1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Gen4 vs Gen3 - a detailed comparison of tested measured parameters

Discussion in 'Gen 4 Prius Main Forum' started by pakitt, Apr 8, 2016.

Tags:
Page 2 of 2
  1. pakitt

    pakitt Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2009
    2,173
    1,312
    0
    Location:
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    2021 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Limited
    I have data from the Gen4 test made from Auto Motor und Sport in March 2016 (AMS) and expanded the table gently created by bwilson4web below. From what I gather from the pics, they tested the car at 4C/39F, with Toyo NanoEnergy 215/45 R 17 W tires:
    Parameter Unit of measure Gen3 Gen4 Delta Gen4 vs Gen3 AMS Test values
    1 Weight of tested vehicle Kg 1534 1531 -3 1413
    2 Max speed Km/h 181.536 188.203 6.667 N/A
    3 Odometer error at 130km/h % 4.5 4.2 -0.3 4
    4 Fuel consumption at 90km/hi (56 mph) Km/L (MPG) 26.8 (62.98) 24.9 (58.515) -1.9 N/A
    5 Fuel consumption at 100km/h (62 mph) Km/L (MPG) 23.4 (54.99) 22.4 (52.64) -1 N/A
    6 Fuel consumption at 130km/h (81 mph) Km/L (MPG) 15.4 (36.19) 15.4 (36.19) 0 N/A
    7 Fuel consumption at 150km/h (93 mph) Km/L (MPG) 11.7 (27.495) 11.9 (27.965) 0.2 N/A
    8 Resistance at 100km/h KW 12.9 14.3 1.4 N/A
    9 Efficiency at 100km/h % 34.5 35.7 1.2 N/A
    10 Average fuel consumption in city Km/L (Km driven) 29.4 (1324) 26.6 (1142) -2.8 (-182) N/A
    11 Average fuel consumption in sub-urban Km/L (Km driven) 21.3 (957) 20.1 (865) -1.2 (-92) N/A
    12 Average fuel consumption in highway (max speed limit 130km/h) Km/L (Km driven) 13.7 (616) 16.4 (881) +2.7 (+265) N/A
    13 Calculated average Km/L (Km driven) 21.9 (985) 20.5 (881) -1.4 (-104) 19 6(unknown)
    14 Official Toyota Declared Combined Average Km/L (Km driven) 25.0 (985) 30.3 (1303) +5.3 (+318) N/A
    15 MFD error % 6.4 5.8 -0.6 N/A
    16 Acceleration 0-40 km/h Seconds N/A N/A N/A 3.0
    17 Acceleration 0-60 km/h Seconds 5 4.9 -0.1 N/A
    18 Acceleration 0-80 km/h Seconds N/A N/A N/A 8.1
    19 Acceleration 0-100 km/h Seconds 11.3 11.1 -0.2 11.8
    20 Acceleration 0-130 km/h Seconds 18.9 18.6 -0.3 19.6
    21 Acceleration 0-160 km/h Seconds 30.6 31.4 0.8 32.5
    22 400m Sprint Seconds 18 17.8 -0.2 18.2
    23 400m Sprint exit speed Km/h 127 127.5 0.5 125
    24 1km Sprint Seconds 32.6 32.5 -0.1 N/A
    25 1km Sprint exit speed Km/h 164.1 161.8 -2.3 N/A
    26 Pickup 60-100km/h Seconds N/A N/A N/A 6.6
    27 Pickup 70-100km/h (min/max load) Seconds 5.8/6.4 6.4/6.7 +0.6/+0.3 N/A
    28 Pickup 70-120km/h (min/max load) Seconds 10.6/11.8 11.5/12.1 +0.9/+0.3 N/A
    29 Pickup 80-120km/h Seconds N/A N/A N/A 8.5
    30 Pickup 70-140km/h (min/max load) Seconds 16.8/18.9 18.4/19.7 +1.6/+0.8 N/A
    31 1km starting from 70km/h Seconds 28.3 29 0.7 N/A
    32 1km starting from 70km/h exit speed Km/h 166.1 159.4 -6.7 N/A
    33 Breaking distance at 100km/h (cold start) Meters (g) 46.4 (0.85) 42.5 (0.93) -3.9 (+0.08) 38.1 (N/A)
    34 Breaking distance at 130km/h (cold start) Meters (g) 76.6 (0.87) 71.0 (0.94) -5.6 (+0.07) 65 (N/A)
    35 Breaking distance at 100km/h (half dry tarmac + half cobbles) Meters (g) 52.2 (0.75) 48.7 (0.81) -3.5 (+0.06) N/A
    36 Breaking distance at 100km/h (wet tarmac + simulated ice) Meters (g) 113.8 (0.35) 119.7 (0.33) +5.9 (-0.02) N/A
    37 Noise at 130km/h dB(A) 71.4 66 -5.4 71
    38 Noise at 50km/h (cobbles) dB(A) 77.1 72 2 -4.9 N/A
    39 Noise at 50km/h (tarmac) dB(A) 60.8 54.7 -6.1 N/A
    40 Noise @ Max speed during acceleration dB(A) 73.7 73.6 -0.1 74


    Interestingly enough the German magazine has a lighter vehicle and they don't measure "scientifically" fuel consumption at constant speeds. It's like as if that is not really important. They report more on speeds, braking distances, and the such - i.e. more the "dynamics".
     
