2000w Inverter Install

Can u share your setup?


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"How likely" depends on what you do. If you treat the 3000 watt inverter as good for about 1000 watts and avoid drawing more from it, that should be fine.

If you treat it like a 3000 watt inverter and try to draw 3000 watts from it (over 200 amps at 13.8 volts), the one-hundred-something-amp fuse on the car's DC/DC converter will eventually stop you from doing that. As likely as a rock falling when you drop it.

In between there, at loads before you actually blow the fuse, the car's converter will signal that it is overloaded (which you can see if you monitor its "IDH" signal), its output voltage may droop, and if its temperature rises too far, it will turn off.

 

I recently tested Charge Mode while stationary, Ready, and in Park. It took 88 minutes to go from 0% to 80% (where Charge Mode kicks off) of EV range. So, about 3.5kW going into the big battery for about 1.5 hours. Presumably, an inverter powered by the 350VDC nominal battery could draw off that amount continuously while holding SOC steady, or more for a while if drawing the battery down. Certainly more power can be pumped in, in Charge Mode by applying throttle with the transmission in D rather than P, but I don't particularly like that idea with the car stationary. Unsure whether the car would up the charge rate idling in P if the battery were actually losing ground, but I doubt it. I didn't monkey with applying throttle in Park, my test was just letting it idle.

I figure the ICE used about 6hp of mechanical output to generate the 3.5kW (slightly under 5hp) of charging. 6hp is about the same as driving 40mph on level ground, but without 40mph air entering the grille to cool the engine. So, the radiator fan has to run a lot more, adding to overhead losses. Engine cooling and climate may enter into the equation for anyone looking to draw and replace multiple kW from the Prime for long periods.

I'll refine and redo the testing, gathering more data than just timing it and watching fuel consumption. Certainly I'll graph battery voltage vs SOC, look at how the module voltage balance reacts to being in Charge Mode for so long, etc.

People talk a good story of wanting to draw 2kW, 3kW, 5kW, 10kW from tapping straight into the big battery in a Prime, until they find out the replacement cost of the battery if they screw up, or simply develop the realistic fear that an otherwise valid warranty claim about their battery could be denied. 99% of them end up doing nothing, or drawing under 1kW from the 12V with the car in Ready, rather than even hooking one wire to, or drawing 1 watt from, the high voltage battery with the car completely off, or even Ready.

I'm going to go the 12v route initially, myself. Maybe once I have a perfect replacement battery in hand from a junkyard, or I reach 150K miles, I'll build the system I'm in the process of designing, already have significant parts for, and eventually will be testing. Note that I didn't say testing it now, or testing it using my Prime's battery. I probably will duplicate the 95s battery configuration of the Prime by putting 19 identical 5s cordless tool batteries in series. I'll just need the right tool battery clearance sale to coincide with the rest of my project being ready to test.

 

It's not pretty, still waiting on a fixture I'm printing to place it neatly.

 

Unless that inverter clearly comes with a claim that it's constructed for an exposed underhood environment ... it isn't.

 

Do you have a plan to monitor temp in engine compartment? Seems the system would be more efficient if inverter was located inside the car, rather than next to engine that can get real hot in Summer months?

 

I can only hope it just gets taken out of safe interior storage and put there while stationary at a camp site.

Otherwise, drive through a cloudburst and it may be a fire waiting to happen. Maybe roads aren't salted in that area ... salted water kicked up off the road and in the grille would be murder.

 

I think most people use a quick disconnect like an anderson connector.

 

Dear OP: Thanks for posting about this. I just bought a used Prius (dead HV battery) and now have it working and want to do this. I am moderately electrically aware, but not EE. I note:

Your inverter is a good brand and the purchase of pure-sine was a good idea; a bit more than modified sine wave, which would have been ok too. The worst inverters are square wave, but modified sine is ok for most motors (but not chargers and sensitive electronics like CPAP machines, I hear).

2000w (running) means 4,000w surge/start up/peak. The size of your inverter seems good.

