Featured Tesla loses the race for mainstream EVs to GM

Regarding (the lack of) affordability of new vehicles:

The average price paid for a new vehicle in the U.S. in June was the highest on record and marked the first time the average transaction price (ATP) surpassed the $48,000 mark, according to new data released by Kelley Blue Book, a Cox Automotive company.

The new-vehicle ATP increased to $48,043 in June 2022, according to Kelley Blue Book, beating the previous high of $47,202 set in December 2021. June prices rose 1.9% ($895) from May and were up 12.7% ($5,410) from June 2021.​

New-Vehicle Prices Set a Record in June, According to Kelley Blue Book, as Luxury Share Hits New High

That's about the price of an entry level Tesla Model 3 these days.

 

No they don't, but their business plan from the beginning was to make expensive cars to fund future lower cost models with a goal of an affordable model.

If their plan has changed and is to just stick with luxury models, that is their prerogative. Can't claim they didn't lose the affordable BEV race by not competing though.

It is also $20k more than the entry level Camry hybrid.

 

A new Camry Hybrid is too expensive for most of the population, even if can be had at MSRP these days, and even though it is not a "BEV".

The entry level Model 3 is also >>$20k less than a Taycan which is comparably a BEV, but that too is not likely cross-shopped by Model 3 potential owners.

Looking forward to seeing if the 2023 Bolt will be had near MRSP. That will open up the new BEV experience to many more.

 

The bolt looks quite interesting as an 'affordable' EV...IF folks can get them without markups, etc... We all know the legacy stealerships operate. It will be interesting to see how many they sell.

 

Slight nuance here. The Model S was more affordable than the Roadster, and the Model 3 is more affordable than the Model S.
Tesla’s goal, however, was never a “goal of an affordable model”. Their goal was to “accelerate the adoption of electric cars”.
Tesla apparently decided that they are better off scaling up to meet the present demand for the models they currently have, than introducing a new, lower margin vehicle, that would slow their growth.
Once they can meet demand, I suspect a smaller electric car will be coming (at least I hope so, as it is the one I want ).

Early on, Tesla stated that they can’t do it all on their own. Tesla is happy to see other manufacturers building lots of EVs.

 

One gentleman has already mentioned the modestly priced Camry Hybrid that gets over 50mpg

I'll mention the humble Corolla (best-selling car in the world) that has a hybrid model very well equipped that starts at $24,000 - it will get 53 miles per gallon and has legendary reliability and long life.

If that isn't enough Toyota, make a whole line of Prius based model vehicles that have set the standard for hybrid electrified vehicles.

I wonder if Toyota is considering a Plug In or EV Camry and Corolla?

 

all businesses compete, that's what brings out the best. everyone you mention is on the other end of that competition

doesn't matter. everyone is doing what they can (or what they want) it is what it is, and the future is always uncertain.
legacy mfg's are still at the mercyof their dealers, and ice profits, as well as customer demand

unlikely, based on their past statements.

when we purchased our first camry hybrid (around 25k at the time) back in 2008, my bil and sil (teacher and nurse) very environmentaly minded, said we were crazy to spend that kind of money, and bought two base camry's well under 20k each.

bolt price looks great, until you see and drive one. most people who are currently interested in bev's, are not interested in anything that small. that may change over time, idk.

 

those jaguar I-Pace sales are off the charts. i can still remember the hype...

 

True that. Personally, I'm not the 'average' USA vehicle consumer, that's for sure. For context, my favorite vehicle is our Prius C....which our daughter now has. I'm looking for another one!

 

me either. i considered the bolt, but i want something at least as big as my gen3.

 

A TSLA stock holder, I am not terribly concerned that the Model 3 is the least expensive one they make. Elon once pointed out that had Tesla built low margin cheap EVs, they would have gone out of business.

