Experience with Ethanol-Free Gas?

-3% is the energy content difference of E10 vs. E0 (which relates to MPG). But normal E0 gasoline can vary about 7% according to EPA (old data). We would need EPA to conduct vehicle tests to understand actual real world impact of E10 for each vehicle, which is cost prohibitive so they are not planning to do that.

 

87 octane E0 delivers the best MPG for 87 octane gasoline vehicles. Designated 87 octane E10 is a mix of 10percent 114 octane ethanol & 90 percent 84 octane gasoline, none of the components which are 87 octane. My last five 87 octane gasoline (non-hybrid, non-diesel, non-turbo) vehicles have gained 8% to 5% better MPG, burning E0, rather than using (not burning efficiently) E10.
Side note: Anyone getting any knocking while using 87 octane E10..... the 84 octane gasoline molecules are probably causing the knocking. Switching to 87 octane E0 could (should?) end your knocking problems.

 

Nah! Grassroots efforts only have raised the number of gas stations delivering ethanol-free E0 from several thousand to 13,900+. Even with "ethanol in gasoline industry" propaganda pushing E85, their own information reports only about 4000 stations delivering E85. Even in corn states: Iowa has 213 stations serving E85, BUT 322 stations serving E0. Minnesota has 451 E85 stations, but 651 E0 stations. One state alone, has E0 stations, comprising 23% of all E85 stations in the U.S. Yeah! Grassroots is stronger (& more accurate) than "ethanol in gasoline industry" propaganda & lobbying.

 

"ethanol in gasoline" industry has more bribing lobbying funds available.

 

There IS no gasoline molecule. Gasoline is a mixture, not a compound. Almost none of the molecules in gasoline will have 87 Octane. That is why they mix it.

"At the end of the refining process, finished gasoline typically contains more than 150 separate compounds although as many as 1,000 compounds have been identified in some blends." - https://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp72-c4.pdf

 

Mine do not and there is a very dramatic change in the energy math winter to summer even with e0.

My guess is you have very poorly tuned vehicles, my fuel economy notably drops around e50 but below that it’s nearly within the margin of error, especially in warm weather months.

I’ve found e15-e30 deliver much better than expected fuel economy during the summer months, only time I would consider e0 is if it’s cheap during the winter mainly because the car warms up faster on the stuff.

Also e10 reduces emissions, non oxygenated gas makes more co and soot than e10, hence why the mandate.

There is only one reasonably priced local e0 regular unleaded supplier but he still runs 10-20% higher per gallon which does nothing to the bottom line.

 

I just passed one E0 supplier I no longer use.

E10: 2.00
E0: 3.30

I buy any E0 for my 2-cycle engines & old garden tractor elsewhere. They used to be only 50 cents higher for E0.

 

My EPA rated 32MPG 87 octane gasoline engine delivers MPG higher than 35MPG & sometimes 40+MPG.... during the winter. Summertime, eight tanks in a row were over 40MPG, four tanks over 44MPG, one tank, 47+MPG, & one 48+MPG(50% more than EPA highway & that tank was not all highway). Two other 87 octane gasoline engines, badmouthed for sub-30MPG performance by leadfooters, have AVERAGED 37-39MPG, both with highs of 45 & 46MPG..... all with E0, no hybrid, no diesel, no turbo. You guess wrong on my cars, you guess wrong about the inferiority of 87 octane E10 ethanol blend, none of fuel, which is 87 octane. The inferiority of heavily lobbied E10 is obvious, even to E10 advocates. But they talk a broken game to support the "ethanol in gasoline industry".

 

I passed an 87 octane E10 station selling for $2.30. An hour later, I saw another 87 octane E10 supplier selling for $3.30.

 

Just blowin' smoke to hide the fact that 87 octane E0 gets 8% to 5% better MPG than 87 octane E10 & the "ethanol in gasoline industry" lobbies Congress & Pressy-dent "don'T rump" to maintain a wide gap between E10 & E0.

