Featured Hyundai IONIQ - Prius competitor?

Ioniq and Niro aren't Hyundai/Kai's first hybrid.

 

When I got my Prius I began to wonder why the Synergy Drive (SD) was not simply "transplanted" into other vehicles. After some poking around the car I have got to say that the remarkable performance and efficiency is the result of the "purpose-built" effect.

Think of the variables: physical size (exterior), interior capacity, ICE sizing, battery size, motor/gen size, shape (aero -- what the H are those little "wings on the rear wheel wells?), weight, styling, etc. There's a lot of engineering to make it all work for maximum effect and make it saleable.

If you were to transplant the SD, say into a vintage Firebird, you would not get the same performance you see in my 2016 Two. You would have an interesting car, and maybe a reliable one, but a different level of performance.

 

I fully respect your decision especially not wanting a 1st gen product but did you actually test drive the Niro / Ioniq or did you just go of the reviews?

reason I ask is I am curious what you thought if you did drive them and did your view match those of the reviewers you watched

 

That must be what @Bill the Engineer is designing in his Firebrid project.

He is placing a Firebird convertible body on a Prius v chassis & drivetrain. An interesting, reliable car for sure.

 

http://www.autonews.com/article/20170319/OEM05/303209992/can-hyundais-ioniq-make-inroads-against-prius?

thing is all these articles assume that most of the sales of the Ioniq will come from Prius drivers defecting to Hyundai, what I am seeing over on the ioniqforum is we are get a "few" Prius drivers, but mainly other brands and surprising a number of bmw / merc type diesel drivers

as we have said on here Toyota customers are pretty brand loyal, so they would be very hard to persuade to change, most likely it would be first time hybrid drivers who look either at price or prefer the thought of DSG to eCVT

 

that would great.

 

I had noticed many of our Prius Pioneers went with Tesla and other cars by now. But it is too glib to blame 'brand loyalty' when there are distinct requirements separating the cars.

Brand loyalty led me to test drive a 2016 Level Three but the substitution of a moonroof for MPG sold a BMW i3-REx. Later, prospects of maintenance costs and infantile motor mount bolt breaking sold a 2017 Prius Prime. One mandatory requirement, collision avoidance and dynamic cruise control which for Hyundai are a trim level upgrade and option repeats a dumb, Toyota decision in the past.

Brand loyalty evaporates in the face of buyer requirements. The manufacturer made the decision on what to offer and the buyer gets to choose.

Bob Wilson

 

Yep .... yet we're still only talking <5% market share .... so some manufacturers MAY be able to take the "who cares" or "take it or leave it" attitude with impunity - offering up odd packaged features. But as you rightly point out, safety features will often trump brand loyalty.
We went to a plugin brunch today, and with serendipitous good fortune, there happen to be a Road & Track employee there who was test-driving the ionic Bev & brought it to the restaurant;



He's put in TONS of time & hours - not just in driving THIS car, but the Toyota hybrids & plugins as well.
Having a comprehensive understanding of the comfort, ride, features, range, packaging, EPA etc of so many different manufacturers' offerings would seemingly put this fella in a unique position to at LEAST render a reasonable position on efficiency - std Prius vs std ioniq ... so i asked him. Yes, ymmv, but this R&T tester was generally averaging 4mpg more than the prius - & that surprised me, considering how similar the 2 cars seemed to be sized - inside & out.
But as you mentioned Bob, loyalty starts to wane if you can get more safety features for less cash. The other interesting comment this fella told me was that Hyundai has been deliberate in not comparing the ionic to the Prius because of the manufacturers' understanding of Toyota owner loyalty. Their philosophy, he said, is more about offering their products - rather than attempting to claim a Prius killer - as Honda seemed to do upon the release of the Insight II, years ago. That did not go over well at all.
.

 

There are things like brand loyalty, model loyalty, dealer loyalty, dealer location, etc that come into play. Said as a Toyota owner with now 5 in the family (2 over 120k miles). My dealer is 3 miles away, Hyundai dealers are both 40. I want service, my dealer drops me off 100 yards from my house. I need something trivial (air in tires) it is no wait, no charge. I know where I can get my next car cheaper, but sometimes cheaper is not the only end state desired. It is an accumulation of things ...

 

I was/am a completely satisfied Toyota owner with my 2010 Prius and now my Avalon. Seven years of good driving experiences (5 years with Prius and 2 with the Avalon).
Then Toyota brought out the 2016 Prius, and while I readily acknowledge it''s a personal opinion, my Prius loyalty wained. I know many like the look, and I am sincerely glad .... but I feel more than a little disappointment.
The Ioniq is on my "short-list" but I have yet to see one in person. So I am withholding buyer excitement for now..

