Featured E.P.A. Prepares to Roll Back Rules Requiring Cars to Be Cleaner and More Efficient

Thanks bob. I think its your combined unadjusted fuel economy + some bonuses based on technology. That puts the figures properely with the car and driver chart, although some are slightly higher in that chart based on bonuses.

 

Some models might just make it with the advances in ICE technology, and a cheap mild hybrid system can help many others.

I'm alright with adjusting the target MPG for the truck to car mix that is being sold now, but a tax is needed to help the car companies sell efficient cars.

Yes, there is always going to be some NOx, HC, and CO to deal with. Some of those spike on engine start up regardless of current temperatures, which hybrids do more often.

The switch to ultra low sulfur gasoline is to reduce some emissions, and allow more effective catalytic converters.

They show both; the others are further down.

Only their window sticker combined is the same; city and highway are different. These are also adjusted values, and may not have been adjusted the exact same way for each car.

 

It's combined unadjusted that's used for CAFE, not highway unadjusted, for what it's worth - so a lot of the cars on that list shouldn't be there.

 

Over time when I've compared the Fuelly data to the EPA metrics, I got the impression that Toyota was 'sand bagging' the window sticker numbers. This has the advantage of delivering more than promised which leads to customer loyalty.

The performance of individual cars will typically follow a Bell curve distribution centered about the midpoint. By reducing the advertised performance, a larger portion of owners will see better than expected performance. In contrast, a vendor who follows the allowed performance range will find roughly half will get worse and be disappointed.

Bob Wilson

 

Although I agree with a strict interpretation for CAFE, my interest was to show both city and highway metrics. It supports what we found when looking at Fuelly metrics of the Ioniq Blue and Prius ECO.

After removing the single entry, Fuelly buckets, the Prius ECO was significantly more efficient than the Ioniq Blue. Even the Fuelly averages show the Prius ECO was more efficient. Then it occurs that those choosing a fuel efficient car are going to be City folks versus Country folks. My Country relatives for good reason have one or more, well used pickups. They may have a luxury car to visit kin. There is self-selection by City folks for efficient, urban cars which explains the Fuelly results.

Now I'm beginning to wonder if this may be a way to identify the over and under performing cars in Fuelly.

Bob Wilson

 

Source: Scott Pruitt: EPA Chief Faces Mounting Scrutiny For Ethics Violations : NPR

Well there is always the unknown.

Bob Wilson

 

Actually, I wonder if that could explain some of the reported high efficiency of TDIs - I mean, we know some of them cheated, but some of it might simply be usage model.

TDIClub seems to have quite a lot of deep rural people, who are running very long trips (50+ mile one way - some even complain that a Model 3 LR doesn't have enough range for regular trips of theirs), and possibly a significant portion at lower speeds.

But, of course, anything will get fantastic mileage if you set the cruise for 60 MPH and then drive a bunch of miles. I mean, I can bang out 70+ MPG on my Prius driving like that. (People on TDIClub really don't like when I mention beating their hypermiling scores that they have to try for, without trying... and then I subtract 13% from the fuel consumption to convert it to MPG diesel equivalent.)

(Also, worth noting that the 1978 standards expect lower speeds, so a lower speed driver will be more accurately reflected by them. A more aggressive, higher-speed driver may well be more accurately reflected by the newer standards.)

 

Not much here except negotiations ongoing-
Quietly, Trump Officials and California Seek a Deal on Car Emissions - The New York Times

In general I feel some automakers may like stricter MPG standards, just need more time.

 

They realize the car market isn't just the US, and relaxing US standards isn't going to change Europe and China making them stricter.

 

When I had the TDIs, the best I could average was in the mid to high 40s, and that was with keeping the speeds at posted and using cruise control on long trips.

 

I could average about 50 mpg on my fathers 01 auto TDI Jetta, which I’m told is very good,

But at what cost, remove emissions from the discussion and the damns things cost thousands a year in maintenance to keep running.

Never drove such an unreliable car with such expensive parts.

Heck even the glovebox broke,

Wth, it’s a plastic box, never had one break on any vehicle before.

 

I second El Dobro and Rmay63503 remarks. My 2006 TDI NB (bought new) was the most expensive car to maintain and repair I've owned to date...and I'm a career Mechanic that's been on this planet for a long time.

 

The gen2 Prius tester turned lunch getter at the dealer I got my gen2 from had a broken glove box.

 

To fix the problem did you have to tear apart the shifter and center console and then use voodoo to remove a hidden bolt facing the firewall?

 

The dealership just used blue masking tape.