Featured Ford to stop selling most cars in North America

This doesn't exclude small improvements from happening. If not already available, next year's Energi gets a larger battery, increasing the capacity to 9kWh and range to 25 miles. Depending on the cost analysis, dropping in a more efficient engine or hybrid system could happen.

 

the trick is to speed it up 50% .... that way you get the frantic factor over & done with much quicker. Plus, with all of his distracting arm flapping, the entertainment value increases - makes him look like a baby albatross trying to get airborne.

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i don't get the tesla ford relationship. ford has a large cross section of buyers, tesla does not.

 

Sorry if my generalities are misleading. I come from Alfa Romeo Spider Veloce and GTVs, both of which are exceptionally fine handling small cars. They will out stop, out brake, just about anything on the road that is much larger like any SUV or any truck. They are scarcely affected by crosswinds, and are very stable at speeds well over a hundred miles an hour. My Honda Civic hatchbacks were very nimble and easy to park with amazing storage capacity. My Acura Integra Type R was blisteringly fast, easy to drive, had decent storage, was incredibly reliable like ALL the previously mentioned small cars, and like the Alfas had fantastic steering feedback. None of these cars had particularly smooth rides; you felt the bumps. But who cares, when you are in CONTROL of such marvelous engineering! I've driven all types of trucks, vans, SUVs, and other Lumber Wagons, and folks there ain't no way these Behemoths can even approach the satisfaction I get driving my small cars!

The Prime is surprisingly "curve friendly", much better than my 2012 PIP, and both of these have sensational brakes. Total reliability, serviceability, sensational fuel economy, and minimal service requirements make these 2 cars great to own. But I still crave my small, 2+2, hatchback coupes, ultralight and efficient that will dazzle any discriminating driver.
The Prime gets closer to FUN than the PIP; now like most of us Americans, it needs to lose 2 doors, and go on a diet. Then take all the trucks and SUVs, melt them down, and deliver the slag heap to Ford (Fix Or Repair Daily, for you acronym lovers!). Hey, I don't have any opinions!!


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That's quite a list of cars, you have good taste . The best handling car I've ever driven by far was a Mazda3. From there it's a long way down to the next, which is probably a toss-up between a Taurus wagon, a Chevette and a Mustang. The Taurus just handled way better than a car that size should. The Chevette had the advantage of being very light with rear drive and no power steering or brakes. The Mustang doesn't really handle, but it's got decent grip and a big engine which makes entrance ramps a lot of fun.

 

I've been lucky enough to own 2 Alfa Spiders (1.3 Veloce and 1.6), 3 Porsches (914, Boxster, Boxster S), a BMW 2002, and dozens of utilitarian vehicles from Ford Falcon to VW Type 4 Wagon to Grand Caravan while we were in the two kids through grad school stage of our lives.

No question that there is an enormous difference in handling between these vehicles when cars are driven anywhere close to the limits. But for 98.7% of my driving, it doesn't matter. 36HP, solid axle, staggered tires, alloy wheels, special shocks...they all have gotten me there.

I'm limited by the roads I drive on, the traffic in front of me, and the thought of what a ticket costs me in insurance if I get one. I actually traded in both a SUV and a Boxster for the Prius wagon. I want utility, reliability, economy, safety, ergonomics, comfort. I'm not driving 1300 miles in a day any more. Nor cutting the apex in corners. Get me there.

My wife prefers what I call a plushmobile. Upscale sedan. I consider her car over powered, over assisted, ponderous, expensive.

Different choices for different people and at different points in our lives.

 

This pretty much is why I bought a Prius. To bring the topic back to Ford cars, I did consider a Focus at the time, but strangely the Ford dealer only had loaded, top of the line models on the lot for $25K+ IIRC. I'm not sure if all Ford dealers are like this, but there was very little selection if you were looking for the basic model of a car. The Toyota dealer had a good selection across the entire model range.

Given the problems with the Ford PowerShi(f)t transmission, I don't regret going with the Toyota at all.

 

Yeah you're right. The demographics have changed; we DIY car owners are a dying breed, besides cars today are so OVERCOMPLICATED, that you neither can, nor need to work on them anymore; too much electronic crap. My current attitude, as long as I can afford it, is to replace any car after a hundred thousand or so miles.
My last three cars were like this and it has worked out great for me. Absolutely no unscheduled repairs (other than current shocking double flats on my Prime). I still long for simpler, smaller, more agile, reliable cars.

