mobil 1 0w-20 vs 0w-30 ??

Great post Jayman. When they tinted my car they must have did the radio only thing and killed my battery but I never thought of the "motor magically turning off so they then drained the oil out" scenario. Wow that could easily happen.Maybe even at the dealer.
Thanks alot for that. Your brief simple post should be a sticky.

 

Way to go I have Sure Drain on all my cars (and have bought a couple of spares off eBay as this is not made any more, apparently). Only drawback - drains very slowly. Last weekend it took may be 15 minutes to drain the 6 Qt in my Mazda MPV van, now sold to a happy new owner... Not a real issue, as I usually let it drain in the evening and come back in the morning or just do something else in the mean time. The plus is there is no "splash" and drips around the pan due to a strong flow down. And the drain rate tends to vary b/w units, but none has been very fast...

 

For what its worth when I changed my oil at 900 miles to Mobil One I used 10-30 because I had a case of it. I changed it at 6000 to Mobil One 5-30 and did for 2 days gain 2 mpg's but has settled back down to its av of 48 mpg's that its been at for about 3 months.

 

a quick question for you all..............

i am a proud one month or so owner of my 08 prius now!!! i've got about 2,500 miles and i'm about to have my first oil change. i am INSISTING on Mobil 1 synthetic, but i cannot find 0-20W anywhere around here. i checked walmart, pep boys and target.................so i settled for Mobil 1 "5-20".

will this be ok? will i get less engine protection? will my mileage suffer? will all be ok?

thanks in advance for your help!

cheers

:flame:

 

Just stick with the recommended 5w30, the 0w will only show any benefit in extreme cold climates. My biggest concern with the 5w20 is that it is thinner and with my thinking is that perhaps with the Prius it may run back into the oil pan quicker then a 5w30 which could perhaps be a problem with the way the engine stops.

 

thanks morpheusx,

you're always there like a wing man! the reason i asked this was that the service manager said that the "tolerances" on the 2008's are much closer and tighter than the previous years. now if that's BS, oh well. that's what he said.

then again, to humor everyone here, i called my dealer yesterday and asked one of the "SENIOR" service reps there.......what weight of Mobil 1 Synthetic would he recommend and his response was.........and I quote........

since the gas engine in the prius does not run all the time, usage of the synthetic motor oil can cause the engine to MISFIRE..............

i said HUH??????????? what does motor oil have to do with an ignition-like problem???????

he said that he's seen it happen............

interesting ha?

:crazy::flame:

 

What is this fascination with second-guessing the engine's design engineers? To avoid any fuss about warranty repairs they require 5W-30 and 5000 miles/six months interval. Do that.

 

Nonsense. Otherwise we'd see the side of the road littered with broken down Honda's and Fords. Ok, with the Ford, at least it wasn't the fault of the oil

 

Oh god, I need a drink, maybe 3 of them

Don't you just love how these people make it up right on the spot? Print out that pdf I posted of the viscosity requirements in Spain and Japan, see what he has in response. SHould be a good lie though

 

Richard

These same "design engineers" call for a 12 month or 10,000 mile oil change interval in the EU. With a wide range of viscosity from 5W-30 to 20W-50

Except in Japan, where the same Prius as our models "requires" a range of viscosity from 0W-20 to 10W-30

 

As you and others have pointed out the oils available in Europe and Japan are made to higher standards than in the US. That probably has some bearing on the different warranty requirements.

 

I think that a lot of people have the misconception that a 0W oil somehow won't protect the engine as well as a 5W oil. You need to look at the 30 number in 5W-30 or 0W-30 - that is the rating at operating temp. So, both of those oils have the viscosity of a 30 weight oil at operating temp.

The advantage of a 0W oil is that it flows better at cold temps and therefore can protect your engine better when cold. You may also see a mileage increase in cold temps.

I realize that Jayman already posted this, but maybe if it gets repeated a few times, it will start to sink in.

BTW, I have been using M1 5W-30 but M1 0W-30 is now available for the same price in the WalMart 5qt jug. So I bought 0W-30 for the next oil change. On the jug, Mobil states that 0W-30 meets or exceeds all requirements for 5W-30.

I think if you are trying to decide between 0W-20 or 0W-30, you need to consider the temps you are likely to see in your local area. Where I live, it is not uncommon to see 105°F in the summer and we almost never see temps below freezing, so I am going to stick with 30 weight.

