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Featured Toyota chief speaks out on EVs

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by MikeDee, Dec 17, 2020.

  1. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    Obviously your not familiar with Governing Documents and HOAs.
     
  2. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    Land cost money - either rental costs or purchase costs.
     
  3. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    My understanding is that is the complete cost for True Zero with the help of state funds.
     
  4. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    Gasoline is much more highly explosive than any Hydrogen station.
     
  5. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    how odd that anyone would worry about quick charging or L2 infrastructure when so many tens of thousands of units from various companies have already managed. Almost seems like unnecessary hand-wringing Fud.
    .


    Not bad, when Tesla's cheapest offering is less than a BMW 3 Series. Yet they can incorporate enough profit for more Chargers? Geee, once again thanks for the hand-wringing concerns.

    It seems more like the greater quantity of Tesla's sold, the greater number of chargers that will be installed.
    .
     
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  6. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

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    And if I have a really big bucket that really want to fill with alot of water does it have to do with size and speed and the need for an expensive place that has to be built to fill my bucket up with water or do I just use the garden hose (110v) or put a hose on the fire hydrant (220V) late at night?
     
  7. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

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    Guess that explains why they didn't fill the Hindenburg with Gasoline fumes and thought Hydrogen would be less of a fire risk?
     
  8. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    If that is the "complete cost for True Zero with the help of state funds." doesn't that mean the true cost is $700,000 - $800,000 plus the contribution of the state, which is about $1 million?
     
  9. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    No that is the complete costs for the state and True Zero. Why is it so hard to see costs are dropping. Just like the Mirai is $9k less for 2021.
     
  10. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    You need to research this a little better.
     
  11. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    The auto-ignition temperature of a substance is the lowest temperature at which it will spontaneously ignite without the presence of a flame or spark. The auto-ignition temperatures of hydrogen and natural gas are very similar. Both have auto-ignition temperatures over 1,000°F, much higher than the auto-ignition temperature of gasoline vapor.
     
  12. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

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    Yeah, clearly the Hindenburg was completely safe and not a fire risk, which is why they even had a smoking room because luxury travel shouldn't have to keep people from enjoying their cigarettes. And if they had just had made sure the ground wire prevented a spark we'd all still be traveling the world in hydrogen blimps today, right?
     
  13. iplug

    iplug Senior Member

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    So what is the cost difference between the scant building of EV charging infrastructure on existing parking lots and putting up hydrogen infrastructure on more expensive real estate?
     
  14. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    The initial cause was not Hydrogen but the paint used on the exterior coating. The poor conductivity of the aluminum paint coating on the outer skin caused the fire by an electrostatic discharge.
     
  15. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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  16. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    The difficulty I am having is that CA is chipping in $39 million for 36 stations.
    So if the one you quote has a total cost of $700k, why is CA spending so much more on the others?
     
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  17. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    Different methods of production and capacity.
     
  18. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    This is an analyst that doesn’t understand the business model, nor the concept of EV charging.
    80% of charging is done at home/work. So a one to one comparison is not appropriate.
    Second, Tesla could pay that out of cash.

    If looking at replacing the gas infrastructure with hydrogen, you would need a one to one replacement rate.
    For the US, that would be at least half a trillion dollars.
     
  19. iplug

    iplug Senior Member

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  20. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    No, this is about Japan announcing a phase out on new ICE car sales, and more incentives for EVs without mentioning hydrogen. Toyoda is worried about not being ready for shifting to BEVs, and reduced support for FCEVs from the government. It has nothing to do with whether EVs ready, and everything to do with how Toyota makes money.

    Japan's grid is cleaner than the dirty areas in the US. Carbon emissions from plug-ins will be around as good as hybrids there, and better than other ICEs.

    While Japan's grid needs updating for home charging in some areas, they already have an extensive CHAdeMO network.

    State and federal law trumps whatever HOAs claim. Either can pass a law that prevents HOAs from putting chargers in by property owners.

    That cost very likely is not included with the $700k figure you keep stating.

    Evidence.

    But that doesn't change the fact that the regulations covering flammable liquids and gases are different, so that a gasoline station may not automatically be able to sell hydrogen.

    How did Toyota lower the Mirai price in the US, while increasing it in Japan by $4000?

    Autoignition is just one way of igniting something. The other is by spark, and hydrogen-air mixtures only need a tenth of the energy in a spark to ignite than gasoline-air ones. The range over which hydrogen-air mixtures are flammable is much wider than many other materials, including gasoline, natural gas, and diesel.

    Aluminum is a very good conductor, and the cause of the fire is being debated.

    First, plug ins do not need every gasoline station replaced with fast DC chargers.

    Second, it will take trillions of dollars replacing gas stations with hydrogen ones, and installing the infrastructure to support those stations.
     
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