Featured Li-ion 10 minute charge - 200 - 300 miles / 2,500 life cycle

its exciting to see what may be coming down the road. imagine a 500 mile battery with 5 minute charging at any gas station?

 

2500 charging Cycles has to translate out over 10 years as well. When they remain silent on the length of durability? It makes one Wonder. No one wants to drive 100's of miles each & every day to be able to achieve the same results. Then there's cost ....
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What confuses me is why they use both F and C in the same article.

So, another 20-50 years of R&D and might figure something out?

 

The Tesla battery management heats for charging and cools for operation.

Bob Wilson

 

That's great; what kind of a cable and other hardware would be needed to charge @ 300-450 kW?

What does it do when it toggles between "discharge" and "regen" during normal driving?

 

Here are my sources:

I recommend playing them under YouTube so you can set the playback speed fast. Regardless, the common observations:

1. Tesla battery management system (BMS) adds heat to the battery when charging. This includes using the motors as coolant heat sources that are pumped through the battery.
2. BMS reduces heat in the battery during operation.

Bob Wilson

 

I have attempted to watch a few of Nyland's vids, and I know exactly what you mean

 

Because science is almost exclusively done in Celsius, but the press release is for the US public so it has to be in Fahrenheit for them to understand.

 

The irony of this situation that for the International System of Units (SI) the Celsius is as frivolous a unit of measurement as the Fahrenheit, the official one for temperature being the Kelvin

 

I saw an interesting vehicle that I believe was built by A123. They introduced a hybrid vehicle that used a combination of super capacitors + batteries. Not sure what happened to that test vehicle which I believe that they were shopping to the big automakers. A123 just offers low voltage systems today. This was a few years ago and maybe the technology wasn't quite ready yet.

Super caps can be charged or discharged almost instantaneously but they don't have the energy density of batteries. Batteries have a higher energy density but are limited in how fast they can be charged or discharged. The test vehicle had a management system to use the best features of both super caps and batteries.

With Prius, regenerative braking is proportional to brake pedal pressure up to a battery limit of about 110 amps. More pedal pressure than the 110 amps results in more friction braking for the additional braking force so energy is lost in harder stops.

With this system, during regenerative braking, the inverter could pump up the batteries like it normally does but it would also pump up the caps to high voltages and then the inverter can discharge the caps into the batteries at a safe lower rate that is acceptable for the batteries. The combined system would capture more of the energy than just using batteries alone.

During vehicle acceleration, the caps could also provide high instantaneous current to the motors whereas the internal resistance of batteries limits them. In the case of our Prius the most that I have seen on my ScanGauge is around 110 amps. This system could yield a vehicle with faster acceleration.

The technology might also shorten charging times for EV's and PHEV's as the battery charging would continue even after unplugging the vehicle as the capacitors and batteries equalize.

This system would add more complexity to an already complex system but if efficiency or performance are improved, it may be the next step.

 

There is R&D going on for cooled cables.

There is a temperature range at which the battery is efficient at both charging and discharging. Both of those processes heat up the battery, so it needs to be cooled when a BEV is driven. Well, most of the time. A winter drive with a lot of 'idling' might require heating the battery.

When charging, the battery had likely cooled off to below the optimal temperature, so the system will heat it up. It will also cool it if the conditions require it.

Mazda's iEloop regen system uses a super cap. It is for non-hybrids, so it is sized to match the limited captured energy from the alternator.

 

ah yes - A123 .... speaking of painful memories, Billy Crystal's character, "Miracle Max" once said;

any way - long ago we we're believers in their product, but when they went bankrupt, we lost our shirts. iirc, their remnants were bought up by a Chinese subsidiary & that business line is doing okay with power storage in large applications such as blackout prevention, similar to Tesla.
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There could be a lot of choices. When Tesla superchargers went from version 2 (125-150 kw) to version 3 (250 kw) the cable got smaller

According to the company, the cable is “significantly lighter, more flexible, and more efficient” than their current air-cooled cable found on the V2 Superchargers.

Tesla launches new Supercharger with 1,000 mph charging, better efficiency, and more - Electrek

There is a picture at the link of the cables

Mike

 

StoreDot: Nanotechnology With Novel Organic Compounds Here is a battery demoed in a scooter that can charge in 5 minutes. It uses a different chemistry to do this safely. They hope to have a factory built in 2022 to build batteries for cell phones and cars. The technology is here to do that, the question is cost compared to current leader tesla/panasonic packs built with regular lion chemistry 2170 and liquid cooling. I doubt these solutions will be in cars 5 years from now, but I expect them in 10 years.

I think tesla model 3 may do what penn state is outlining partially on the v3 (250KW) superchargers.

Yep another possibility of many that may be the next battery. The big problems with solid state are longevity and cost. I'm sure they can produce prototypes next year, but most figure 2025 at the earliest to bring costs down. Toyota's partner panasonic said 10 years last year (2028), but definitely might be less expensive to make than the 2021 mirai ;-)

Combo plug (CCS) are the only ones built commercially so far. At 400 V 400KW is 1000A, which is not that high for power applications. These cables are liquid cooled though.

 

It's amazing how much Tesla has done to make the BEV a bona fide commercial product. It's even more amazing how little some other manufacturers have done. Still more amazing is that the likes of the Leaf and the i3 still come with with a $7,500.00 tax rebate and Teslas don't ... As they say, Mind boggles.

 

Yeah, technically true as Kelvin means you're always using positive numbers. However, in practice I've found that scientists generally talk/measure in Celsius (for temps above freezing) and then convert to Kelvin (which is easy by just adding 273.15).

Now, if you really want to be a masochists, start measuring temperature in Rankine

 

I have found out that the temperature stays the same whether you measure it in F's, C's or do not measure it at all. So, why even bother

 

Regardless, my wife finds it too cold and I find it too hot.

Bob Wilson