Bob Wilson

 

If I was still a stock holder I would be mad if they used their manufacturing to build low priced BEVs instead of more profitable cars. I believe they could build a $30K model right now, but will likely just drop the price of the model 3 standard range+ and start producing a smaller range model Y with the capabilities they have. That leads to higher quality higher profits. Maybe in 2026 or so we will see a more affordable tesla. It all depends on how well the current line up and the cyber truck and roadster do, as well as competition. If they can continue to grow at 50% a year without a lower priced model then I don't expect that they will sell them. If they drop the rwd 267 mile model 3 to $40K and qualify for the new government incentives next year then it will still be one of the best sports sedans and cost less after tax credits ($34K) than the ice competition. Wait lists for that model 3 are long even at the $48K +ttl current price.

 

If the Camry is too expensive, what does that say about the Model 3?

I know. I'm not faulting Tesla. I'm faulting fanboism using whataboutism to deflect from the point of the OP article. Few are saying Tesla hasn't done great. The success doesn't make the Model 3 an everyperson's car.

Yet they can shift to semi's and pick ups for a scifi set.

I accept the realities of the market place, and Tesla will likely drop their prices when the market shifts again. Their success with higher margin cars doesn't counter the point of the article though.

 

It says post #101 remains a mathematical argument against whataboutism in this thread - new car customers are definitionally paying about some distribution curve of average new vehicle prices. The entry level Tesla Model 3 costs the same as the average price paid for a new vehicle in the U.S.. That makes it mainstream by new vehicle price.

The question if >75% of new vehicles are affordable to the general population has been addressed in other threads.

 

I don't think that the legacy car makers currently have any "model development capacity" over Tesla, in terms of EVs. They gave up this crown when they ALL (pretty much) had nothing to counter the Model 3 with. I think Tesla could develop a couple of new models now, but:
a) they don't have to...look at the EV market share by model (only Ford MachE is within ~4x of Tesla Model 3)
b) it is more profitable to make fewer models when you have a long long waiting list
c) they have a long long waiting list AND are ramping faster than the others
d) they are building their battery and chip supply chain faster than the legacy guys
e) for 5 years, or more, Tesla has been the employment goal of top graduates for car engineers and designers

The legacy guys are stuck in the past in design skills and methodology...and in business model.
Everyone is tending to copy Tesla on things like OTA updates, recurring revenue, on-line ordering, mobile service.

Mike

 

I bought one and it has plenty of room in it. As a matter of fact, my knee no longer hits the door panel like it did in my Prii.

 

Tesla's least expensive model is equal to the average price of new vehicles. Being mainstream doesn't make it affordable.

Where is the Cybertruck?

Tesla put out a car, and then follows up with a SUV version a couple years later. About 4 years after the car, they release another car. Again.followed by a SUV version in a couple years. At this time, they are able to do a redesign of the first car/SUV, which is a longer period than industry norms. They have expanded the R&D department so that they can work on the Semi and Cybertruck while doing those redesigns, but I doubt they could simply add another couple models to develop.

The traditional car companies are developing EV models at a faster rate. It isn't at a rate we are happy with, do they are able to do it while maintaining support and development for their traditional models.

And Tesla is free to keep on making cars and printing money as they are. It just means the OP article is correct on the affordable bit.

The Bolt shares a platform with my departed 2013 Sonic. I found the front of that car roomier and more comfortable than the 2016 Camry. Even on long trips.

 

agreed, but the point of the article is false, imo. the race isn't over until someone wins. there can't be a loser without a winner. bolt is not a winner, yet

it does work for some people, but when i looked at it, the hatch looked smaller than mine. i didn't even bother to get out the tape measure

 

....and not everything is peachy is the Tesla world

Ralph Nader asks NHTSA to recall Tesla’s ‘dangerous and irresponsible’ FSD | TechCrunch

Ralph Nader, a political and consumer advocate and former presidential candidate, has issued a statement calling Tesla’s “so-called” full self-driving (FSD) technology “one of the most dangerous and irresponsible actions by a car company in decades.”

 

ralph nader was wrong about the corvair, the only thing he's ever done. rode that wave for decades