6m/8K oil change ?

Actually it's every six months or 5k miles (= 8k km), which ever comes first. I've read that this is because American oil standards are lower than Japanese and European oil standards, or maybe Toyota is overly consrvative. But don't fret about this. Changing the oil is the only significant periodic maintenance item on a Prius and ignoring their schedule is a silly reason to put the warranty at risk. Overall, Prius maintenance is quite cheap.

Err, what "maintenance plan"? Don't let a dealer sell you any pre-paid maintenance snake oil. These are usually grossly overpriced. Read and follow the owner's manual and the scheduled maintenance guide from Toyota; they will save you money and bother.

 

It's not a technical issue. Toyota was burned in the US by sludge (and failed engines) in some Camrys. Since then they have been very conservative in oil change specs in the US. If you want to maintain your warranty, follow the rules.

JeffD

 

Do all the maintenance interval checks have to be done by Toyota service to honor the warranty or can some things be done by the owner (oil, filters, etc.)?

 

Check this out, http://priuschat.com/forums/file-library/27820-uoa-used-oil-analysis.html

Many people have gone over 10k intervals with synthetic oil.

 

You can do the oil and filter yourself but you need to keep the receipts as evidence if needed for a warranty dispute. I don't know about inspection items. Personally I'd hate to fight with Toyota about it and so will have a dealer do it to avoid any possible problem.

 

The Prius operated in the EU has a normal 12 month or 10,000 mile oil service interval. That's now considered a frequent interval in the EU, with a lot of cars offering up to 24 months or 30,000 mile oil service intervals

As others have stated, Toyota got burned by sludged up motors, ironically serviced at the then-standard 7,500 mile interval. The API/ILSAC standards are crap, the ACEA standards are far stricter

I suppose if you did oil samples and proved to Toyota everything was ok, they could still deny warranty if you exceeded their precious 6 month/5,000 mi oil change interval

That said, when my strange used oil analysis was pinpointed to the cheap no-name dealer bulk oil that was *contaminated* Toyota Canada suddenly hushed up

 

I'm up to 7500mi on Mobil1 and the analysis came back with plenty of life left. If oil use is your primary concern, start using synthetic and pay to get it analyzed to cover any warranty concerns.

 

Since 1979, I have been changing my oil every 3000 miles. I do it myself, along with rotating the tires every other oil change. It may seem excessive, but I had a 1997 Avalon, the one that had problems with engine sludge (presumably secondary to the recommended 5000 mile change), and I never had a problem because of the frequency of my changes (It had 159,000 miles on it when I traded it in for the Prius.). I heard a service manager (in 1997), recently back from a training session in which they discussed oil, say that oil begins to break down after 1500 miles. If this is true, what is it about modern engines, or modern oil, that is different? How can a vehicle go 20,000 miles without a change? Both my Toyotas now have a 5000 mile recommended change interval. Will someone please convince me this is ok!

 

Again, used oil analysis.... http://priuschat.com/forums/file-library/27820-uoa-used-oil-analysis.html

We have plenty of PCers using synthetic and get over 10k miles per change. Good oil and filter will get you there, used oil analysis reports support that.

 

ScottY: I looked at the UOA. IF I understand it, it is an analysis of used oil. It tells of the levels of contamination in the oil after X-number of miles. How do I translate that info into the durability of the oil to reduce friction and the "wear and tear" on the engine?

 

Robert, if the oil starts to degrade and stop protecting the engine, the wear metal will start showing up in the report. Toward the bottom of Blackstone UOA reports, there's a table listed the spec for this oil (viscosity, flash point, TBN, etc.). That gives you an idea of how the oil is holding up. TBN is important too, they can explain it better than I can, Blackstone Laboratories - Do I Need a TBN?

UOA doesn't just report how the oil and engine is doing, it can indicate other problems. For example, if Si (silicon) starts to show up, meaning dirty/sand is in the oil sample. It might be time to change the air filter. Check out their website if you want to understand a bit more about UOA, Blackstone Laboratories - Gasoline Diesel Report Expl.

 

I do 1 year 10K miles on synthetic

on all my cars with Mobil 1 synthetic oil and filter. I droppedd the pan on my Camry (known for "sludge" issue) at 120K miles and there was not a drop of sludge in there and all was sparkling clean. The car still runs like new too and i do not baby it that much (evidenced by my failed auto transmission at 120K miles).

I see no reason why the Prius can't go even longer on good oil and filter.

Every 3K is such a waste and the "cheap" conventional oil presumably used for such frequent changes offers significantly less protection than quality synthetic.

