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need some maintenance opinions, please

Discussion in 'Prius c Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by cutter44, Jul 9, 2017.

  1. cutter44

    cutter44 Member

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    Okay, I have an interesting Sunday night ponderable for you, and I could use your thoughts.

    I own a 2012 Prius C Four with 89k miles on it (I bought it with 34k). I'm very happy with it and the only issues I've had with it (charcoal canister replacement - twice) have been covered under my Platinum extended warranty. I've done my own oil changes every 10k miles, I did the drain/fill on my transmission fluid at about 36k miles, just because I wanted to know it was done. I changed the engine air filter at about 35k miles and the cabin air filter a couple of times since I've owned it. Other than that stuff and wiper blade inserts a couple of times, I haven't done any other routine maintenance. As I said, the car is running fine and I have no complaints.

    Now, I happen to have come into a few extra dollars and I'm wondering if I should "invest" it into some preventive maintenance on this car. While I have no indication that brake work is needed, as far as I know these are the original pads/rotors. I live in Massachusetts, so I do see a fair amount of rust on the rotors, but I've experienced no issues with braking. I notice bumps on the road, but have no clue if that means shocks or struts (or whatever) need to be looked at. As far as I know, this has its original 12 volt battery.

    I certainly don't want to spend money needlessly, and the last thing I want to do is bring it to a dealer and say, "do whatever you think you need to do". I've already bought snow tires for the upcoming winter, so I'm all set there.

    So lets say you were in my situation and had a few hundred dollars to put into the car. What would you be inclined to do to it? I'm not talking cosmetics here; simple keeping it running as well as I can. I'd like to hold onto this sucker for another 89k miles if I can. Or should I just put the money aside in the event something does come up?

    I appreciate your thoughts.
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i would go by the manual, maybe change the tranny oil again, do a deep inspection and lube on the brakes and look at the tyres for uneven treadler that might indicate suspension issues. all the best!(y)
     
  3. ztanos

    ztanos All-around Geek!

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    Did they ever figure out why you had to replace the charcoal canister... once, let alone twice?

    My thoughts are to put the money into savings and wait until you need it. If you're doing the normal pro-active care, then you're good. I'm not in the great white north, but I'm still on my original battery, too. But being in the cold, you should probably keep an eye on it, these things last ~5 years, but with the lighter load on these batteries, many people have taken them to 8+ in the liftback.
    Check your brake pads and if they look good, leave them be. The rust does accumulate on the rotors quickly, I have noticed as well, but it rubs off with the first drive, just be ready for them to be slightly grabby until it does.
     
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  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    Brake maintenance, according to the US schedule, is every 30K miles or 3 years. OTOH, the Prius community here seems to be collectively oblivious to the need for periodic brake maintenance, anything more involved than eyeballing them during wheel rotation. So maybe you're fine.
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i think it depends on your environment. we get salted pretty good, and i've had no problems up to 53,000 miles so far. but i don't spend my winter days slogging through snow/salt/slush. if i did, i would definitely want a good inspection and cleaning/lube if necessary.
    if i lived in cali, i wouldn't even change my oil.:cool:
     
  6. ztanos

    ztanos All-around Geek!

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  7. Sean Nelson

    Sean Nelson Active Member

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    Unless you're in the habit of braking aggressively, the Prius C is very gentle on the pads and rotors because of its regenerative braking. In fact, the rotors often show rust because it doesn't get worn off as much as on a typical car. As long as the pads have adequate thickness and you're not experiencing any issues such as a pulsating action when braking (which can indicate issues with the rotors) then I wouldn't touch them.

    Shocks are there to dampen the bounce you get after hitting a bump. It's the springs that absorb most of the force. The only real problem you get with the springs is if they break, and that's very obvious.

    For the shocks, the standard test is to pump up and down on each corner of the car to get it rocking and then let it go to see how quickly the car stops bouncing. It should completely stop within a cycle or two - if not then you probably need to replace the shocks.

    For my previous cars I've generally figured 5 years as the life of a battery and I've replaced it proactively because I don't want to get stuck somewhere. The Prius C is a little different because the battery isn't called on to supply the same kind of high currents needed to crank an engine, so the demands on it are a lot less. My 2012 Prius C still has its original battery and what I've started to do is to measure the voltage both unloaded and under load so that I can see whether it's degrading or not. You could pay the dealer to test the battery, but since you seem to be hands-on kind of guy you're probably better off spending a bit of money on a multimeter and perhaps also a load tester.

    The Prius C has been the most rock-solid car I've ever owned in four decades of driving. Other than regular proactive maintenance, I'd wait for actual symptoms before spending money. Do what I do and take that extra cash you've accumulated and set it aside, earmarked for maintenance. That way, when the day comes that you really do need to have some work done you won't need to fret about where the money will come from.
     
