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Toyota doing its part to help the US economy?

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by malorn, Dec 27, 2007.

  1. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

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    Remember the ads where toyota claims it is doing its small part to keep the US eceonomy strong? Here is toyota's contribution to the US trade deficit if it is looked at as a separate country.
    ...........Exports..........Imports..............Surplus/Deficit............Total Trade
    China$55,200,000,000..$287,800,000,000..($232,600,000,000)..343,000,000,000 -67.81%
    Japan..$60,000,000,000..$148,100,000,000..($88,100,000,000)..208,100,000,000 -42.34%
    Canada..$230,600,000,000..$303,000,000,000..($72,400,000,000)..533,600,000,000 -13.57%
    Mexico..$134,000,000,000..$198,300,000,000..($64,300,000,000)..332,300,000,000 -19.35%
    Germany..$41,000,000,000..$89,100,000,000..($48,100,000,000)..130,100,000,000 -36.97%
    *Toyota..$991,315,904..$33,070,392,986..($32,079,077,082)..34,061,708,890 -94.18%
    Venezuela..$9,000,000,000..$37,200,000,000..($28,200,000,000)..46,200,000,000 -61.04%
    Nigeria..$2,233,500,000..$27,900,000,000..($25,666,500,000)..30,133,500,000 -85.18%
    Saudi Arabia..$7,639,500,000..$31,700,000,000..($24,060,500,000)..39,339,500,000 -61.16%
    Malaysia..$13,000,000,000..$36,500,000,000..($23,500,000,000)..49,500,000,000 -47.47%
    Italy..$12,600,000,000..$32,700,000,000..($20,100,000,000)..45,300,000,000 -44.37%Ireland..$8,516,000,000..$28,600,000,000..($20,084,000,000)..37,116,000,000 -54.11%
    Taiwan..$23,000,000,000..$38,200,000,000..($15,200,000,000)..61,200,000,000 -24.84%
    South Korea..$32,500,000,000..$45,800,000,000..($13,300,000,000)..78,300,000,000 -16.99%
    France..$24,200,000,000..$37,100,000,000..($12,900,000,000)..61,300,000,000 -21.04%
    United Kingdom..$45,000,000,000..$53,400,000,000..($8,400,000,000)98,400,000,000 -8.54%
    Brazil..$19,200,000,000..$26,366,700,000..($7,166,700,000)..45,566,700,000 -15.73%
    Singapore..$24,700,000,000..$17,768,100,000..$6,931,900,000 ..42,468,100,000 16.32%
    Netherlands..$31,000,000,000..$17,342,300,000..$13,657,700,000 ..48,342,300,000 28.25%
    source:census.gov
    *Toyota information is prorated as a % of total sales vs % of US automotive related trade with Japan
     
  2. DaveinOlyWA

    DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!!

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    so, we are taking percentage of sales and NOT considering the revenue provided to american workers building toyota products????

    sorry, man... but your spin aint making me dizzy enough to not see thru your garbage
     
  3. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

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    This shows the amount of each countries trade (deficit/surplus) with the United States. The only way toyota could minimize its deficit with the United States would be to produce a greater percentage of the cars/trucks/parts its sells in the US here or to export cars/truck/parts to Japan.

    A figure commonly used within the auto industry is that for every point of market share gained by Toyota, about 18,000 americans lose their livelyhood (net). Yes toyota now employs 38,000 workers in the United States but hundreds of thousands of americans lost their jobs in the process. Even if Toyota produced every vehicle in the United States, every part in the United States, and did all r&d in the United Staetes the profits(about $7-9 billion last fiscal) year would still go back to Japan.
     
  4. Steve-o

    Steve-o New Member

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    Let's assume for a minute that everything you are reporting is 100% true. What is your proposed solution? Pine over an imaginary car that GM may never build, and in the mean time, go out and buy a Tahoe Hybrid for $50k or $60k to get 16 MPG?

    I personally can not think of one car made by the big 3 that I would want to purchase, regardless of price. So what now?
     
  5. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

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    If the gnereal public knew of the situation as it now stands, toyota would sell between 500,000 and 1,000,000 less vehicles in 2008. Through some very clever and miss-leading marketing, many people think when they are buying that toyota it is just like buying a vehicle made by GM, Ford or Chrysler.
     
  6. finman

    finman Senior Member

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    hey, me too...nothing made by the domestics intrigues me...and many, many, many others in the US feel the same way. Just check the numbers.

    Thru very clever marketing, people actually think GM has better cars...and green at that! some even run on electricity and are available to the masses in large quantities for a low, low price. Wow. the wonders of the marketing department.
     
  7. DaveinOlyWA

    DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!!

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    forget that assumption...it is all misleading BS

    lets quote the OP

    *Toyota information is prorated as a % of total sales vs % of US automotive related trade with Japan


    i take that to mean all they look at is how many US based autos are sold in japan verses how many Toyotas are sold in the US.

    it does not take into account, how much of that revenue NEVER leaves the US in the first place. how much of that money is Toyota's built and sold in the US?

    betcha its more than a few bucks
     
  8. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

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    That means that the US auto-related deficit with Japan was over $58,000,000,000 in 2006. Toyota's share of vehicles imported from Japan was used to come up with the number. Even when toyota builds a vehicle in the US it still contributes to the trade deficit because many of the parts are sourced from Japan.

