rick Grahn

    Rick Grahn New Member

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    Thanks Bob. Can you give me any other hints? I know of the fuse box that is in the engine compartment at the 1:00 position (as you face the hood of the car from the front). Is that the box? Which fuse is it?

    Any additional help would be appreciated.

    Rick
     
  18. Rick Grahn

    Rick Grahn New Member

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    UPDATE:
    Apparently there is another fuse specific to the front power outlet deep in the dash behind the steering wheel. It is a 15 amp fuse. That was the one that was blown in my situation. Toyota service replaced it (fuse=$1.50, labor=$52.00). Relays were fine. Fuses/relays by driver's left knee and in both fuse/relay boxes in the engine compartment were fine.

    ...Just in case this happens to anyone else, this info will be "searchable."
     
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  19. bbald123

    bbald123 Thermodynamics Law Enforcement

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    Rick, Thanks muchly for this follow-up. Follow-ups are a great service to the community!
     
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  20. texdon

    texdon New Member

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    Rick, I have a brand NEW 08 and the console outlet works but the front outlet does not, just like yours. I only plugged in Magellan Nav in both

    Can a "normal" person find this fuse or is it a tear into the dash dealer has to find it fuse? Would it be covered under warranty?

    Thanks for your help!