 

Yes, the SAE J300 covers this in painful detail. No matter if a 0W-30, 5W-30, 10W-30, or straight 30, all must test at a certain range using the test apparatus. The test temp is +100 C.

There is also a high temp, high shear test, performed at +150 C and 10 ^ 6 shears, sec. There are different requirements for oils rated in the "30" vs "40"

At the other end, the SAE J300 tests oils using a mini rotary viscometer, or MRV. THe J300 has requirements for all oils rated "0W," "5W," "10W," "15W," etc. The J300 sets a MRV limit of 60,000 cP at every cohort, eg 0W is -40 C

Note, the military Arctic oil specification, MIL-L-46167, is far more conservative, setting a MRV limit of 30,000 cP. The specially blended military oils, intended for turbodiesel use in stationary and mobile applications, are 0W-20 with a few qualified 0W-30. No COTS product meets this very tough spec

What the SAE doesn't cover, which the European ACEA (Association des Constructeurs Européens d'Automobiles) actually *does* cover, is long term shear and viscosity control in long term use.

At one time, an API oil could either thicken 500% in use, or shear up to two grades. Now SM/GF-4 is tighter, but still quite a ways behind the ACEA specs.

As I have stated in other posts, only a used oil analysis will guide your choice of oil type and viscosity. An oil that works for me may not work for you, due to vehicle design or climate. There is no such thing as a truly universal motor oil that does all things, in all seasons. We're close, but no see-gar

 

Perfect point on the last 2 posts.

People need to stop thinking of oil as "thinning" but in fact reach their designated thickness at 100C. Oil "thickens" as it cools so ANY oil we use in our cars is too thick at starting temps. This reality hold true even for those that start their cars on 75F mornings. Why? Because our oil doesn't properly lube our engines until it reaches 100C.

So when comparing oils, think of a 0W-30 as "thickening" less than a 5W-30, and a 5W-30 "thickening" less than a 10W-30. But all three (0W/5W/10W) will thin, as designed, to the proper viscocity at 100C.

Given that, I really don't see the point of using a 5W-30 synthetic when 0W-30 is priced equally and protects better.

 

What you guys write is plausible, but can any of you show us where Toyota states that one can use something other than 5W-30 in a Prius in North America?

 

Nope. The API would prefer if the sheeple just use either 5W-30 or 5W-20 (Ford, Honda, etc), preferably changed 2-6 times more often than EU cars to help out the Iffy Loob places

Odd how in the EU, the manuals cover a wide range of viscosity depending on ambient temps. Although a conventional 5W-30 may be appropriate in moderate conditions, it certainly is far too thick at -30 C and colder.

Remember that I had very odd used oil analysis readings, which I finally tracked to the absolute crap bulk dealer oil. Toyota Canada blamed my use of Mobil 1, even stating that my engine warranty could be voided

Once I presented proof of the "recommended" oil causing the issue, Toyota very quickly STFU.

I can see if any individual tries something silly, like using a 20W-50 in the dead of winter. But otherwise, at normal operating temps, a 30, 0W-30, 5W-30, and 10W-30 have the same viscosity

When Toyota got burned by sludged motors, it wasn't because of any difference in viscosity. It was because of 7,500 mile intervals and absolute crap bulk oil

 

Actually, in the owner's manual, they allow either 5W-30 or 10W-30, but they state that if you use 10W-30, you should change back to 5W-30 at the next oil change.

Again, 0W-30 will provide the same hot viscosity as 5W-30, the difference is that it does not thicken as much at cold temps. The viscosity range for 0W-30 exceeds the viscosity range for 5W-30, so that Mobil states on the packaging that 0W-30 meets or exceeds all requirements for 5W-30.

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_0W-30.aspx

 

Toyota uses the word "recommends 5W-30", not "requires 5W-30". In the Prius manual, Toyota is not requiring the use of synthetic oil so a 5W-30 would provide the "best " results for a normal oil. 0W-30 does not exists in a non-synthetic oil. Richard, Toyota would have to explicitely state that a 0W-30 is not recommended or more specifically would void your warranty. It doesn't. However, Mobil does put it in writing.

This is right from their FAQ section of the website:

Will using these products void my warranty if my owner’s manual recommends 5W-30 motor oil in my engine?
If your car maker recommends a SAE 5W-30 ILSAC oil (starburst), we recommend either Mobil 1 5W-30 or Mobil 1 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy, which provides the high temperature protection of 5W-30 oils while offering improved fuel economy. You will not void your warranty.

 

Oops I missed that. Correct on your points raised