    #21 pakitt, Apr 24, 2016
    telmo744, Sergiospl and Mendel Leisk like this.
  2. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,663
    15,663
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    Parameter Unit of measure Gen3 Gen4 Delta Gen4 vs Gen3 AMS Test values
    1 Calculated average Km/L (Km driven) 21.9 (985) 20.5 (881) -1.4 (-104) 19.6(unknown)
    2 Noise at 50km/h (cobbles) dB(A) 77.1 72.2 -4.9 N/A

    Suggested changes, not sure about first data row. The second looks right.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #22 bwilson4web, Apr 24, 2016
  3. Alesf76

    Alesf76 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2013
    89
    33
    0
    Location:
    Italy
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Forget quattroruote mileage test result. They do their test on the Vairano track, which is good to test a sport car, not to simulate everyday driving.
    Look yourself at the track map
    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/98/%22_15_-_ITALY_-_Circuito_di_Vairano_Test_Track_03_FULL.jpg

    For example to test highway mileage they have only a couple of km of straight track, so they accelerate full throttle to 130 km/h, draining the battery, then measure the consumption for the next kilometer, with the engine also charging the battery to recover the SOC loss, then stop because they can't drive at that speed in those curves. End of the test...
     
    #23 Alesf76, Apr 24, 2016
    bwilson4web likes this.
  4. JohnF

    JohnF Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2009
    497
    428
    0
    Location:
    Essex, CT
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    I agree, their preoccupation with "acceleration dynamics" is striking, especially for a vehicle like the Prius whose emphasis is on "fuel economy dynamics".
    It also seems off to me that on almost every fuel economy metric they tested they found the Gen 3 a bit better than the Gen 4, if I read the data correctly??
    My experience is the opposite: for the same runs I do consistently better in the Gen 4 than I did in the Gen 3. Perhaps steady speed fuel economy numbers are only part of the story? After all, the Prius' operation is a mosaic of ICE-ON and EV, so that there is an advantage to being able to spend more time in EV?
    For example. last night I had to drive from JFK airport in New York to my home in Connecticut. Over the >110 mile/177km trip my Gen 4 averaged 76-77 MPG on the MFD, so probably actually 75-ish. I drove mostly 50-55mph (speed limits are 40-55mph and increase to 65mph for only the last 20 miles or so). I would have been hard pressed to manage that in the Gen 3, especially at that cool temp (54F/12C).
     
    #24 JohnF, Apr 24, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2016
  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,663
    15,663
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    Ok, so if the Gen-4 supports a greater depth of discharge than the Gen-3, during acceleration, it would drawn down the traction battery energy deeper than the Gen-3. Then during the constant speed section, the engine would be at a higher power setting replacing the charge. This could be a characteristic difference between NiMH and LiON battery management.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #25 bwilson4web, Apr 24, 2016
  6. pakitt

    pakitt Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2009
    2,173
    1,312
    0
    Location:
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    2021 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Limited
    I think I will have to post then my Gen3 to my Gen4 fuel values once I have my Gen4 (when??) in my hands :)
    I have so many routes, and temps and fuel consumption values saved, it will be real fun to see how the Gen4 really performs in similar or same conditions.
    Because it seems from what I read in magazines, and comments, that we here in the forum have a more scientific approach than those who should really have it.... ;)
    I mean, both magazines don't mention ambient temperature - and we all know how the Prius performance in fuel consumption changes quite drastically when the temp reaches a certain "magic" value.
    And I have never seen a Gen 3 vs Gen4 comparison from any US or other non IT/DE magazine online/offline - has anybody seen any real testing done in a scientific way from any of these media sources?
    I can only find tens of video reviews all saying the same things one finds in the Toyota Press releases, and some very personal impressions about plastics, questionable usage patterns and who should buy the car or not, etc. which most of the times makes me raise an eyebrow...
     
    #26 pakitt, Apr 25, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2016
    Tideland Prius and bwilson4web like this.
  7. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    56,675
    39,222
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    I think ventilation settings: target temp, AC on or not, they can make a difference too.
     
    #27 Mendel Leisk, Apr 25, 2016
    Tideland Prius and pakitt like this.
  8. Munpot42

    Munpot42 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    1,391
    543
    0
    Location:
    Santa Monica, Ca. 90405
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    I may be wrong but I don't think the European market is getting the lithium battery packs, just nigh
     
    #28 Munpot42, Apr 26, 2016
  9. pakitt

    pakitt Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2009
    2,173
    1,312
    0
    Location:
    Colorado
    Vehicle:
    2021 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Limited
    We are not, only NiMH
     
    #29 pakitt, Apr 27, 2016
(You must log in or sign up to post here.)
Page 2 of 2