 

Nah! People using E0 have had emissions tests performed. Not only did they pass emissions tests, but were commended for excellent low emissions. You see, ethanol WILL BURN CLEAN in a 114 octane, high compression ratio (15:1) ethanol engine (INDY race car). But 114 octane ethanol used (not burned efficiently) in an 87 octane low compression ratio (9:1 to 11:1) gasoline engine misses the power stroke & doesn't burn clean.

 

Wow.
That's like.....science and stuff, huh?
If a car designed to run on 87 octane is "knocking" and this goes away with E0, which is usually 90 octane ( (R+M)/2) then you're not "fixing" anything, but rather AT BEST you're masking a problem that as nothing to do with hooched gas.

Ah...."statistics."
I guess that's "math and stuff" - huh?

Here's the thing.
I'm not paying 50-70 cents MORE for gas just because of some label that suggests that it may be alcohol-free.....otherwise????
Why drive a Prius in the first place???

If you're religiously or ecologically motivated to do the Carrie Nation thing, then that's respectable....but you should USE that motivation to become more familiar with how gasoline is formulated and how closed-loop fuel injection equipped ICE cars work (and stuff.)
Otherwise you might as well be working for Big Corn.....

Either way....
Non-hooched gas makes zero economical sense......unless you own a gas station.

 

I no longer use the E0 source one town from me. I no longer use an E0 source two towns from me. But I found another E0 source selling for 30 to 40 cents less than the others, three towns away..... fortunately a direction I often travel.

 

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/369f/16908af28997882e1f1565f08a900d9d2d6f.pdf

There are hundreds of scholarly studies that state the opposite

In any event my 1970 Subaru 360 2 stroke car with no cat and oil injection passes emissions tests, passing isn’t anything special to be proud of.

So emissions tests are there to find gross polluters not vehicles with normal wear, in other words your vehicle is designed to pass emissions no matter what you burn but that doesn’t indicate you have better emissions on e0 versus e10.

 

Most people use designated 87 octane E10 in their 87 octane gasoline designed engine. However, designated 87 octane E10 is 114 octane ethanol AND 84 octane gasoline molecules. Most 87 octane vehicles can use this concoction. But some 87 octane gasoline engines will knock. By burning 87 octane E0, the octane rating is boosted by 3 points & knocking may end.

 

To Sporin, I honestly don’t care much about ethanol but there are a lot of misconceptions being published here on octane and fuel behavior, along with a faulty belief that moldy nasty field corn grown only because of ethanol production equates to food for fuel.
a little accurate science along with real world use in a modern engine comes to a YMMV depending on the age of the car and compression ratio alongside the wear and overall condition of the motor.

Yeah there is no stating factual information with you is there?

You do realize 84 octane e0 gasoline has more BTUs per gallon than 87 octane e0?

Ethanol is taking the place of VOCs and aeromatics like benzene
a homogeneous mixture that tests as 87 octane will not knock any more if it has benzene to boost its octane vrs ethanol to do the same.
The compounds that boost octane in e0 are much more carcinogenic than ethanol and emissions of the same increase in e0.

Key is that ethanol cools the charge and affects fuel vapor point which should reduce knocking not increase it, assuming the car has a working o2 sensor to hold proper stoic that is.

 

3% difference in energy. Sorry that bothers you. But I understand mere facts won't change your opinion.

 

Funny thing....
I tried and tried and couldn't find a copy of "No War for Corn!"

The only corn I actually saw in the sand-box during the year I spent there was in a large #10 can.....or in a foil MRE pouch.
(Mexican style corn or "Corn Nutz" depending on the meal......)

 

Chevron here is 3.29 in CA for regular.

Gotta love living here, new CA modified law is if your exhaust pipe have been modified, louder than 95db and your vehicle is less than 3 tons, you’ll be fined up to $1,000 & must go to court for hearing. Until it is fixed and state evaluated by a rep to pass, you’ll be fined each time pulled over by a cop