    Last year toyota sold 2.5 million vehicles in the United States. Imagine for a second that toyota sold 0 and the 2.5 million was equally divided between the Detroit 3. How many hundreds of thousands of Jobs would that create in the United states? Think about it.

    Think about it like this for a second: Toyota sold about 2.5 million vehicles in the US in 2006. Imagine for a second that toyota sold 0 and the 2.5 million was dispersed between the detroit 3. How many more factory, design, and engineering jobs would that creat in teh United States?
     
  9. Steve-o

    Steve-o New Member

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    You believe that Toyota could possibly see a 25% to 50% decrease in sales (using 2006 numbers of 2,220,090 cars sold in the US) if 'we' knew that it was a Japanese company who's profits went to Japan?

    I realize I am simplifying it, but I don't see the logic. I believe the vast majority of people who purchase a Toyota do so based on their reliability and availability of what people actually want, which in turn lead to a greater resale value. It just makes sense for me (and many others I assume) to buy a Toyota.
     
  10. Stev0

    Stev0 Honorary Hong Kong Cavalier

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    Hey, I have an idea! How about...oh, I know this is crazy talk, but it just might work: GM build a vehicle worth buying!
     
  11. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

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    Then why does toyota make these ads?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4Qr7wLTcA0

    Not just the profits, but in may cases almost the whole transaction amount(imports) goes out of this country. Honestly how misleading is this ad? Without looking it up, how many employees does toyota have in North America?
     
  12. DaveinOlyWA

    DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!!

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    say what??

    hahahaha....woooo hooo... hehehe!! wow now THAT is funny!!...


    good one StevO!! got any more ?
     
  13. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

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    Dave,
    If I remember right aren't you a police officer or some government officer? Do you worry about how your pension is funded? Maybe the Japanese or Chinese government will decide to fund it. Do you think public employees will be exempt from the coming economic storm?
     
  14. tleonhar

    tleonhar Senior Member

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    How about GM, Ford, and Chrysler building a larger percentage of their cars here??? Do ya get free tacos with that Suburban? kim chee with that Aveo? :p
     
  15. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

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    I know that is what everyone always falls back on(fresh from a toyota talking points brochure). Last time I was in a toyota showroom I was told point blank that GM and Ford build cars and trucks in Mexico and toyota builds them in the US. For the record i have mystery-shopped 5 times at a toyota store and 3 times I was told the exact same thing.

    GM, ford and Chrysler do build a very large percentage of their cars here. Here are the 2006 production numbers:

    ..............US..................Canada..............Mexico...........Japan............Total
    GM-----3,095,109...............795,800............508,817.......0,000,000........4,399,726
    Toyota--829,703............319,940..............34,666.........1,179,621..........2,363,930

    GM sold ..........4,065,341
    Toyota sold ....2,542,525
     
  16. tleonhar

    tleonhar Senior Member

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    So that's over 1 million vehicles that GM alone built offshore, they are a US company, right? Why then are they closing plants here while opening new facilities in other countries? Why is Ford closing their St Paul, MN assembly plant and building Fusions in Mexico? As a dealer, you know wellhow to read a VIN, Why is it that so many Ford, GM, and Chrysler products have VIN's starting with 3, or K, yet every Camry I see has a VIN starting with 1?
     
  17. DaveinOlyWA

    DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!!

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    oh no... not me... i have two small (very small) pensions one from Weyerhauser and one from Intel... i have very little worry of either companies' long term viability.

    with my current employer, i have a 401k in which i put in 18% they put in 2.5%, all of which is fully vested now. iow, i put little faith in ANY companies ability to make and keep promises more than a few years down the road and i have a long way to go to retirement
     
  18. Steve-o

    Steve-o New Member

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    That's 30% of GM's cars built in countries other than the US. And do you think that all of the parts that go into your Malibu are built in the US?

    The data you provided does nothing but negate this whole thread. Just mindless babble.
     
  19. malorn

    malorn Senior Member

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    Remember GM sells a sizable number of vehciles into canada and mexico. I am not sure how you can consider $33,000,000,000 deficit with a single company in one year that claims to be helping the american economy mindless babble? The United States is being fleeced and people like you do not think it is important? What happens when you lose your job? There is a huge correction coming.
     
  20. FL_Prius_Driver

    FL_Prius_Driver Senior Member

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    The Hybrid Malibu has a 2 mpg improvement over the conventional Malibu. A whole whopping TWO! Why just two mpg? Pulling this kind of joke on the consumer is not going to work out well for GM. Is this GMs best? I do not know of a single person who looks at trade deficit numbers before buying a car. Who wants to spend that kind of money on inferior engineering?

    The trade numbers are going to get a lot worse with this being the latest GM flagship car.