Featured Toyota North American CEO to dealerships: "Stop delivering Mirai"

Obviously bob, hydrazine is not a real choice here. Amonia is less efficient ether from methane, hydrogen, or electricity than mehanol, so you only honestly have the methanol or a bigger hydrocarbon or alcohol synthesized from methanol.

Amonia production takes up 5% of the US's natural gas consumption. Renewable electiccity converted to amonia may make sense, but amonia as light transport fuel does not.

Hydrogen is nasty stuff. That is why the cheapest way to produce and dispense 10,000 psi hydrogen is either from central production and trucked, or from on site production using SMR. On site using SMR can use existing natural gas, water, and electrical infrastructure. I think you could honestly make teh case of charging what that larger voume hydrogen station would need to, to test the market for fuel cells. If you are claiming renewable that is a whole other hard problem to even guess how much it would cost.

Toyota on an early fcv, had a methanol reformer on board. I think the problem with methanol is it could be used in a phev, and ... a phev is probably just about as efficient with methanol as a fcv unless you can do something with the heat on the 2CH3OH +O2 -> 2CO2 +4H2 + energy (wasted in refomer). If you burn the methanol in an engine, the engine is less efficient but it can use this energy.

 

We were watching a movie, "The Martian", and enjoyed the 'experimental' conversion of hydrazine into water. It reminded me of an aluminum, lye, hydrogen gas generator and a taped-up, laundry, dry-cleaning bag one of my brother's friends tried. When it didn't float, he decided to see if it was flammable . . . it was!

Not to burn but feeding a fuel cell makes sense:
http://www.electricauto.com/_pdfs/newpapers/302011_o.pdf

Other than the temperature issue, the heat from the fuel cell would help decompose the ammonia. I love pairing exothermic and endothermic reactions. <GRINS>

We'll have to agree to disagree on anhydrous ammonia but the market will tell. Right now, high-pressure hydrogen is a no-show. The sooner that line of investigation is over, the better.

Bob Wilson

 

I thought you needed a PEM fuel cell to stay bellow 100 C, while amonia needs high temperatures to be catylitically cracked to nitrogen and hydrogen, 300C IIRC. Now you can get that hot through heating from the battery, but that is after electricity comes from the fuel cell or a plug. That is a more complicated system than methanol.

Methanol worked in california, but was broken from state regulators in favor of hydrogen. China is looking close at methanol burned in engines

Japan is about to have 320 stations as a test, with big government money behind it. I would not count hydrogen out, until after that experiment. We should know in about 10 years.