Featured Prius Gen 5 for 2021?

Weird and if you go by this:

Toyota Prius 2020 Edition marks 20 years in the US–with more hybrids coming soon

The fifth paragraph states Toyota says the Prius (not the Prime) LE and XLE will get Android Auto, but not the Limited. I think I’ll wait until the final specs from Toyota, ha ha.


iPad ? Pro

 

wait - you didn't get the triangle of death from the cold solders on the MFD? Many did, including yours truly. It was pretty prevalent down here.
.

 

For Prius to retain it's name meaning (coming before, prior, primary) it should show something not yet seen in the (mass market) product. From the top of my head:
- Solar roof, not just as an option but on every Prius out there
- Solid state batteries (doubt it, but maybe if they delay the introduction of new gen. till 2025)
- All Prii should have a plug and a smallish ~6 kWh battery (solar roof), optionally you could opt for bigger battery for more range (for those that have a convenient overnight charge option at home)

Downsize the engine and upsize the electric power. I would just take 1.5 3 cylinder hybrid engine (91 HP) from the new Yaris and make the battery provide additional 60 HP (small battery) or 100 HP (optional bigger battery), for net hybrid output of 150 HP or 190 HP.

 

The 3 cylinder layout is still to be owner-tested, regarding NVH. To be honest, a Prius should drive smoothly as always have.
I often drive a 1.0 Yaris with a 3 pot engine, and it vibrates.
The larger the engine the better the efficiency, I would bet on upgrading the current 1.8 inline four.

 

Right. I'd bet Toyota is working on even better engine efficiency vs downgrading the engine to a 3 cylinder.

 

Let's take them one by one in reverse order.

A) Solar Roof on all cars
I think economics are not on the side of this. A few solar cells to trickle charge and run fans in the heat sure, but anything big enough to charge the battery is a lot more expensive and only works out for people that leave it outside to charge.

B) Solid State Batteries
This is a possible future but next generation is too early. Solid state are much more expensive than either traditional lithium ion or lithium polymer and it will take a great deal of testing to make sure of reliability. IMHO solid state is still at least a decade away from being cost effective in a small batteries phev. I can see it first in a low volume larger battery more expensive vehicle.

C) Design it from the ground up as a phev, with a small and a big battery size as options and possible downsizing of engine
I like it. Most prius owners live in a home not apartment and corolla and camry hybrids are toyota options that can and currently are sold to people that don't want a plug-in.

Your examples of 60 hp and 100 hp battery may be appropriate. My guess is 6 kwh may be too small for the small battery though. This is mainly driven by battery costs. Rav4 prime and prius prime use less expensive lithium chemistry per kwh than toyota's hybrid lithium, but these provide less power density (kw/kwh).

The current prius prime can do 0-60 in 12.2 seconds when in bev mode using its 8.8 kwh battery. I wouldn't go lower and slower. Probably 10 kwh battery today is about the size and weight of the prius prime battery (slight improvements), then the 18.1 kwh sized pack from the rav4 prime or what will fit well. That pack provides an extra 126 hp in hybrid mode, scaled to the 10 kwh pack that would be 70 hp. Maybe make awd an option only with the bigger pack and let that back mg3 provide the extra power of the pack, where fwd would simply add more range.

Certainly that 1.5L dipi Atkinson 3 cylinder would provide plenty of power and better performance than the 1.8L in the current prius 90hp engine + 70hp from the battery ->. 160 hp versus current 121 hp in the prius liftback and the prime. The current prius prime didn't upgrade electronics and mg2 enough to take advantage of the battery for power.

In a phev application you can really make the lowest speed the engine goes a smooth rpm (maybe 1500). It doesn't need to idle. The extra power can go to charge the battery and be used later. The hsd with mg1 and mg2 is going to smooth it out as well. Then again toyota has a 4 cylinder 150 hp version and that is 41% efficient, versus 40% for the 3 banger. Since you can buffer the excess energy the 4 cylinder 2L engine will have roughly the same efficiency. The only downside is a little weight and cost and these are small. The noise and harshness will definitely be better in the 4 cylinder especially at higher hp.

 

What, your hand doesn't smell like electricity?