A fuse on hot is a good idea. Sizing it to avert other parts of the system getting fried or literally becoming a light bulb filament was a great idea. How is it connected? If connected via the 12v sealed lead acid ("regular car battery") make sure that you know the maximum amp/watt draw from that thing. I recall hearing 800w continuous was about the limit. Watts = Volts x Amps. The fuse sizing question is a good one to ask.

It's good that your wires are fat. Your 12v wires should also be as short as possible and your connections good and strong.

The order that you connect and power 110v things really matters. I believe the main idea is: get your inverter powered up and running before you connect it to 110v things. Don't connect the things and then turn on the inverter, as the things may not like the way the inverter starts up.

If it were me and the inverter was permanently mounted, I'd also want a 'cut off' switch installed - like people use as anti-theft devices to disconnect and connect the inverter from the car. It would normally be in the 'cut' position except when you need it.

Starting up motors, especially those with compressors (like fridges) is what is very hard for inverters. I have heard that this surge/start current can be many times the running current. So your 400-600w continuous fridge could go to 4,000 or so for a split second. I think this is okay with a prius, but just remember that you don't want multiple things with compressors or large motors that you have to start, causing the inrushing current. So 1 fridge or 1 furnace, but not both.

It goes without saying, but just in case: NEVER NEVER connect your inverter's power to your housewiring. It's never okay to 'backfeed' inverter electricity into your house...unless you have a manual transfer switch for just what you need to power and you connect the inverter to the input on the transfer switch. I am stuck with my inverter not liking to power my furnace via my transfer switch because the inverter has a 'floating' ground and the house transfer switch naturally grounds the cold wire. Yet I can run a small power tool. I am mulling what is wrong and how to fix it to use the inverter to power the furnace via the transfer switch. Or the fridge.

 

Another recommendation to add in there, for a Gen 4 or Prime, is to make sure the inverter is connected on the car side, not the battery side, of the battery state sensor assembly, so that the car is aware of actual power in/out of the battery. When the sensor assembly is installed on the battery negative terminal, that means making the inverter negative connection to a good body ground, such as where the battery negative cable connects to the car, is a better idea than connecting it right at the battery negative post.

That's a good idea anyway, as it puts the connection that much closer to the DC/DC converter, which is where the power will chiefly be coming from anyway, when using the inverter with the car in READY.

 

So just to cover all the bases here...

The inverter is never live wired to the battery when I'm just driving around.

I've designed a enclosure for the unit but It will only help repel water and keep this thing in place.

Originally I had planned to have this in the compartment under the rear passenger seat buuut, that area ended up being large enough for a second battery, so I decided to go ahead with that and then struggle to find a place for this.

It's still a in progress item and any suggestions will be taken only.

 

If I can make some space I still plan to relocate this right next to the DC/AC converter and install a bus next to my second battery.

 

Don't they experience some power loss due to extra 12V connectors? I really like the idea of Anderson connectors, but I've read that losses can be 10-15% from a setup with circuit breaker + Anderson connector.

 

I'm sure there's some loss since any connection has at least a minute amount of resistance. I've never measured it, but I'd be astonished if it was anywhere near 10%. Even 1% on a proper connection would be too much, imho.

 

I thought it was a bit high too, but @bwilson4web mentions a "10-15% of my total energy just in the Anderson connector and the 120A, 12v circuit breaker.":
110 VAC inverter installation | Page 3 | PriusChat

 

Anderson connectors come in a variety of current ratings. If you use 120 amp rated ones, there should be a lower power loss. Just think, if you have 10% loss at 2 kwatt that's 200 watts and the connector would get hot enough to melt the insulation.

JeffD

 

At 2k Watts demand that would mean 300 watts converted to heat. No way. I call BS. Imagine a 300w bulb where it's mostly converted to light. Touch it. Now touch the Anderson connector.

 

I use a 2,000 mod sin wave inverter, 2ga wire, no fuse, an Anderson connector. I can draw 2k W all day long and never get a low voltage alarm on the inverter. Google the specs for the harbor freight jobber I got....

 

Can you link the Anderson connector you used for your inverter? I’m going to install them into a 1200W pure sine inverter along with either an inline fuse or breaker.


iPhone ?

 

I don't have a link it's the one that connects golf carts