Featured Europe passes two big laws to make EV charging a whole lot better

This would certainly be a concern with apps with which you maintain a balance. I do this for very few, just one actually (our states HOV lane system).

Most apps though, simply use your credit card info. In those cases, any dispute would be handled the same way it is now.

No, I live in Minnesota (USA).

Just as I would not give my credit card information to a merchant I don’t trust, I also wouldn’t give it to an app I don’t trust.
In the case of Tesla, I trust the security of their app. Since I use it for many aspects, I have no issue having my charge information in it as well.

 

So I'm trying to go somewhere and I'm running late and I pull to a metered parking spot and now I'm told that while standing next to a parking meter I need to go to Android or Apple store and assuming I can even get a data connection through my wireless plan I have to find the app and then download and install it and then enter my credit card number all while having to figure each of those steps out while I run the gauntlet of dishonest advertisers trying to trick me into hitting the wrong button so they can force feed me their garbage?

That's truly an absurd and unreasonable expectation to put on any human of ordinary ability compared to putting a quarter in or swiping your debit card?

This is a perfect example of how out of touch and overpaid app makers in the tech industry really are... The entire notion of how apps are a better option is just plain stupid because of how much garbage is coming in and going out of our phones that we don't have control of.

 

I would suggest simply putting a few quarters in the meter. (I haven’t seen a parking meter that didn’t have both options).

As for car charging, with my Tesla, I pull in, plug in the charger, and walk away. It is extremely easy and straight forward.
The app notifies me when the car is almost fully charged. It warns me if there may be congestion charges if I stay plugged in after charging is complete. Or, I can check on the charge status at any time.
Simple, straight forward, doesn’t even require me to pull out my wallet or phone.

This should be the goal.

 

Nope... No place to put the quarters in and no place to swipe a debit or credit card because apps are so convenient right? It's why I rarely patronize businesses in my downtown.

 

I've resisted the suggestion of a charger that takes cash. I like cash and think we should keep it for its public utility. On the other hand I recognize that I'm in the minority on that. One of my favorite things about cash is that we (taxpayers) have all shouldered the cost of the cost of dealing with it. There is no digital equivalent for that.

But I do think cash acceptance would be unreasonably cumbersome for public car charger operators, so I haven't suggested that.

That's why I look at a credit card setup as the next best. @Zythryn you make a good case for not putting a card reader on the device. My next best idea is to put a QR code on the charger so the user can load a website to enter payment info.

Most importantly, a card-based setup does not require the user to open an account, provide personal info, or agree to any legal terms of service that might come back to bite them later.

To me, that makes this slicker. Lower risk, lower friction, with less surface area presented to any potential hackers in the middle.

 

Sure would be easy for criminals to put their QR code on top of the existing one and then they'd have your credit card info and other personal information way faster than most other methods.

The real problem is the government should of set up a universal payment service for these kinds of things. China has done that and I'd in no way want China's oppressive app, but the free for all of the so-call free market is ripe for crooks and spammers to ruin your day. Whereas if someone pays me cash for driving them somewhere and I can put that cash directly into the charger before I head home that works the best for me.

And in general, all options need to be available so everyone can use the system they prefer.

 

card skimmers:

44551905

 

All my cards are tap to pay capable. Even the debit card of the local credit union. Such is securer that swiping a card, probably more reliable out in the elements.

Some gas stations charge an extra 10 cent a gallon for gas here. It isn't because of the card reader hardware on the pump, but because of the fees from the credit card companies. I don't think the charger company gets to bypass those fees by charging a card through their app.

I couldn't be bothered to set up an account with a gas station to save 25 cents a gallon, I'm not going to do so in order to charge a BEV. So I guess I'll be driving the Outback on road trips for the next decade or longer.

 

It's been an eye-opener of a thread. I did not realize there was such a big gap in capability between public EV chargers and gas pumps.

I have read that EVgo chargers are set up for POS operation. Had never heard of the brand before. Hoping to see more, I guess?

Hard not to feel jealous of the Europeans getting ahead of us on this one.

 

They are ahead of us on many things.

 

Tesla SuperChargers, the North American Charging Standard, don't count?

When the European regulators mandated the CCS-2, Tesla said, "OK, enjoy." It is larger, bulkier, and requires two separate plugs: AC only, and; DC only. Tesla has been perfectly happy to sell them what they insisted on ... screw the EU customers at the insistence of their regulators.

So when are the EU regulators going to insist on square wheels?

Bob Wilson

 

Plenty of fraud on European accounts as a percentage of transactions.

Sadly most fraud affecting European accounts gets attributed to the US or another country making their metrics look better and said other country look worse.

 

You're making it sound like CHAdeMO, which literally is a separate plug and receptacle on the car taking up space and repeating communication connectors.

Tesla's NACS wasn't an open standard at the time. Technically, it still isn't. A regulating body isn't going to support a private standard as a sole option. There may have been more CCS chargers already operating at that time.

Tesla was totally free to keep using NACS in the EU. If their customers were screwed over by the switch, then it was Tesla doing so for subsidy money.

 

I'm not sure what you're asking here, could you clarify?

I'm under the impression that SuperChargers don't have a point-of-sale option, you must always use an app. In my mind that makes it a less-than-public charger.

Corrections welcomed.

 

I just plug the car in and it securely reads the VIN. My credit card is automatically charged. I never have to take my wallet out.

Bob Wilson

 

You don’t need to use the app.
You do need to keep a credit card on file with Tesla.

You pull up, plug in, and walk away.
You never need to get your wallet, or phone.
If you want to, you can get additional info about the charging session by looking at the app.
This is the same app that allows you to start the car, view the sentry cameras, view info about the car, remote climate, etc.

You can use as much, or as little of the info available.

 

That's the crux of it. That's the locus of friction; the maximum pain point, from my perspective. Exxon doesn't make me start an account and leave a card on file and subject me to a 40-page TOS contract just to buy their energy.

From 30 years ago I had the option to do that with the Mobil speedpass RFID system but I wasn't interested in it then and I'm not interested in it now.

So honestly it just looks like exclusionary gatekeeping.

 

If works …

I would add, the navigation icon shows the number of free lanes. Expanding the icon shows the power rating and distribution of activity over the day. If you navigate to it, the battery temperature is preconditioned to an optimal temperature.

Regardless, go with CCS-1, the standard.

Bob Wilson

 

Yes ... exclusionary gatekeeping ... does work.

 

I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member. - Groucho Marx.​

Bob Wilson