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I test drove a Focus back in 2004 or 2005. Seemed like it would be a fun car to drive, but after driving a Taurus and Ranger for years, I was feeling like giving another brand a try.

 

The valuation of ford has now fallen behind the valuation of tesla. The reason is the ford car division loses money. Investing more in a money loser is something ford can no longer afford. The odds of the fiesta or taurus ever making economic profits are extremely low.

If gas prices go up in 5 years, what do you think will sell better? A tesla model 3 or a ford fusion? How much would you invest in the fusion, with the bet that oil will get more expensive? It seems in a land of expensive oil a phev escape, or a tesla model 3, would outsell a fusion or a focus.

 

improved fiesta/focus. and possibly a hybrid fusion, if they downsize it a bit, and keep improving mpg's.
sorry, i'm not convinced bev's are going to take over the world in the next round of gas price increase's.

 

Neither does Ford, which is why they are investing in PHEVs, and thus hybrids too.
But the fuel economy ratings between their cars and similar sized SUVs is close. The difference combined rating of the Focus with 1L engine to the Ecosport with the same engine, and the Fusion to Escape with the same 1.5L engine, is 3mpg. Oh, and the Escape is AWD to the Fusion's FWD.
Compare Side-by-Side


Comparable hybrid models would likely be equally close. The Rav4 hybrid is rated 30mpg in its worse category, and it is using Toyota's last generation hybrid system and engine. A new Escape hybrid should beat that. If given the choice during high gas prices between a hybrid Fusion and a hybrid Escape that got slightly worse fuel economy, Ford's customers in the US would likely still choose the Escape.

We would like to see Ford continue to invest in actual cars, but F150 profits can only carry so much. Better for us and them to invest it into hybrids and EVs than some car body styles that are no longer popular with the general public. The car sales boom of the past few years is coming to an end. Ford and the rest are preparing for lower sales figures in the future.

 

Americans do not buy expensive small cars. That is what the fiesta is. Toyota does not make any money on its own yaris in north america, they were losing it. Mazda makes them a yaris based on the mazda 2 platform for the US, and mazda is not selling their own mazda 2 here, so that toyota and mazda don't compete on it.

Ford is not killing the focus, they simply dropping it to one model the active. They are killing the taurus, and no one was really buying it anyway.

The fusion/fusion hybrid/fusion energi - there is no date for killing them. The fusion energi and hybrid will compete with the tesla model 3 in a few years when tesla can make enough of them. Last month tesla model 3 outsold every car in its class but the mercedes c class. As they get better at building them prices will drop, leaving less room for camry, accord, fusion, etc. The lower end of the market has low margins. Ford simply is lowering investments. As someone else noted on this thread, small improvements like engine and head units will make it, but ford has no plans right now to spend a billion on a redesign. In 5 years today's fusion may seem old, but they are going to milk it for now.

Ford says that this plan will save them $5B in operating costs. Let's say they were getting $4.9 B back from car sales with a net loss of $100M. Removing the costs and sales will make ford's profitability look much better.

Margin's are high on the F series. If that was a stand alone business ford's stock would probably be at $20/share. Its hard firing all those people and closing all those factories though. The dealers also don't like it. Killing the fiesta and taurus are good business though. Downsing the fiesta and focus and improving mpgs isn't going to help profitability. fiesta has to compete in a low profit market place. Focus has to compete with the corolla and civic. Spending a couple of billion to redesign the 2 cars for the north american market seems like a terrible investment. Car sales peaked in the US in 2016, and will probably fall for the next few years. The only bright spot for car sales in north america is plug-ins. Hybrid car sales have fallen along with non hybrid cars.

 

wsj article says ford can play the system by selling more large vehicles which don't require carb credits.

 

Did you mean CAFE? The only credits I'm familiar with for CARB are the ZEV ones, and the major car companies have to sell so many of those.

The only thing besides true heavy trucks Ford sells that don't need to meet CAFE are the F250 and 2500 class Transit and larger versions. The pick ups can be really nice, but unless a person truly needs the extra payload and power, most people opt for the "cheaper" F150. The diesel fanboys don't even have to buy big anymore.

The large size Expedition isn't even available anymore. A V8 is no longer available for it either.

Ford could start offering such a huge SUV, I guess, but that only helps them with CAFE if they also stop offering the F150 too. Despite what reactions people have to hearing that SUV sales are up, the truth is that car buyers are not choosing larger cars. The SUVs being bought are roughly the same size as the sedans bought in the past.