Oil analysis is the only way to tell for sure though and I've never done it - just rely on others who've done that and have proven that there is enough life in good oil to support my change interval safely.

 

What does using a good synthetic/filter at 10K mile changes do to your warranty? Will toyota consider you under warranty?
I drive 30K miles a year and will do my own changes. The longer interval will help with the change time.
I'm a firm believer in the benefits of synthetic oil...been using it in all my other vehicles for 10+ years. I would probably stay with synthetic at 5k miles if I was required to...at least till I was out of warranty.

 

If you did not follow Toyota's schedule and subsequently need a warranty repair which could conceivably be related to that schedule, you could be forced to argue with Toyota about it. I would not want to be in that position. Following their schedule is a small cost.

 

Oil technology today is much, much different than it was in 1979. The oil base stocks are better, the additives to reduce wear are better, and the detergent additives are better. Plus, there is a lot of other stuff in the oil, that I dont understand.

There are a lot of factors that go into determining the appropriate oil change interval besides what is "best" for the engine.

-How often can we get the customer into the dealer to upsell them on some other service.

-Can we count on the customer to check the oil level and top-up as necessary between changes?

-Will our customers complain about the high cost of synthetic oils?

-Do we want to have different oil change intervals for different vehicles in our line-up

Synthetic oils last longer than regular oils. Period. They also provide some added benefits. Period. However, the question remains as to what is the perfect oil change interval for what oil. Also will your engine last longer with synthetic oil and longer oil changes or dino oil with short oil change intervals. How much does it bother you to change your oil more often? It is all a trade off and a personal decision.

As far as warranty. If you have a problem and Toyota thinks it is due to your improper maintenance they have to prove that. Although you still could be in for a long battle. Also, just because you are right does not mean you will win.

I do longer OCI's and I analyze every sample because it is a hobby for me. Plus I use out of spec oil (5W20) because I think it is better than 5W30 oil. Plus, it is a Toyota and we all know that they never break.

 

I do not really care what it does to my warranty. My warranty is long gone and even if I abuse my car I doubt the engine will be the thing to fail, thus my oil change habits won't matter. I am virtually sure there will be no oil-related trouble due to this interval and it is up to Toyota to prove that any damage was caused by my oil change pattern. How do I know? I do my own changes and monitor the condition of my oil - if I see signs of trouble I will change it sooner than the 10K. I've done that with some conventional oils that looked thicker and nastier after only 3K miles and have since vowed not to use the "cheap stufff" again.

FYI, the Toyota Camry ('00 in my case) manual recommends 7,500 mile oil change interval in "normal" conditions and they do not say "use synthetic". I see no reason to go to follow the alternative "severe" 5,000K schedule.

With the Prius that revs-up only to about 5K rpm and seldom goes there anyway, the protection the oil gives would be much more extended and IMO limited more by time than mileage. I base my i10K miles/1 year interval on research (oil analysis done by others) and it fits my habits well - I do one or at most two oil changes a year.

I will only accept an argument that shorter intervals are needed if someone shows evidence that this improves anything other than "peace of mind due to blissful ignorance" (no offence meant here, just referencing that many are recommending shorter intervals without citing any factual data that supports it).

 

The engine in the Prius is not one of the models know for sludge. The Toyota sludge engines were V6's that were on some Camry's.

 

If you use your own oil&filter change intervals (such as 10k miles on synthetic), and if you have an engine failure within the warrranty period. Toyota might attempt to not honor the warranty. That would be bad.

However, if you brought to the table a history of excellent used oil analyses, I am inclined to believe that you would prevail.

AFAIK the situation has not occurred with Prius. There may not yet been any cases of engine failure w/in warranty, except for a couple of catastrophic engine oil losses. Perhaps our Galaxee has heard of others?

The reason I like synthetic, 10k intervals, and UOAs is that you get good engine protection and all that serial UOA data, all for about 0.5 cents per mile (more if you pay someone else to do the changing). Conventional oil on 5K intervals with no UOA costs about half as much.

So I tend to turn the cost question around - do you really want to save 1/4 cent per mile, develop engine varnish on non-contact surfaces (dino oils do that) and *not* have all that UOA data on *your* engine? It is your choice, really.

A very good Prius mechanic (Erick Faust) in the yahoo groups recommends against changing to synthetic oil post-warranty. There is a risk that the precedent engine varnish can be mobilized, and block the filter or oil pick-up screen. This is a very interesting point. It would certainly not prevent me from considering changing to synthetic oil sooner. In the case of my Prius I did so at 42k miles, and the engine was not yet 'varnished' at that point.