 

i did read a hyundai factory blurb that mentioned prius killer in not so many words, but prius was definitely in there.
this r&t guy sounds more like a hyundai shill.

 

I smiled when I read this:

Posted December 8, 2015 by @austingreen : Hyundai IONIQ - Prius competitor? | PriusChat

Hyundai Ioniq Could Be First Real Challenger To Toyota Prius On Efficiency

. . . In October, Hyundai announced a new engine for the hybrid models, a 1.6-liter Atkinson cycle, direct-injected four-cylinder generating 103-horsepower and 108 lb.-ft. of torque. According to Hyundai, the high-pressure direct injection, dual circuit cooling system and cooled exhaust gas recirculation will help this engine achieve up to 40 percent thermal efficiency, comparable to what Toyota is claiming for the new Prius. . . .
​

There has been over a year of news articles comparing the Ioniq to the Prius and our local Ioniq advocates have injected them in this thread, in PriusChat, at every opportunity. I'm OK with the claim Hyundai may not have been the root of these Ioniq vs Prius articles but there they are: http://www.autonews.com/article/20170319/OEM05/303209992/can-hyundais-ioniq-make-inroads-against-prius%3F

So I left this comment:

One weakness of the Ioniq is failure to include the Prius standard, TSS-P (safety package with dynamic cruise control.) The Ioniq requires buying an upscale trim and toss in another $2k for adaptive cruise control. Toyota made the same mistake with the 2016 Prius but made TSS-P standard in 2017. Compare the Prius standard equipment and Ioniq extra cost, safety options and suddenly the Ioniq is not so cheap.

Failure to compare standard and options is the same mistake auto writers made when reporting the "hybrid premium." Auto writers would compare a Prius to the cheapest Corolla but omit the expensive Corolla options like automatic transmission, alloy wheels and a functional spoiler that were standard on the first Prius since 2001.

BTW, Toyota made a real coup by making TSS-P standard on their cars. The rest of the industry have been caught flat-footed.​

Bob Wilson

 

Totally agree...It is a great deal on the lower level trims.

 

Which start at the same price as the Ioniq with them optioned.

Standard features can be good marketing, but that doesn't make them a good value.

As for brand loyalty, it appears a good portion of Prius owners here when I joined were more hybrid and alternate fuel loyal than brand.

 

Having owned a 2001 Echo and a 2003 Prius, we were able to compare features and the stock, alloy wheels, functional spoiler (the Echo had a cosmetic spoiler), and both had auto transmissions (required by 'she who must be obeyed.') The lighter weight wheels helped offset the heavier body. The excellent, low center of gravity of the Gen-1 Prius meant taking turns at speeds that would strip off tailgaters.

This has been the bane of VM, GM, and other sales critters who too often tried to describe us as a caricature, not a customer. Then they'd do a survey and find we are older, above average income, and yet totally impervious to their sales pitches based upon their prejudice. For example:

Did that make anyone want to trade-in their Prius for a Jetta TDI?

Some of us like a quiet ride because it defines a quality environment versus having to shout over the engine and other noises. We're not deaf and have no desire to become so.

Bob Wilson

 

Considering leaving TDi for Prius...... | PriusChat

 

I don't think the Ioniq is a Prius killer, but it is a viable alternative. As a Gen III owner, I've certainly enjoyed the reliability and low cost of operation. What I haven't enjoyed is oil consumption, dash rattles, highway noise, troublesome egr system, and poor seat comfort. Would I consider a Gen IV? Sure. Would I cross shop with Hyundai? Sure.

 

Frankly, the excessive oil consumption issue has tarnished my image of Toyota somewhat...even though everyone, even Toyota, assures me that it is 'normal'. Still love our 2010 though.

 

I'm mystified by the oil consumption issues some owners have. My 2010 (since traded) had 130,000 miles and I never added one quart.
I wonder what causes the difference? I used Toyota oil; changed at 7500 miles. My 2015 Avalon now has 45000 miles, and again, I have not added a single drop of oil.

Back in 2010, it seemed (unsubstantiated) that Prius from one specific assembly plant had more problems than from others. It was never proven, but I have thought about it over the years. An interesting project would be to survey serial numbers of vehicles with problems, and see if there is a common denominator? The Serial number has a alphabetic code that identifies where it was assembled.

 

abuse, unknown factors due to pre owned.