Residual value of Prime (and Gen4)

The 5 minutes refueling is under optimal conditions; filling 5kg could take almost as long as using a Supercharger under worse case.

A FCEV also needs space for the motor and attending equipment. The Mirai holds nearly 5kg of hydrogen between two tanks. Combined the tanks weigh around 95kg empty.

Confining high pressure gases in more package friendly shaped tanks will increase the tanks' weight.

 

That's state of the art technology of today,but It will improve over time as everything else does too .

 

5kg refueling will take under 5 minutes unless there's something wrong with the system or it's under-designed. There's no technological reason it would take more than a few minutes. The intended goal is 2kg per minute.

The Mirai needs that giant fuel cell because that's the main propulsion for the car. If the battery is the main propulsion, like it can be in the Prime, the fuel cell can be smaller by a factor of about eight.

 

$$$$ wise, they're a lot bigger....

 

Yeah, but 5kg of H2 storage plus a 15kW fuel cell is way cheaper than a 100kWh battery.

 

The improvement is accomplished when they switch to a liquid fuel for the fuel cell. Nissan is working with ethanol. Even @bwilson4web anhydrous ammonia baby is only at 300psi at most, making it magnitudes easier to work with than 10k psi or 12k psi hydrogen that is now used for fueling these cars.

Hydrogen refueling stations work by prepressurizing the gas to a level higher than what the car tank is rated for. Filling the tank causes the hydrogen to heat up. When it gets close to 100C, there is a real risk of explosion. To avoid that, the hydrogen is pre-chilled in the station tank, and the dispense rate controlled.

When the station tank is filled, and completely pre-chilled to the -40C of the most advanced stations, a fill up can be as quick as filling with a liquid fuel. There is more variables that can slow it down the flow of hydrogen than with gasoline. While not likely of major impact, simply being too hot out will slow the hydrogen flow down. As the station tank empties, the flow rate drops. Same with the tank hydrogen not being completely chilled.

So, a nominal 3 minute fill hydrogen station can take 15 minutes if the variables are against you. If the station tank used for filling cars is empty, it can take longer, and likely won't give a full 5 kg fill.

These limits can be overcome by overbuilding the station, but that will increase the cost. The stations California is putting in can only handle maybe 20 to 25 cars a day, and people still see long fill times after a rush of customers. A gas station of the same cost can handle hundreds of cars in a day.

Yes, and people here have said that going up to the release of the Mirai, but the companies trying to sell a hydrogen FCEV have had no interest in making a plug in one up to this point. Toyota couldn't even bring themselves to call the CHAdeMO outlet for emergency home power as such. Instead, it is named a PTD. Perhaps to make it familiar to farmers?

I can see that cost getting under $20k, but what about the hydrogen station? The test ones California is building with four pumps cost around $1 million. After a handful of cars in a row, the refill time becomes longer than what many would call fast refilling. Ten to twenty DC fast chargers could be built for the same amount, and the infrastructure to get them electricity is already in place for most of the country. The hydrogen station still needs supporting infrastructure put in.