Featured Hybrids Hard On Engines

Twice a year:

• Spring - to get the condensate spoiled oil out. Higher temperature grade oil.
• Fall - to get the summer dust and debris oil out. Lower temperature grade oil.

Bob Wilson

 

Thermal cycling is old news but at least it’s coming from a respected engineer

 

yeah, i lived it. plug ins are even worse.

 

The guy in the video is complaining start/stops are hard on hybrids. So what. Big deal. Haven't PLUGIN hybrids eliminated most of that phenomena? Both of our plugin's manufacturers set their rigs up so that they primarily run on electrons only - for the entire day's typically usage. ICE doesn't run until the range of the battery expires - or if temps are well below freezing - or if the gas in the tank is approaching an age that it might be getting stale.
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most new cars has instituted the engine cut off function in their cars. That's really beating up those old school starters.

What does he have to say about that???

 

Do stop-start systems wear out your car's starter?
"But the main question most car buyers have about new stop-start systems is: won't they wear out my car's starter motor?

The answer is no."

"Automotive engineers don't use 'traditional' starter motors in these situations," he explained. "The starter used for stop-start systems combines several technologies

(1) The gear ratio from the starter-drive pinion to the flywheel ring gear is optimized to make the starter's motor turn more slowly. This can be done without materially changing the design of the transmission or flywheel at all on existing designs.

Crucially, this reduces starter-motor speed (in RPM), since 90 percent of starter-motor brush wear occurs not during cranking, but during the coast-down after the start has finished. If a higher-torque motor can spin more slowly, its coast-down time is shorter, increasing its longevity.

(2) The composition of the carbon and copper brushes on a stop-start motor differs from its traditional counterparts to increase longevity without accelerating the wear on the commutator.

(3) Rather than rely on oil-impregnated bushings for the rotating assemblies, stop-start starters mostly use needle bearings.

(4) The solenoid on stop-start starters decouples the mechanical action of engaging the drive pinion into the flywheel from the electrical action of stopping and starting the motor.

This allows for a dedicated design to turn power on and off to the motor, optimizing contact design and wear, against contacts that have to be integrated as part of a spring-loaded plunger.

This also reduces the electrical load requires to turn the engine, so that there is enough current available for accessories/lighting to operate during the start event.

(5) Finally, stop-start motors are integrated with other technologies that identify when each cylinder of the engine will reach top-dead center.

That lets the fuel injectors pulse and fire during the middle of a complete rotation of the crank, against having to wait for a complete revolution that lets the first cylinder reach that position to start the fuel-spark timing sequence.

And there you have it: the full technical explanation of why you don't need to worry about starter motors wearing out prematurely due to stop-start systems."

 

nothing because it does not fit the advertisement for a Hybrid specific oil.

 

FYI, that advertisement does not help us with 2025 HyCam. They use 0w-8 and Mobile 1 does not have a Hybrid version of that oil.

 

Don't know where you read that; but a lot of my old mechanic friends are seeing more starter failures on late model cars. Seeing a starter failure on a 15-20 year old car is kinda normal - but a 3-5 year old car??? Mostly on the first generation. They've been telling me that the replacement units looks like they're beefier and much higher cost....

Don't shoot the messenger.

 

It is a good thing Toyota hybrids do not use a traditional starter. MG1 is a LOT different that a traditional starter.

 

Nothing in that post is my opinion or my words.

Those are quotes from experienced automotive specialist who supplied content for the article.

I am not an experienced automotive specialist so didn't post my opinion.

The article is posted above the comments.

 

I have a Toyota 2024 SUV Hybrid and I had decided to go w either Penzoil Ultra Platinum OR Mobil 1 Extended Performance....now I find out that Mobil 1 has a special "Hybrid" Oil.... I would have posted in the Rav4 Forum, but there is a much more experienced membership here w the Toyota Hybrid vehicles (IMO). Does anyone know why the Hybrid oil is "better" than the other two oils mentioned above ? Is there another site that is more knowledgeable in the area of these oils ?
I attempted to do a search on this "newer" oil, but try to do a search for "Hybrid oil" in a Hybrid website...
Any knowledgeable opinions are appreciated... I realize marketing is a big deal but it would be great if Mobil One could elaborate too....Thanks Gents

 

I started my 20 Prime today after one month the engine not used. Sounds quiet and barely hear it. No start up noise as I was already on a street with the ambient noise to mask any. Going onto a freeway after some blocks of warm up as is my practice, the engine shuts off then goes on many times even in just 3-4 miles. Any incline it starts up, then goes off, back and forth, very sensitive to the gas pedal input. I keep it on the screen that has the image of the engines starting and stopping, otherwise would be largely unaware of the constant start stop start.
This of course is in hybrid mode, specifically selected to exercise the engine today. Great system however they did it.

 

gen 2 didn't seem to suffer from engine problems, gen 3 gave them a black eye. not sure a different oil would have made a difference

 

Wel... It must not be too big a difference since they do not offer it in the 0-w8 weight required by the latest Toyota Hybrids (2025 Camry).

 

The general trend on a reliability survey is that hybrids see more issues than ICE or BEV cars. That could be because of hybrids being harder on engines, or because two drive systems just has more parts for a problem to occur in.

Speculation, the oil formula is adjusted to not drain as quickly into the pan after shutdown, and/or has more/better antiwear additives to protect on start up. Seeing how full hybrids spin the engine up to higher speeds, with more oil flowing, before it is actually started, I don't think there would be much advantage to paying more for a hybrid oil. If there is a measurable difference, it would be more beneficial to a mild hybrid, or even a car with auto start/stop.

Do they even have it in non-hybrid flavor yet? I don't think 0w8 is limited to hybrids in Japan.

 

It is listed on Walmart's as well as Mobil 1's websites

 

Yeah I've purchased it at Walmart

 

Just peeked at Mobil's site. The 0w8 and 0w16 are only available in the Advanced Fuel Economy Mobil1. Which makes sense as that is why Japan developed them. With only some Japanese brand cars calling for those oils, there currently isn't enough demand to support offering those viscosities in other product lines. The Hybrid oil is only 0w20, which is what a large number of hybrids on the road today use.

If there is actually something to the Hybrid oil, I'm sure Mobil will come out with other viscosities in time. The new Camry alone could be worth it to them.

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