  8. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    Asked and answered.

    A 2012 with 90K is still a baby.
    Use the maintenance schedule.
    Anything that's not ON THAT SCHEDULE with the exception of a transmission fluid change - that I do myself, isn't "maintenance"........it's a "repair."

    Repairs require a thorough explanation, bids, etc...

    My advice is to keep doing what you're doing, and re-visit this whenever your car requires things like plugs....which should be somewhere around 120K - I'm not sure about the Priussy and you shouldn't take my word for it anyway.

    Rotors.
    Surface rust is normal.
    Pitting or scoring is not.

    Unless you're an especially poor driver, deliver the morning paper, or you live in an environmentally harsh environment (like.....the Bay Sate)....then you should not even be thinking about replacing brake components with only 90K miles on the odometer..........in any car.
    Visually inspecting things like pins, clips, pads, rotors, etc and cleaning and lubricating the appropriate bits IS in the schedule of maintenance and if I lived in an uninhabitable cold region....which for me is anywhere north of I-20, then I'd learn how to do this maintenance myself because I'm thinking that it might be very easily omitted, perhaps even accidently, by somebody who gets paid by the job and not by the hour.
    Like.........for example.......some dealer mechanics that I know.
    Juuuuuust saying. ;)
    However (comma!) if you think that your brakes aren't up to scratch and you're not mechanically inclined, then you can find a reputable establishment to inspect them.........maybe........somewhere.....that doesn't also sell new cars.
    Me personally, I think that it would be easier to just give a shop your credit card information or a blank check and tell them to please only take what they need, since it usually works out like that anyway.....but that's me being me again.
     
    #8 ETC(SS), Jul 10, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2017
  9. ztanos

    ztanos All-around Geek!

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    I don't know about that... in my 2001 Saturn SC2, I had to change the brakes every 30k miles... that car ate through pads... they were so tiny.
    I'm at 80k miles with well over half on my pads in my 2012 C4.
     
  10. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    So, follow the schedule, or not? (n)

    Just to throw one more in, for the OP:

    Consider brake fluid change, tri-yearly or 30K miles. It is in the Toyota Canada schedule, Toyota USA apparently figures 'mericans apparently are immune from brake fluid deterioration, the condition of the driver's floor mat warrants (a hell of a lot) more attention.

    @NutzAboutBolts has a video on that, and it's covered in the Repair Manual.

    Yeah 30K or every 2~3 years is a sensible) industry standard. Do keep in mind: it's not JUST about pad thickness: perdiodic inspection/cleaning/relube is warranted for any car brakes, and there's nothing miraculous about the Prius. They are easier on the brakes, but they do wear.
     
    #10 Mendel Leisk, Jul 10, 2017
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  11. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    Hmmmm.
    OK.....
    Amend my post to read: "....any late model car...."
    But I drove an 04 (Ion) that I never had change pads on in the 150,000 miles that I owned it.
    I was stupid for selling that car.
    I wish I still had it.....


    +1....but only either DIY or from a trusted independent wrench.
    Far too many people who drive cars with regenerative brakes think that you need a team of scientists in white lab coats and a large engineering facility to work on them.

    AND.....I've seen places like Three Guys and a Hammer screw up this maintenance.....
     
    #11 ETC(SS), Jul 10, 2017
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  12. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    Yeah, while the @NutzAboutBolts brake fluid video is best, the attachment snip from the Repair Manual has a lot of the info, in black and white. Basically:

    You DON'T need Techstream software, there is an official "chicken dance" that'll put the car "to sleep" while you're doing the brake bleed. Also, while @NutzAboutBolts uses an off-screen vacuum device, just a bottle with a cap with a hole in the middle, and some tubing (preferably with a kosher bleed screw adapter), and a syringe with a long, very skinny tube extension, is all the special tools you need. And two pints of DOT3 fluid should do it.

    My wife and I managed this, took about an hour.
     
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  13. ztanos

    ztanos All-around Geek!

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    But 2001 isn't late model... :eek: CRIPES!!! I bought that car in April of 2000... that sucker would have been 17 years old right now. Not an "antique" but pretty close.

    Brake fluid is one of those things that wears down incrementally. They make test strips to monitor this wear.
     
  14. cutter44

    cutter44 Member

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    Sorry I'm just getting around to responding to these comments. After I posted the question last night, I hit the rack and this is the first chance I've had to check back. So first of all, thank you all for your comments.

