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Advice Needed! P0401, P0300, P0301, P0303 Head Gasket and/or EGR?

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by ALTEREG0, Aug 19, 2024.

  1. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    Thank you @rjparker! The noises I'm hearing now are not the normal initializing noises (whish I could post a video). Do you think doing a break bleed would help? (still need to find the right OBD2 tool for it :s ). Do I have to replace the ABS module if I replace the break booster/master cylinder?

    No HV battery codes yet, no other issues other than decreased mpg. What would be the best place to get a good deal on a new OEM battery?

    I think it's been 3 weeks since the initial "incident" that started this post. So far the car has been running fine, oil and coolant levels stable (no loss), no overheating whatsoever, haven't done the exhaust test yet. Any other symptoms that I can monitor for a bad head gasket?

    Thanks again for the help!
     
  2. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    If you're trying to upload directly, that won't work. Best is to upload to youtube, then post a link here. It'll display and play here, free of YouTube commercials too.
     
  3. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    You can post a video on your YouTube account and then post a link.

    No. I had the dealer do a brake booster bleed years ago when my unit was rapidly losing pressure. $150 and it fixed it for one day.

    The brake booster is actually the combo brake booster/abs/master cylinder issue. It also has a build in ecu which makes it expensive. Labor is many hours. The booster pump is another item. Toyota recommends replacing it as well.

    The brake booster problem is common and was even covered free for ten years 150,000 miles. Now it’s a $2k-$2.5k job unless you are brave enough to diy. Used parts are a big risk because they are used and several part numbers were used in gen3s. Even the same year is different between tire sizes, hatchbacks vs v’s etc and the stamped number on the housing may be the same.

    Hybridpit advertises a $600 mailin your part rebuild service. Still lots of labor and the final booster bleed and calibrations.

    Prius Brakes FAIL (Hidden COST of Hybrids)


    There is a failsafe in the brake by wire system that allows a pair of solenoids to fail open which results in straight hydraulic braking. However it is not power brakes at that point so the normally good ecu controlled brakes are reduced to a system with much longer stopping distances. Some accidents occur because of this. The odds are good failure will occur gradually, eg the weak brake booster will take increasingly longer to maintain standby pressure, eventually tripping a code prior to the manual failsafe mode. I would stop safely if the warning lights come on.

    IMG_6216.jpeg
     
    #63 rjparker, Sep 11, 2024
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2024
  4. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    Thanks @Mendel Leisk!
     
  5. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    It’s been almost two months since the incident and the car seems to be running “fine”. No overheating whatsoever, oil and coolant levels stable, it has never had the morning rattle/shaking, not other sure what other head gasket issues signs to look for, is it too early still to discard the possibility of a bad head gasket? It looks to me that the most likely culprit was an improperly gapped or defective spark plug but I know that would be the best case scenario and don’t want to make a bad decision based on feelings.

    Yesterday my wife told me that the check engine light had just turned on, surprise surprise, is code P0401! I just purchased the Autel Maxi AP200 scanner, are there any tests I can run with it or any data I can read with the scanner that would help me identify wether there is too much or too little flow?
    From what I’ve learned, the code is not always triggered by a clogged EGR system. I just want to discard a bad ECM before I tear into it again.

    What would you guys do? Thanks again for the help!
     
  6. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    An egr step test while measuring map pressure.

    IMG_6352.jpeg

    Which is part of this
     

    Attached Files:

  7. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    188K, mentioned in initial post. Also that you'll get 'round to EGR cleaning in November? Probably already mentioned, but odds are your head gasket is failing. If you do change it, do clean the EGR in the process.
     
  8. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    Awesome! @rjparker , do you know if such test can performed with the Autel AP2000?
     
  9. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    I don’t know if the Autel AP200 has the egr step test.
     
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  10. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    Hello @Mendel Leisk, it was a typo, I think back then it had 180k (now has over 181k I believe). I went ahead and took advantage of a "cooler" weekend (under 110 degrees) and with the help of a friend took the EGR system apart and cleaned it really good (see post #44, third page I believe). I wonder what can be triggering the P0401, I did not have the P0401 (or any other codes whatsoever) before the incident. After I replaced the spark plugs, all codes went away, no driving issues. I learned about the Prius clogged EGR problems while researching probable causes for the "incident", that is the only reason I decided to clean my car's EGR system. I mentioned before that the intake manifold passages were relatively clean and not obstructed at all. The cooler was dirty but I could still see light through it, it was not completely clogged. The car has been driven for almost two months after the incident, around 1k miles and no signs of coolant leaks, no overheating which gives me hope the head gasket might be ok.

    Do you still think it could have a faulty head gasket? Like I mentioned, I don't want to convivence myself the car doesn't have a head gasket issue just because I would really like it not to have it. If the head gasket is still good I'm planning on replacing the break master cylinder once I find a scanner that can handle ABS system bleeding. I'm also looking for new OEM traction batteries (if anyone has a source they recommend for a good deal please let me know).

    From what I have read, some people have experienced the P0401 code after cleaning the EGR system due to - Stuck EGR Valve - Bad ECU -Bad MAP sensor. Are there any other common causes for the P0401 code after cleaning the system? Not sure if a loose connection might cause something like this but I will check all the connections again this weekend as long as the test RJParker suggested.

