Featured Tesla Q2 2024 Safety report:

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by bwilson4web, Aug 8, 2024.

  1. sylvaing

    sylvaing Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2023
    1,187
    496
    0
    Location:
    Canada
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
  2. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2009
    17,557
    10,327
    90
    Location:
    Western Washington
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    The whole 2009-2014 span established a new bar for what safety we can achieve.

    ... then something(s) started breaking. It didn't seem to be the cars themselves, their crash safety tests and scores continued to improve.

    ... then the Pandemic hit, and things got even worse.
     
    sylvaing likes this.
  3. 3PriusMike

    3PriusMike Prius owner since 2000, Tesla M3 2018

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2009
    3,037
    2,373
    0
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Perhaps widespread use of smart phones...while driving

    Mike
     
    Isaac Zachary and sylvaing like this.
  4. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    22,576
    11,851
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Level 2 ADAS adoption started taking off in that time frame.
    A History of ADAS: Emergence to Essential | IDTechEx Research Article
    Same with smart phones.
    Demographics of Mobile Device Ownership and Adoption in the United States | Pew Research Center

    So we have more phones to entice drivers away from driving, and the spread of car features that could enable to do so at the same time.
     
    fuzzy1 likes this.
  5. N4HHE

    N4HHE Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2022
    12
    5
    0
    Location:
    North Alabama
    Vehicle:
    Other Electric Vehicle
    Model:
    N/A
    Yes, Tesla is calling the combination of Autosteer (lane holding) and Adaptive Cruise Control, "Autopilot". But when the layman hears "autopilot" he thinks it is an autonomous self-driving automobile.
     
  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    110,444
    50,202
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    what layman is that? likely a tiny minority of blockheads
     
  7. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2009
    17,557
    10,327
    90
    Location:
    Western Washington
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    That is one potential factor. But don't use that as an excuse to quit looking at other potential factors, or to deflect from a sacred cow you may want to protect.

    It could very easily be a combination of multiple factors, to different degrees, including some surprising ones we haven't initially considered.
     
  8. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    22,576
    11,851
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Entertainment has given the impression that airplane autopilot is more capable than it is, and that is the source of how it works for most of the public. Supposedly, Tesla engineers didn't want to use the Autopilot name over concerns of that public confusion could lead to issues.
     
    N4HHE likes this.
  9. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2018
    2,139
    1,008
    1
    Location:
    USA
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    I would think that for a car it should be called "autodriver" or "autochauffeur."
     
  10. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    22,576
    11,851
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    That could be worse. It is the auto that can give the impression that the car can do more than it can.
     
    #30 Trollbait, Aug 9, 2024
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2024
    sylvaing likes this.
  11. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2018
    2,139
    1,008
    1
    Location:
    USA
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Maybe "AI-driver" then would give the right impression. :LOL:
     
  12. sylvaing

    sylvaing Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2023
    1,187
    496
    0
    Location:
    Canada
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    And a minority that is screwing it for the rest of us.
     
    austingreen and bisco like this.
  13. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    22,576
    11,851
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Usual case with many things.
     
  14. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,736
    15,700
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    Only by stopping half way for a sleep over, making it 4 days of travel versus 2 days. This significantly increases the trip cost with motel and meal expenses.

    With Full Self Driving (and even AutoPilot before,) I can easily cover the 1,146 miles in one day, safer than with manual driving, cheaper, and a lot less fatiguing. For example, visiting my late Mom was ~1,000 mi which made it quite practical. Driving in the 2003 Prius, the passenger seat was replaced with a sleeping board and I took a 4 hour nap midway in a parking lot.