    Now here's the thing. In all my years of owning cars, brakes are the one thing I've never been comfortable dealing with. I know people say it's relatively simple, but frankly I don't trust myself. So here's a follow-up. I know the brakes function differently in a Prius than on a regular car because of the regenerative aspect, but I get the impression there's nothing really unique about brake maintenance for the Prius. Could I bring it to a regular trusted mechanic (who does NOT specialize in Prius) and have them check and/or service them? Or for something like brakes on the Prius would I be wiser to go to a Toyota dealer? And what would one expect to pay for brake service at a dealer? I'm guessing it depends on whether it need pads/rotors replaced.

    I suppose I could do another ATF drain and fill, even though according to the manual I shouldn't have even done the one I did back at 35k miles, since it's supposedly "maintenance free" or "lifetime" or however they phrase it.
     
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  15. cutter44

    cutter44 Member

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    Oh, and ztanos, I vaguely remember them mentioning something about being surprised there wasn't an official recall regarding the charcoal canister issue as they'd had to replace several over the years. After some google searching, I do recall seeing one of the possible issues being people topping off their gas tanks after the initial click-off of the gas pump.
     
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  16. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    if you're sure the mechanic will get the toyota service manual and follow it, it's easy peasy. but you can't just slap it together without regard to the details.
     
  17. ztanos

    ztanos All-around Geek!

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    I've never actually heard a confirmed issue with that. Interesting... guess I've just been lucky then... I'm averaging 9.2+ gallons per fill-up over my 172 tanks of gas... I can say for a fact I've gone past the first click on many occasions.

    As far as brakes, yes, this car acts like normal. The regen is part of the electric motor. Brakes are one of the more simple things on a car... easier than an oil change in my opinion.
    If you do it yourself expect to pay around $40(fronts only). If you don't and take it to a mechanic/dealership, expect to pay ~$100-150... brakes are one thing they know they can gauge and you'll pay it.
    The transmission fluid change is never a bad idea, but yeah, supposedly the transmission never needs maintenance for the "life" of the car. Most manufacturers don't consider life of the car more than 200k miles though...
     
  18. cutter44

    cutter44 Member

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    Yeah, I guess I was used to topping off the gas tank like I've done in all my other cars. Now I pump it in at a moderate rate, then after the first click-off, I just round up to the nearest nickel. No issues since.

    Interestingly enough, I just checked the website of the dealership who did my charcoal canister warranty replacements. They have a coupon for $25 off (per axle) on any complete brake service. That word "complete" scares me a bit. :)
     
  19. ztanos

    ztanos All-around Geek!

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    In most instances, a “complete” brake job will include the following:
    New linings front and rear.
    Resurfacing both rotors and drums (or replacing them if worn, cracked or hard spots are found).
    Replacing drum hardware and caliper bushings/pins/sleeves.
    Rebuilding or replacing calipers and wheel cylinders (depending on mileage and condition).
    Maybe replacing some brake hoses and/or the master cylinder (if leaks or problems are found).
    Test the brake fluid and, if necessary, flush the brake fluid and bleed all the lines.
    Inspecting wheel bearings (repacking on older vehicles).
    Lubricating all critical areas such as caliper slides and shoe pads with high temperature brake lubricant.
    Checking & adjusting the parking brake.
    Checking the ABS system for any fault codes, or replacing any faulty ABS components as needed (wheel speed sensors, hydraulic modulator, accumulator, pump or relay).

    As long as it's a "complete" and not a "complete front". Parts and doing it yourself for all 4 would cost around $100, assuming you had to replace the rotors and put the nice ceramic pads on the fronts. If you went cheap, it would be less, but there'd be a lot more brake dust build up and wear would happen sooner. Most rotors can be turned at least once (most shops won't do it more than once, depending on the thickness of the rotor), so you won't need to spend the money for full replacement. Calipers won't need replacing every time, unless you live where there's a lot of salt... but even then, every time seems a bit much.

    For first brake change, I'd expect you to have to change/check, but YMMV depending on how you drive and where you live:
    The front pads and hardware.
    Turn rotors.
    Test the brake fluid (test strips at autozone/advance/o'reilly/pep boys/etc).
    Check the rears (rear brakes wear slower than fronts. On most cars the fronts are doing all the work... on our cars, the regen is doing all the work, so I really don't expect to ever change my rears, honestly).
    Adjust the parking brake and ABS system.
     
  20. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    The brakes are more-or-less per any car, but there are a few exceptions. First, it's good to disconnect the 12 volt battery negative lead before opening anything up, and especially if caliper piston has been pushed back, tromp the brake pedal multiple times, take out any excess pedal travel, before reconnecting the 12 volt. Failure to do this can lead to:

    1. A caliper spitting out a piston, if the brake pressurizing system activates, as it's want to, say by your opening the driver's door.

    2. The car's computers detecting excess brake pedal travel, throwing codes.

    Also, rear disk brakes on the regular Prius are finicky, due to incorporated parking brake. There's some gotchas. Does the Prius c have rear drums? Good!
     
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