 

maybe a little like ozone

Lighting Has a Smell, And The Science Behind It Is Beautiful
.

 

That being said...they are looking to put it on the bed cover on the CyberTruck.

 

Yes, that was 2 years ago, the times are changing. Gen3 Prius had a simple solution to run the fan. Gen 4 plug-in alreray exists with the "real" solar roof (sold in Europe and Japan).

Prices are coming down, they probably won't install the greateast and moast expensive cells that are on satelites orbiting the earth. Choosing the right cells and installing it on every Prius makes it more cost effective, it could still be like $1,000 aditional cost, but so what? Dont wan't it? Buy a Corolla hybrid.

 

It should be noted that automotive “Option” costs bare little bearing on reality
we are complaining about a $3500 solar option up sell meant as a big profit center
when the “Premium“ audio option on some cars is almost as expensive .

And people still pay those option costs for things of questionable merit.

The real cost to the auto maker is likely quite small and volume would reduce it further.

In the mean time if it’s offered as an option some people will poney up and every subsequent owner will benefit, I really don’t see any downsides and the tech will improve over time

 

When the solar panel first came out on the Prius, you couldn't get both it, & fancy adjustable & lumbar support seats. The rationale that Toyota Engineers gave was, "too much weight", meaning the EPA rating was that delicately balanced.
Ironically, solar cells are most efficient when the weather is below 70°f, which is when you need the least amount of cabin Cooling. Jack the temperature up into the 90°+ range & that panel may lose (presuming the sun is even at a decent asthma) a good 40% of its efficiency. Solar panels mounted on a roof of a house will often be a good 6" or more above the shingles or tiles, leaving an air gap underneath to keep the panels from overheating & getting really inefficient. Autos don't have the luxury of installing a solar roof panel above the car's roof, which would be pretty dorky looking - as well as a real death knell to one's drag coefficient.
.

 

I've had my outdoor solar panels for a year, so I know here I average 3.5 kwh a day for each kw of solar panel I've got up, some days I get 6 kwh some I get close to nothing. Many places are not as sunny, and some are more sunny.

The prius prime in japan had an expensive 180 watt solar roof. If you pretend that I parked in a sunny place like my solar roof all the time, not in parking garages and in my garage, etc, you would expect to average about 0.6 kwh a day. Even at $0.15/kwh (I get $0.093/kwh off my utility bill) that's only $350 worth of electricity in 10 years.

So you need to make it bigger to make any sense at all

Toyota is testing a much more efficient solar roof for its electric cars - The Verge


Now we are talking on much more expensive panels and we get to 0.86 KW of panel. Make sure not to crash as insurance is going to be expensive. Now we are talking about $1650 worth of $0.15/kwh electricity over 10 years if you are very carefull to park it outside in without buildings or trees shading it, and in the right direction. My guess is it would cost toyota at least $3K to do this and it to pass crash tests with today's technology. Or you could add an extra 3 kwh of batteries to the phev (toyota's cost is probably $500) and the driver could use it whenever they wanted the extra range without worrying about parking etc.

Well the cyber truck is stainless steel, with flat plates, and larger. They are talking about it possibly adding 15 miles of range I'm guessing that is 1.5 kw of panels, something you can't physically fit on a prius even with the most expensive cells. Additionally my guess is they wouldn't have to modify things to pass crash tests. Still the money will never work out but on an expensive truck some people will think its cool and pay extra. I mean some people paid for the solar roof on the prius and prime.

 

some people thought the gen3 prius solar roof was cool and paid extra. there's something for everyone, but mass production requires a minimum to be profitable

 

Based on your analysis of the solar payback I’m guessing you drive a car without options like AC, electric locks, windows, radio, etc which add Many thousands of dollars to the cars cost but offer absolutely no payback benefit whatsoever

Then there are folks like me, my car is under the sun all but 5 days a year.

I bought a $60 20%+eff
300 watt “Sun” semi flex panel several years ago, it has the consistency of a thin floppy piece of plastic,

If taping a 2lb piece of plastic to the roof causes your car to fail crash tests you have much more serious problems to worry about.
Imagine if the person affixed a heavy roof rack, does the car get crushed?

The reasons provided as to “why we can’t” fall flat since I already own devices that Already can