    Full Self Driving has proved to improve my quality of life.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #34 bwilson4web, Aug 10, 2024
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2024
    N4HHE and sylvaing like this.
  15. ColoradoCrow

    ColoradoCrow Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2019
    982
    402
    1
    Location:
    Leawood, KS
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    I
    I have had the opportunity to rent 6 Teslas, each for 8-9 days in a row totaling almost 2 months of driving. During this time I tested FSD in many different environments. I have found FSD to be helpful and safe 90 percent of the time. Crappy roads and unmarked roads can cause it to error.. But given the ability it has to aid me in stopping and avoiding a crash I feel the cost is worth it. I plan on buying a used Model Y by the end of this year. The extra $5,000 in price over the life of the car is worth investing in myself. If I smoked I'd spend $2,500 a year on cigs...So yeah it costs more but like window tint helping my eyes and delaying skin cancer....it's worth it for me. FSD continues to improve. it will get better. I will degrade and get worse..I'll take that type of AI based ML for now.
     
    sylvaing and bisco like this.
  16. John321

    John321 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2018
    1,302
    1,295
    0
    Location:
    Kentucky
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    That type of mileage in a day is incredible unsafe - not just for you - but for the other families out on the road.

    Hope you will reevaluate priorities if not for your own safety - for others safety.

    Those comments in your post make one of the best cases I've seen on why Full Self Driving is so dangerous.
    You're playing with fire driving like you state in the post.

    I hope that post was made to provoke others and not really factual.
     
    #36 John321, Aug 10, 2024
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2024
    Trollbait and Isaac Zachary like this.
  17. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,736
    15,700
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    Ok, "Karen". Perhaps this might give some perspective:

    upload_2024-8-10_8-58-0.png

    As for Alabama: https://ati.ua.edu/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/51.pdf

    Currently, Alabama has no laws or regulations pertaining to autonomous non-commercial (passenger) vehicles.11,12 However, in 2019 Alabama passed legislation for commercial vehicles allowing for AV deployment on public roads with the requirement of liability insurance for $2 million and no requirement for the presence of an operator in the vehicle. The restriction to commercial vehicles could be explained by the fact that Alabama officials expect commercial vehicles to become the first instance of AVs in the state.13The state’s current statutes also allow for on-highway testing of short-distance platooning convoys of trucks, as Alabama in 2018 exempted self-driving trucks from certain traffic laws when they are controlled by electronically coordinated speed and braking systems.

    Ad Hominem only pisses off the target and not persuasive. So in defense of my life, driving with Full Self Driving and Autopilot follows a life long pattern:
    • 4 years in the Marine Corps
    • Private pilot with over 300 hours of "VFR" flying in a single engine Cherokee 140
    • 11 years Washington DC traffic with bicycle, motorcycle, and public transportation
    • 5 years driving a Chevette
    • Married to my late wife 43 years
    • Livin' in Dixie
    At the risk of moving this to another forum:

    "Just leave us alone!" - Walz.​

    Bob Wilson
     
    #37 bwilson4web, Aug 10, 2024
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2024
  18. sylvaing

    sylvaing Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2023
    1,187
    496
    0
    Location:
    Canada
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Hopefully that still hold true for HW3 cars. I'm still waiting for 12.5.x for my 2021 Model 3 :(

    Must said in about 10 days... check notes... 12 days ago. Hopefully Musk days aren't week in realtime.
     
  19. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2006
    22,576
    11,851
    0
    Location:
    eastern Pennsylvania
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Unless you are doing 100mph, your long trips are exceeding commercial trucker and pilot duty limits.
     
    fuzzy1 likes this.
  20. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2009
    17,557
    10,327
    90
    Location:
    Western Washington
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Damned by faint praise. Manually driving that is very unsafe.

    I can't help but notice something glaringly absent: any concern for the impact on or safety of others. My dad also shifted significantly in that direction in his twilight years.

    Red Herring. The post to which you replied, contained no Ad Hominem.
    That used to be such a nice name, for those of us with close Baby Boomer relatives and ancestors christened with it. It is painful to now see it used as a slur, or as Ad Hominem.
     
    #40 fuzzy1, Aug 11, 2024
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2024