Featured Tested: 2022 Toyota Prius Prime's Time Has Come and Gone

Prius Prime isn't fancy by any means; but it is extremely reliable and fairly low maintenance. It is good enough for many people. Other PHEV are probably not as good in terms of reliability/price. I am not sure how reliable the chevy volt is; but its last model year was 2019. The article didn't point those things out. Compared to Ioniq PHEV: on paper the Ioniq PHEV is better; however, I do think long-term reliability: the PP is going to be better.

 

C/D has never recaptured their glory days with Yates, Shepherd, et al, but that doesn't even slow down their latter day posing. Comparing the Prime to a Tesla is like comparing a Comfort Inn to the Ritz Carlton. Both get the job done, but the Ritz costs twice as much for what is, mostly style. And for anyone needing to drive 600 miles/day or more, it's also a question of practicality, and even feasibility. Not to mention the reliability of a proven platform like the Prius.

I've been very impressed with the total package of the Prime. Hard to beat the overall performance for my uses. Maybe put a LiFePho batt back there someday...

 

Having traded in a 2017 Prius Prime for a 2019 Tesla Model 3 Std Rng Plus, I have 'hands on' with both vehicles and earlier Prius. Some mild criticism is warranted:

• square peg in round hole - the Prime battery remains a prismatic shape that is undersized to fit in the spare tire, body recess. An engineered, cylindrical cell battery would have more efficiently fit to increase EV range and interior space.
• air cooled - worse, after a decade of thermal problems and the Leaf example, Toyota continued air thermal management instead of denser and more efficient liquid thermal management.
• not so expensive Tesla - trading in the Prius Prime reduced my Tesla out-of-pocket cost to $24,000 and saved some sales tax.
• system is the product from plug-to-wheel - the SuperCharger network expansion has gone faster than my Tesla 7.5% battery degradation.

Neither product, 2017 Prius Prime nor 2019 Model 3, has been perfect. Just another release point in the progress toward efficient car technology. Looking at today's advances, there is a brighter future coming for both.

Bob Wilson

 

Toyota was rushed on the Prius Prime battery. I believe they did have a pack that would fit down into the spare wheel well, but that pack was closer in size to the PiP's.

The Leaf uses passive air cooling. Everybody else uses active air cooling; they put a fan or blower in there. Some might even use the A/C to chill the blown air. The latter have not had the issues that the Leaf has seen. I don't feel the trade offs are worth the lower cost in the cooling system, but wouldn't be worried about battery life with such a system.

 

It was a matter of priority. They wanted delivery of something affordable, a product cost-competitive with the actual competition... traditional vehicles.

We see the same thing happening with bZ4X, focus being on pressure from the showroom floor rather than what other automakers are doing. That's why ev-range & charge-speed isn't as important. Notice how quickly Toyota was able to follow-up with RAV4 Prime. Think about when bZ3X could come about.

Prius tends to be a Pheonix. When you see an apparent end, it rises from the ashes. Holding off until for a new platform combined with a new battery fits Toyota approach well. Emphasis is long-term and their own loyal customers.

 

Toyota's going to be shedding loyal customers if they keep playing this game of manufacturing artificial scarcity of their electric and PHEV vehicles. I can't imagine how such a disastrous idea ever made it past the dry-erase board at Toyota. I suspect in 10 years Toyota will have been knocked from their perch and we'll be looking back to see where Toyota went wrong, and their obstinate resistance to PHEV and EV is where.

Such a giant losing their status can seem almost unimaginable, especially to younger folks who haven't witnessed other companies that exhibited similar hubris suffer the same fate. Remember Kodak, who thought digital photography was a "fad"? It even happened to automakers in the 1970's as gas prices spiked and they refused to make fuel efficient vehicles and had their clocks cleaned by Japanese brands to the point of having to be bailed out.

Here we are with gas prices spiking and Toyota essentially refusing to seriously manufacture alternative fuel vehicles. We'll see.

 

Where exactly are said customers going? The audience for Tesla, Ford and GM is currently quite different. VW and Hyundai/Kia show potential, but specs are a mismatch.

We see the political game playing out with public chargers here in the US. Without renewed tax-credits and the fight against public chargers (and lack of a DC standard), there is far from any type of mainstream demand.

Think about conquest verses status quo. What is actually happening with current Corolla, Camry and RAV4 owners looking for a replacement? Same question for a very different audience, what about Prius owners?

In other words, what is the criteria for their purchase? What would compel loyal customers to go elsewhere? The devil is in the detail... hence the "game".

