Prime or Tesla 3

Traitors ! ! !

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there's a car for everyone, except those without licenses.

 

Hill - Traitor?

I think not .... I own and really enjoy a 2015 Toyota Avalon hybrid. Terrific car. I consider myself "brand loyal."
But I'm thinking I need an EV (town car) to complement my TAH (road car). Toyota appears to be disinterested in the EV (except as a hydrogen fueled vehicle).

And that is part of my dilemma. I feel Toyota makes one of the finer vehicles on the road in terms of quality, ride, comfort, fuel efficiency and value. But personally, (and I don't think I am alone), in addition to the lack of an EV, I dislike for the looks of the new Prius.
Toyota wanted to make a "statement," unfortunately for me, I don't like the looks of the "statement." But to each his own.

 

I feel the same way. Ever since my 85D, I've become more and more addicted to ev driving. The PiP is a gateway car to EV addiction.

 

agreed! i'm starting to become jealous of bob wilsons new i3.

 

aw c'mon now - that little character on the post ? with the tongue ripping thru it's cheek ? symbol for comment known as "tongue & cheek ? meaning not serious at all, but rather humor ? So of COURSE i understand. We too, have an alternate hybrid, the Lexus AWD suv. It's baffled me for years why Toyota didn't beat mitsu to market with a plug-in hybrid SUV. That's the frustration that lead to our getting on the Model X wait list. So yes it's understandable.
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i still say they don't see it as a profit center, for now, and foreseeable future.

they're probably looking at tesla and saying, 'good for them', glad it's not us.

 

It's more like all other car companies have painted themselves into a corner. The dealership model is not sustainable when cars no longer need regular maintenance. Traditional vehicle manufacturers have to keep their dealerships in mind when they consider their vehicle portfolio, but Tesla has no such concern.

I expect the traditional model will be unprofitable in the near future.

 

this is all just pie in the sky talk from people who want something, but don't want to pay for it.

 

Cost? ... last I checked, there were still over 35,000 folks w/ $5k down, waiting to get their awd Model X SUV's built. Cost therefore doesn't seem to be the barrier. Now if the suv needs to be cheaper for many - Toyota does build SUV's smaller than the highlander. (but it's a shame a high end Lexus RX can't fill the bill to compete w/Tesla) You don't feel a plugin Rav4 can compete with Mitsu as to price, accessories? Ev range? Toyota seems to be able to squeeze 22ish ev miles out of the 4 seat prime - so couldn't Toyota get even more ev range in a small suv platform? Especially if a Mitsu Outlander can.
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California has already enacted an carbon tax as of 1-Jan-2015, and they decided to send the invoices to the oil companies directly so that the extra tax does not appear on the gasoline receipt at the pump. Thus it anyone's guess how much this is costing consumers. This is in addition to the Fed+State+Local taxes at the pump. But this is probably part of the reason that CA gaso prices are even higher now compared to rest of USA.

 

All costs end up in the price on the receipt. There is no such thing as free shipping, free parking, or a free lunch...

I'm not directing this comment to you personally, since you mention that the cost is passed on to the consumer, but I'm just reiterating the point for those who still believe in the fantasy of free.

How much tax per gallon is CA invoicing the oil companies? The price paid at the pump is likely incremented very close to the extra cost to the suppliers.

Where does the additional revenue go, and has that revenue been shown to be effective at mitigating the problem?

 

Good questions. But it's a cap and trade program, so the future cost is unknown (depends on the market cost of carbon credits). But seems like somebody ought to be able to tell us 2015/2016 carbon credit cost and cents/gal gaso implied tax thus far. It had been estimated as low as 15 cents/gal, but is expected to ramp up fairly quickly.

>>>Come on, one of you Green car authors reading here, give us the numbers in an article for InsideEVs or something like that...tell you what though, if I am living in CA I am gettin' me at least a Prius

 

Cap n Trade is an awful system, barely better than doing nothing.
The CO2 Fee & Dividend is much more even handed, transparent and effective as it cuts across manufacturers rather than picking out a single one or group.

 

how would that help politicians?

 

wow that's too bad. Guess us Californians have it pretty easy with the extra state & fed incentives.
But with California being the largest playing field for plug-ins, I guess maybe that's what I was most curious about. How would the 2 smaller suv's go, head to head. Sadly, I guess we'll never know.

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you should have bought a rav4 ev and added an engine.