    As always, I immensely appreciate your thoughts and feedback, please let me know
     
  11. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    I guess I will find out this weekend when I get my scanner, thank you RJParker!
     
  12. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    Just in case: did you clean the small EGR passages (roughly 1/4” dia) at each port?

    just going by reports here, any 3rd Gen with your miles (180k’ish) and only a recent EGR cleaning, has a very good chance of head gasket failing.

    You can still see light through it, but with a thick layer of insulating carbon, it’s not doing much cooling. It’s delivering a reduced flow of overheated exhaust.
     
  13. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    1.- Yes, sorry I was not more specific. The small EGR passages where not obstructed at all, just a thin layer of build up. I cleaned them anyways :)

    2.- Gotcha. Any conclusive test that I can do to make sure? Like I mentioned, I don't want to invest more time and resources in the old car if the head gasket is bad.

    3.- Yep, good thing I found out before it got worst and was able to clean it really good. Now I have to figure out why it is giving me the P0401 error after getting it squeaky clean. Any pointers?

     
  14. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    I was reading another thread where @ChapmanF helped another forum member research and I believe fix his car’s issue. Could it be something as simple as this?
    IMG_1511.jpeg
    IMG_1513.jpeg
     
  15. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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  16. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    Hello @Mendel Leisk, how did I miss that! Thank you and sorry! (Edit: I just realized you just posted that response to a comment on mine a just made a few minutes ago on a different thread, not this one. Makes me feel a little better!)

    Yes, that is the cap that I just took off yesterday, I’m not 100% sure I actually switched to the one I had not previously installed so I’m going to compare the two and install the better one. The one in the pictures seems to be good enough to stop the spring.

    Will JB weld or a similar high heat tolerant epoxy be good enough to repair the ramp if needed? Has anyone that has repair it successfully can share how they did it and what they used?


    I’ll take pictures of both and report back.
    Thank you!
     
    #76 ALTEREG0, Oct 15, 2024 at 1:31 PM
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2024 at 3:35 PM
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  17. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    If I remember right, ozmatt used a heated knife to shmoop the plastic back up into a ramp shape, and somebody else drilled a small hole and drove in a small metal screw. Both seemed to have their valves working, at least shortly after the repair.

    Both seem like things I'd probably undertake myself only if I were very remote or very broke or otherwise couldn't just get a new valve.
     
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  18. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    Thank you @ChapmanF, I'm not so sure about the hot knife (never tried doing something similar to that). I have a "plastic welding gun" that I have not used, not sure if it is small enough to fit there and also not sure what material to use (I don't think I have "extra" to scoop back on top like @ozmatt did).
    The screw fix seems too risky. I was hoping for something a little simpler like epoxy.

    Also, I'm not sure I understand the ramp's purpose. It looks to me like that it serves as a stop point when the magnet is fully treaded and the flat/taller side of the ramp comes in contact with the little metal stop on the little washer-looking round metal at the end/beginning of the threaded rod on the valve. Does that sound about right?
     
  19. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Yes, that stops the rotor at the "valve fully closed" position.

    There is no valve position sensor. There is nothing there but a stepper motor. It's about 111 steps from fully closed to fully open.

    The only way the ECM is able to control the valve position is by counting how many steps away from fully closed it has made. That has to start by knowing where fully closed is, and the ECM knows it can get there from anywhere, just by sending 111 or more pulses in the "toward closed" direction. The ski jump will stop it, the extra pulses won't make it move any farther, and then the ECM knows the position is exactly fully closed, and when it wants to open a certain amount, it can count steps up from there.

    When the ski jump has a rut through it, the rotor doesn't stop right at fully closed, and the extra pulses move the rotor even past that point (it'll eventually stop when it winds down tight on the threads). Then the ECM's idea of the valve position will be wrong after that.

    I had kind of a similar issue with the gas valve on my home furnace a couple years ago. It worked on about the same principle, and if the last thing it did was send the valve back to 'home' and it wound up tight on the threads, and then it sat that way long enough (like the whole non-heating season), then it wasn't able to open again, and my furnace wouldn't light.
     
  20. ALTEREG0

    ALTEREG0 Junior Member

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    @ChapmanF thank you so much for taking the time to explain it to me. What would be your theory as to why does the ski jump (ramp) deteriorates? The ECM sending 111 (or so) pulses when the valve is not fully open causing wear over a long period of time (14 years, 181k miles in my case) and when the plastic is also very hot?

    I've been playing with the replacement valve that I have outside the car right now (don't recall if it is the original that my car had or the replacement that I bought to clean before hand so I could save some time) and I can "feel" how if the magnet is threaded ever so slightly after it reaches the valve stop point, it will get stuck and will not allow the spring to push the magnet out and unthread by itself.
    When I take the inner spring out, the ski ramp makes better/lower contact with the little metal valve stop point and it does not get stuck. If I keep the magnet slightly up (kind of simulating the force of the inner spring) I can feel where it gets stuck.

    So interesting that such a small and simple thing can cause so many issues...

    Will report back with my findings in case it is useful to anyone.

    Thanks again for all your help @ChapmanF, @Mendel Leisk, and all others!
     
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