Featured Lots of turmoil in the automotive industry

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by Isaac Zachary, Dec 4, 2024.

  1. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    My intepretation (use your own judgment) from an EV perspective is: Volksagen IDs, Nissan Leafs and Ariyas, and Fiat 500e's, and some other EVs are possibly in a bit of trouble along with their parent companies that also produce a lot of ICE vehicles.

    Stellantis CEO Quits During Critical Period For The Automaker
    • Volkswagen wanting to close plants and lower wages and is being met with strikes in home country Germany.
    • Stellantis CEO quits while company is floundering,
    • Nissan CFO leaves while company may have only 12 months of funds to keep alive.
    There is likely going to be some major changes in the near future. Or this is just a bunch of hype to get our emotions stirred up. I guess we'll find out.

    I do wonder what this all means for EVs. It seems that Chinese EVs are doing well, whether you like them or not. Tesla is too, but is quite expensive still, for some of us at least. Is Chevy our only hope to have affordable EVs in the near future? I don't know, I can't foretell the future. I do hope there's a 4-seating Aptera that gets at least 15 miles a day on solar on sunny days and costs less than $20,000 brand new. Hey, I can dream can't I!?
     
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  2. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Gag. Thanks for the bad - latest news, since they own chrysler, which means their plugin minivan is what ... in trouble? .... which we own ?? .... & maybe even in more trouble in a few days away from release - their 100+ mile ev plug in massive pickup truck?
    Was looking forward to a test drive in it. 65-75mpg. 14k Lb towing capability. Just kill me already

    .
     
  3. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    Maybe they'll do better with a new CEO. Stellantis just got the approval for a $7 billion loan from the US government to make a deal with Samsung SDI for making another EV battery gigafactory.
    Stellantis, Samsung SDI Announce Plans to Build Second StarPlus Energy Gigafactory in the United States | Stellantis
     
  4. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    The world has pretty much become a destroyer of leadership heads, whether it be Toyota, USA, tesla, Nissan or somebody else.
    Carlos Ghosen - bringing Nissan out of trouble after 2 decade - was rewarded with arrest & had to sneak out of the country. Now the hammer falls on the Stellantis head.
    Depressingly strange times.
    .
     
  5. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    [​IMG]

    It's just getting started.
     
  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    stellantis really caught me off guard, since every other car around here seems to be a jeep, and they ain't cheap.
    hard to figure vdumb, dodn't trust everything i hear.
    nissan is a curious case, seem to be losing steam the last 5 or ten years or so
     
  7. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    I wonder if all this combating Chinese cars flops and legacy car manufacturers go bankrupt anyway.
    Stellantis jumped on the chip-shortage price jump train and never got off. They raised their prices by the greatest percent of all car manufacturers and never went back down. Now their dealers and customers are fed up.
     
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  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i wonder what it would cost china to bribe trump to remove tariffs
     
  9. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    It seems like China is already starting to fight fire with it's own fire even before the fire starts from the USA side.
    https://www.reuters.com/markets/commodities/china-bans-exports-gallium-germanium-antimony-us-2024-12-03/
    They are banning exports of certain minerals to make manufacturing chips and other tech harder in the USA.

    I guess that means they don't have any interest in negotiating. It's a trade war, and war is war.
     
    #9 Isaac Zachary, Dec 4, 2024
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2024
  10. 3PriusMike

    3PriusMike Prius owner since 2000, Tesla M3 2018

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    I wonder what the kill-ratio* per million miles will be for Aptera?

    * deaths in an Aptera compared to deaths they cause

    Mike
     
  11. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    Good question. I would venture a guess that if one were to buy a motorcycle that an Aptera is likely the safest motorcycle out on the roads. I would also venture a guess that a 4 seater Aptera, if one ever comes out, would be classified as a car with all car safety regulations applied.

    On the other hand, how many people die from smog? It's pretty hard to create more smog when your vehicle charges off of the sun directly, no need to buy a house and install solar panels.

    But like I said, hoping for a 4 seater Aptera that I can actually afford and is safe only a dream. Show me a car that's interesting and safe; I don't think such a car actually exists. Yes, if push comes to shove I will choose safety and economy over fun. My other dream is we abandon this crazy idea that we need vehicular transportation and just go back to walking everywhere. Unless one could make an air-cooled VW safe. That would be a fun car to drive if it still felt and looked like an original air-cooled VW.
     
  12. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Why buy & set up solar just to run a toaster, or just to run a ceiling fan. Oh i know .... because a whole house lets you use it on the whole shebang?

    Our Electric utility company (co-op) lets you invest in their EV Farms. That way members don't have the huge capital outlay necessary for setting up on their own home, but rather they pay monthly for its expansion. That way you get to use the juice on whatever Appliance you want, or all of your appliances .... even the transportation one's.
    .
     
    #12 hill, Dec 5, 2024
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2024
  13. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    I'd love to have solar on my home! But solar roofs aren't options for us apartment dwellers. I can't even get permission to install a small satellite dish. And no, I can't just move to another part of town where magically I can afford to live and be able to install solar on my home at the same time.