 

Just on this board we've seen long-time Toyota drivers dump Toyota for other brands, and that's when the pickings from other manufacturers are still slim. If I can get my hands on another brand of EV that does what I want for a similar price, I'll probably take the leap (again). Toyota's only hope in my case is to gamble that the other manufacturer's car is so junky that I come back.

Wait until the other manufacturers are manufacturing capable vehicles en masse. If the other manufacturers start making more cars like the Ioniq5 and they're reliable Toyota's going to get knocked down a few notches. All of their "evangelists" as early adopters and supporters are called in the tech world may flee the brand and take their word of mouth support with them. That's what I mean when I say once they loose the support of their base it takes generations to build that back. They're playing a dangerous game.

I could be totally wrong. Only time will tell.

 

Which lead to Toyota Japan designing a PiP II, something with much lower battery capacity. Which might make sense for Japan, with its poor electric grid. Just as a $3000 solar roof option is easier to sell there. It wasn't going to sell in the US with that battery in the US, against the likes of the C-max Energi though. So Toyota USA pushed for the bigger battery.

Which is where the rushing came into play with the Prius Prime battery. Why the battery install takes up more cargo space than the C-max Energi's, and why it looks like an aftermarket job. The quick follow up with the Rav4 Prime, plus previous experience with the PiP, is proof Toyota could have done a better job with the battery if they weren't under pressure from a deadline.

The showroom is the dealers that don't want to sell plug ins out of fear. Southeast and Gulf Coast already make it difficult to buy a Prime in their region, and it sounds like it will be the same with any BEVs.

Most likely, it wasn't the idea, but a consequence of Toyota not taking the plug in market seriously. The Prius Prime is more of a compliance vehicle, that was only selling well with large incentives, from whoever. Its annual sales have been under what Toyota predicted. They expected the same with the Rav4 Prime, so secured supplies for similar production numbers.

Of course, most outsiders saw it was going to be a hit once it was revealed. Toyota had to stop taking orders in Japan during the first year, because of demand. Some reviewers today recommend it over the bZ4X. I think Toyota would increase production, if they could, but they can't get batteries. They are still behind the other automakers entering the BEV field in terms of batteries, so the same will likely happen with the bZ4X.

 

This is a 'back of the envelope' analysis meant to get within the range of a two layer, 2170 cell pack fitting into the wheel well of a Prius Prime:

• 6.08 kWh (6080 Ahr) = 10 Ahr / cell * 608 cells
• 8.8 Ahr reported Prius Prime pack capacity for 25 mi

Check my work but this would have resulted in a smaller Ahr capacity. I need to make a proper spreadsheet and include the packing density of smaller cells in a larger cylinder volume.

Bob Wilson

 

I find brand loyalty, especially blind brand loyalty counterproductive, and definitely not economical for deciding on the purchase of a car which is for most people the second largest purchase next to a house. I like my PP, but that's not because it is Toyota. I would switch to any other brand if there are any cars better made and/or with better value.

 

That is what "know your audience" is all about. This board is an extreme, not in any way representative of the showroom shopper... which brings us to the what didn't get addressed... what does the conquest consumer seek?

 

I just drove ~550 miles on two different days in my Model 3. I didn't have to wait for any chargers and only sat waiting to charge for about 5 minutes two times after getting lunch and bio breaks. Very practical.

Mike

 

Something better ....

 

or Something cheaper....

 

In long, 14 hour days, I typically go to ~700 miles. It depends on the SuperCharger density as I make frequent, short segments arriving at minimum SOC for fastest charging rate and quickest sessions.

Bob Wilson

 

The fact you had to plan for the frequent charging sessions with short segments would be very unpractical for me. I just did ~700 miles round trips on my PP without any stops except at the destination point. A short less than 1-hour visit to the destination and a quick U-turn completed the entire trip in a single day. Would have been difficult to accomplish even in a Tesla, and impossible with any non-Tesla BEV.

 

Fast DC charging is part of the EV system. Fortunately, my requirements are met by the expanding SuperCharger network.

Just curious as our former Prius Prime gave nagging messages about needing to take biology breaks. Their interval was similar to my early charging stops. Does your Prime still give those 'reminders' to take a break?

Bob Wilson

 

Nop. I turned off all the "pop-up" warnings on the MID on my first day of current PP ownership. With PP's long-range, I usually go 5 hours non-stop. When I was younger, I could go longer... but back then my Civic did not have 700 miles range, so I had to take 5min pit-in just for gassing up. Have done over 1000 miles in a single day back then.

 

My typical EV profile is:

• 3-4 hours - 1st segment starting with 100% SOC
• 2 hours, +/- 30 minutes - subsequent segments arriving with 10 miles reserve
  • charging 15-25 minutes overlapping with biology breaks

Bob Wilson