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Block heater power feed

Discussion in 'Prime Technical Discussion' started by Leadfoot J. McCoalroller, Jun 21, 2018.

  1. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    Technical question- If you take a plug-in prius and equip it with a block heater, is there any provision to power that heater from the existing charge input connector?

    Or would one need to plug the car in twice?
     
    #1 Leadfoot J. McCoalroller, Jun 21, 2018
  2. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    Twice. The ESVE does not necessarily send 110 volts to the car.
     
    #2 JimboPalmer, Jun 21, 2018
  3. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    Wow, what a missed opportunity! Too bad they didn't have the foresight to build it in.

    Oh well, maybe on the next generation.
     
    #3 Leadfoot J. McCoalroller, Jun 21, 2018
  4. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    Not likely. Not THAT many people use engine heaters.
    Not worth their time and money to do something like that.
    It would just be something else to go wrong with the charging cord/equipment.
     
    #4 sam spade 2, Jun 21, 2018
  5. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    Looks like the Toyota part draws 4 amps at 120 volts.

    The EVSE may provide 12 Amps at 120 volts (charge time would climb to 8.5 hours) or 16 Amps at 240 volts and need a tranformer to make 120 volts. (charge time would climb to 3.5 hours)

    In comparison, a second plug that does not mess with charge time is not bad.

    As to Toyota wanting it, how cold does it get in Japan?
     
    #5 JimboPalmer, Jun 21, 2018
  6. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    You mean the existing block heater part. I guess I would kind of expect Toyota to come up with a multi-voltage, CANBUS enabled block heater for a plug-in prius.

    As to how cold it gets? Well, it's (fortunately) always less than 170°F, so in theory any vehicle using one will receive a benefit in reduced warm-up time, lower emissions and reduced fuel usage.

    In practice the benefits are tangible but not huge. It's inconvenient to plug in the car vs. the benefits perceived by the average driver. But that all changes when you have to plug the car in anyway- so in my mind they really blew it with this EVSE design. With any luck it will be superseded before long.

    Energy is energy- you can buy it at the pump or from the wire. If you use grid electricity to pre-heat the engine, you won't have to use gasoline to do it.
     
    #6 Leadfoot J. McCoalroller, Jun 21, 2018
    Mendel Leisk likes this.
  7. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    Which is exactly why every car that is built does NOT come with a block heater as standard equipment.

    What do you think the duty cycle is for the typical vehicle......that is, how long is it OFF between uses ??
    I'm betting that it is ON for only about 10% of the time.
    Since it is designed to shed heat and not retain it, trying to keep the block hot for that other 90% of the time just doesn't make practical sense.......by any measurement.
     
    #7 sam spade 2, Jun 22, 2018
  8. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    In certain Canadian regions some manufacturers put in block heaters by default. I know of one in-the-family car thus, an Ontario purchased Pontiac Vibe. They didn't know it had a block heater, had never used it, but there it was, when I looked.

    Maybe similar story in the US north-central States, and Alaska?

    I think it's designed to do both. Especially with the advent of engine undercovers, active grill shutters and the like.

    My usage is to plug in about 2 hours prior to the first cold-start of the day, whenever practical. This raises the coolant temp by about 20~25C.
     
    #8 Mendel Leisk, Jun 22, 2018
  9. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    My rebuttal was for the suggestion that ALL cars should have them.....everywhere.......and they should be used all the time.
     
    #9 sam spade 2, Jun 22, 2018
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  10. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    Ok, understand.

    I'd almost say the first statement should be the case, because: it is so easy and cheap to put these in at the factory, in the course of installing the engine. Dealer install with a lot of vehicles involves draining brand-new coolant, and working in very awkward access condtions.
     
    #10 Mendel Leisk, Jun 22, 2018
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