Plug-in Prius Battery Upgrade

Do you have a link to the numbers (spreadsheet?) you're using? Everything I've seen implies the opposite, unless someone isn't using comparable cars (eg a Mitsubishi Mirage base vs a PIP base), but even then it can be pretty close given the price Toyota has been selling their PIPs for recently.

 

I don't think I've saved the spreadsheet, but seriously, how complicated is it to calculate?

I assumed a 2 liter per 100 km saving with the Prius vs the Corolla (conservatively). Assuming any inflationary increase in fuel costs per year, that's about $2.20 per 100 kms (adjusted for today's dollars). In order to get that $7000 (hybrid no-rebate, premium) back, you to divide $7000/2.2*100= 318,100 kms = 197,596 miles.

 

ben must be busy installing those large batteries he found online.

 

I don't get the same numbers, but they're close. I see a Corolla LE at $18300 versus a Prius II at $24200 (similar features, the base Corolla is really striped down), so a difference of $5900. Gas savings would equate to a difference of ~$6200 over 200k miles. Given gas prices in Canada, that payoff period would be ~150k miles.

In addition, you're comparing a compact car to a mid-size car, and I think the mid-size car has more in the way of options, so it's not an apples to apples comparison. Shoot, you could compare a new Prius to a 1981 VW Golf diesel, or a bicycle, but that's not what most people consider a reasonable comparison. With all that aside, what I really don't understand is how the larger car having fewer expenses over ~150k-200k that isn't considered paying off itself in most cases.

 

without the inventors pushing the envelop and the manufactures to keep pace with new technologies
we would still be driving at 20 to 30 mpg and standard oil would be that much more profitable.
And a lot of those inventors work out of there garages for a bunch of reasons.

But if one doesn't trust or has misgivings about a project for whatever reasons, then I think it would be wise not to support that project.

 

Depends on how often you can charge. My commute is about 18 miles each way and I can charge at work now. My MPG is over 100MPG... Actually 100-150MPG depends on how I drive; and this include weekend that I can't charge once I leave the house for more than 100 miles drive.

My last tank, my MPG was 106.6MPG !!!

 

They went bankrupt - in part due to failures in quality.

Best not to gamble. A fire is evidence of a lack of required build understanding/caution & skill. However, there ARE some talented EE's in our group ... and Phill (pEEf) can show how well the job can be done. He not only built a great system, he built his own controller, as well as thermal management system.

Update and technical details on my PHEV project | PriusChat

IIRC, he's getting an easy 25 miles of EV range, w/out having to upgrade suspension ... which would have further compromised range, more than just the extra battery weight.

'

 

Plug in Supply went bankrupt?
I don't think so.
Here is their Web site Plug-In Supply | Plug-In Upgrades for the Toyota Prius

Perhaps you are confusing PIS with Enginer?
Enginer stopped producing their kits due to quality issues.

 

A lesson from WWII: Early in the war, German equipment was vastly superior to what most other countries produced. The Allies were scrambling to produce something equivalent to what the Germans had. Later in the war, it was the Germans producing machines that failed on the battlefield, due to them being rushed into production too quickly, without adequate time for testing.

The lesson of this? Testing makes all the difference. Amateurs have neither the time nor the expertise to match the extensive testing being done by the auto-makers.

 

EDIT:

Oops ... yes. I was thinking the Enginer system/kit - and their quality issues.

With the conversion folks down the road from us at 'Jungle Motors' copying a similar name (same acronym) ...
Problem with Jungle Motors | PriusChat

I can hardly keep the conversion folks straight. And it's a drag when honest companies get associated with the dishonest ones. And while I'm editing - there's a nice description of who some of the parties are (were) who have come & gone:
Competitors | Plug-In Supply
I'd LOVE to get that mongo 15kWh pack for our Lexus 400h hybrid SUV. Big bucks. Maybe some day.
.

 

hill, I'm still pretty sure you meant Enginer, not PIS. You may want to correct it in your post #70.

 

Dang yes if I didn't do it again - I'll go fix it

 

Ben,

If you want more EV performance you should consider a car with more EV performance engineered from the beginning.
Don't add a patch to your PiP. Li-ion batteries need Thermal Management to be safe and last a long time.

The normal Prius had a patch added by the factory.
That's where the PiP came from. And it has a very minimal TM system (a fan).

 

i think you missed ben's post on trading the pip for a tesla.

 

Yes, I missed that, sorry. But I still don't see him mentioning a Tesla anywhere.

A B/A BEV is a whole different story.
But you still can't go anywhere at anytime with one of those. If you have a second car those might work for you...

 

he tried the large batteries he saw online, but they just didn't work out that well. tesla made more sense, no heavy lifting.

 

Hmmmmm - this all sounds familiar. We're not going there again, are we Bill? There IS another venue for Volt discussion.

 

The OP was asking about an add-on battery for a PiP.
If done properly this sounds like a great idea! Have any of the battery kit businesses installed in a PiP yet? Prices?

The PiP (vs. the Prius) already has the SW allowing decent 3-season EV performance. Adding an extra battery pack could easily double EV range.
If the performance of a PiP suits you, this is a viable option for a PiP that is out of warranty.
( Or, installed so it can be removed without a trace before any service visit...)
The one difficult item for this installation might be plumbing TMS hot air out of the cabin, or not.

The OP should start on his Solar Installation now!!
I'd wait for one of those shops to design and test a kit for a PiP.

 

The regular Prius comes with a 60 kW electric motor, yet it has a small battery-pack which only delivers a fraction of that. How do you explain such obvious under-utilization?

Toyota built a system that could be upgraded when cost of the battery dropped to a competitive level. The strategy of planning ahead to minimize financial risk and to fully test the system ahead of time is called good business. Calling that a "patch" is inappropriate.

We can clearly see how the extra power from the larger battery improves the regular Prius without having to do anything other than the pack upgrade itself. It's a package option, in a market where using electricity is still a niche and is still dependent on tax-credit incentives.

 

"nice oscar" is my name on YouTube. I added a range extender battery pack on my plug in prius and nothing changed! It takes long to charge but the range is almost the same. I built a pack using Tesla Battery Module. 7p56s, (3.7v, 3.3mhA each cell), (207.2volts, 23.1A battery pack) which is 4.7kwh battery. The ev range has not improved much.

I did this because I want my plug in prius to be a 5 seater 50-80 miles EV and engine run at higher speeds. Nothing is working according to plan so far. I don't have any error codes.