    As I've said many times before, if certain ways of doing things are a requirement to do it correctly (drive EV, install solar on roof, etc.) then in my case the only option is to just stop using motorized transportation or stop using electricity as I don't have the means to do what others state as "the only way" to do something.

    Yeah, I checked into that and my electric company no longer offers those. Besides, you're talking about pure practicality, which I get. But I was talking about a dream, the dream of merging practicality and fun together at the same time. Paying for environmental charity is a good thing, but not exactly something that puts a smile on one's face every day.

    I personally don't see a problem putting a solar panel on a vehicle that will use all the electricity that solar panel will offer. And before you go into "well, it's not at a proper angle" neither are home solar panels most of the time. How many people put their solar panels on pivots that point them towards the sun as the sun goes across the sky?
     
    #13 Isaac Zachary, Dec 5, 2024
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2024
  14. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    Motorcycles are usually based on the number of wheels - not the number of seats.
    Same as a Corvair?
    As a not-quite-a-motorcycle, an Aptera is still not a car - so I'm really not worried about some soccer mom OR wine mom putting her kids in one of them no matter how many seats they have.

    I have TWO motorcycles and I wouldn't own one because to me they have all of the disadvantages of a car (price, manuverability, visibility, performance, etc....) AND all of the disadvantages of a motorcycle (Death Trap safety rating, range, cargo capacity, high insurance.)

    There is a REASON that these things have only been a 'napkin drawing' since 2005.

    The 'war' didn't 'start' from the US side, some people may have said.
    We merely had a leader (that I voted against, BTW) who decided to fight BACK.
    Evidently his successor was either too cognitively impaired to notice or (perhaps!) he agreed with the action - based on the fact that our reciprocal trade actions are still in place.
    The latest action is a negotiating tool while we still have a squish at the helm.....IMO.
    YOUR mileage might vary.

    Remember the old saying.
    If you owe the bank $100 - the bank OWNS you.
    If you owe the bank $1000000000 - then you OWN the bank. ;)
    The ChiComms have a lot more to lose in a trade war than we do - and a LOT more exposure based on the balance sheets.

    Anyone old enough to remember when it was the Japanese that were going to take over the world???
    (AND THEY have a liberal democratic government!!!!)

    Yes. There will be changes - and YES - click-bait is still a 'thing.'
     
    #14 ETC(SS), Dec 5, 2024
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2024
  15. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    While obvious, that doesn't mean Aptera's next vehicle will have 3-wheels (if they ever come out with another vehicle). The future is unknown. And again, it's only a dream. Why? Because the rest of the cars out there are all basically the same. They are tablets on wheels, all shaped like marshmallows on a frying pan, with the only "fun" being they take off quickly to make the immature feel at home and they have internet connectivity.

    I'd prefer a unique vehicle. One that has class and feels like I'm driving it.
    • Stick shift.
    • Let me hear and feel the road and motor and suspension.
    • No automatic anything (except for safety).
    • Knobs and levers.
    • No power anything (except maybe for safety).
    • And NO touchscreens!
    But no, I don't think I'll ever own such a vehicle again, so I'm back to looking at the list of expensive transportation appliances that one of them will eventually be my next car.
     
  16. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    Having 1st heard of aptera in 2005 - & living close to their home base at the time (San Diego) - we'd go check out their dog & pony shows again & again & again. Can't tell you how many years they had our $500 deposit.
    Next year is what, a couple weeks away? It will be 2 decades since they first said they were coming to market.
    "next vehicle" ???
    really ???
    We are closer to ¼ a century of them delivering NOTHING - then we are closer to their beginning.
    .... not to burst anyone's balloon
    .
     
  17. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    You're not talking about a car, you're talking about 1970.

    Or possibly off-road vehicles.
     
  18. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    As I reiterated several times, it's only a dream. No, there will probably never be a second Aptera in our lifetimes. There may never be a first Aptera. :giggle:

    The Mini Cooper was pretty close until they dropped the manual transmission option. :p
    The same with the Mazda Miata/MX-5, except even fewer seats.

    Again I probably wouldn't buy one because of safety, reliability and economics.

    The Nissan Versa with stick shift is probably the closest thing to my brand new dream car. It is getting axed.

    No, not one fulfills my dreams completely.

    I kind of like the new Ford Bronco with manual shifter (including both crawler gear and low 4x4) and disconnectable front end sway bar.

    Would I buy one? No. They are way too expensive, and I don't need to go off-roading on anything other than my feet or a bicycle or a horse.
     
    #18 Isaac Zachary, Dec 5, 2024
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2024
  19. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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  20. Gokhan

    Gokhan Senior Member

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    Yep, I have been seeing these news.

    I think most of the problems have been caused by the car companies thinking that if they reduced the inventory, they could make more profit—something they deduced from the results during the supply-chain problems—which eventually backfired of them, as the consumers turned away from them. I had posted an article here about how the car-company CEOs were boasting about having found a new model that increased the profits through artificially reducing the inventory.

    Toyota still seems to be the most robust car company in the world, but they need to rethink their business model of limiting the inventory to artificially boost the prices, which will eventually backfire on them as well.
     
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