Featured Hyundai IONIQ - Prius competitor?

The Hyundai lifetime warranties (power train and battery if applicable) do NOT transfer to the 2nd owner, only the original.. so that's something to consider.

 

Maybe European warranty is different?

 

Looks interesting. The latest press release has some translation issues, but also some hard data.

105 PS ICE comparable to Prius, but no specification for combined system power.
95.7 % claimed transmission efficiency is possibly better than Prius', but is the sixth gear high enough to keep the ICE in the optimum load range?
No mention of power electronics?
I found no clue to dimensions. (remember my disappointment when the Volt turned out to be considerably smaller)

Most worrisome for me is the gasoline direct injection. Will it have a particle filter that needs to be regenerated? Can it be mapped to eliminate particulates over the entire operating range? Or will it simply spew soot until EPACARB catches up with GDIs?

 

Found some info on Korea's fuel economy and emission test. It appears they use the EPA cycles and procedures. A "why re-invent the wheel" as it were.
South Korea: Light-duty: Fuel Economy and GHG - Transportpolicy.net

Can't recall if it was reported for sure, but it likely has the HSG on the front end of the engine like the Sonata hybrid. It replaces the alternator and starter of the ICE. Don't know if it does, but it can also be part of the regenerative brakes.

Good city fuel economy is going to come down how well the electric side can keep ICE on times low. For the highway, the DCT can have better overdrive ratios than the eCVT of the HSD.

No body is putting a filter on a gasoline car exhaust yet, and before everybody gets worked up about the GDI soot, there are some port injected engines that exceed particle limit that forced filters on diesels.

 

I have read what I can find on the Ioniq, (which isn't much) and I suppose the EV version will be the most interesting version of the three. I like the photos I have seen of the exterior.

 

Another article on Aussie soil Hyundai reveals Prius rival

Combined power is rated at 112kW, not bad!

SM-G900I ?

 

It's frustrating to see how an upcoming new hybrid is compared to an older generation with the claim of competing rival. We've all known for months that Toyota is switching all but one of the Prius packages from NiMH to Lithium batteries. Yet, this was posted anyway:

The newcomer also uses a modern lithium ion polymer battery as opposed to the older Nickel-Metal Hydride unit preferred by Toyota.

It's bad enough we still have to endure attacks from disenchanted Volt supporters. But coming from a supposed automotive expert professionally writing an article, there's no excuse.

That type of misinformation feeds greenwashing efforts. We've seen it countless times in the past. An article like that will get quoted as an authoritative source over and over. People will blindly believe those claims too, accepting them at face-value without bothering to do any research of their own. That's really unfortunate.

In other words, we need to speak out. Making sure misleading "facts" aren't spread is a big deal.

 

You may have a case, in USA that is. All other countries, including Australia, will be getting a NiMH battery only for the gen 4 Prius.

SM-G900I ?

 

Blanket statements is another effective way of misleading.

Intentional or not, vague references like that do a surprising amount of damage.

Whatever the case, it is good to know the differences. Thanks. +1

 

I hear ya mate. After owning the Prius for almost 7 years, I know how that feels. I just don't bother talking back now, I'll let my ownership do the talking.

There's a church brother of mine kept saying the battery needs to change every 3-5 years. I kept reminding him I have the car for 7, all I need was oil change. Guess what, he still says the 3 year battery change rubbish. All that topgear lies sound good to them even after all the available data suggest otherwise.

SM-G900I ?

 

These cars have starters. The engine can declutch and shut down, then re start and catch up to the mg and clutch in when needed. The mg clutches into the transmission and generates power when slowing down (regen braking), as well as works like an alternator to charge the traction battery.

If hyundai is reporting it right the engine is 40% efficient just like the gen IV prius engine. In gear the transmission should also be over 95% effieient according to hyundai, which means that it should be a more efficient engine and transmission combo than the gen IV prius, as the prius has additional electrical losses on top of the mechanical ones. In the city though things reverse. Accelerating from 0-20 should be more efficient on hsd type transmission. There is no loss switching gears, or ineffieient area when starting.

also this is a normally aspirated atkinson valved engine. It should have low particulates compared to a higher effective compression turbo charged engine. At a steady speed, the gdi will mainly just add efficiency by cooling the load of gasoline, it won't really have higher effective compression than most port injected cars.

 

GDI does not "spew" particulate matter. Hotter engines from higher compression create more particulates. Lower sulfur reduces particulates, and new regulations lower sulfur in 2017 in gasoline across the US. If we have a high performance highly turbocharged engine effective compression and rpm's are up, we get particultes. I would be suprised if this engine had a high particulate count. GDI actually cools the cylinders, and effective compresson of its atkinson valving is not high, nor is it high rpm. I was suprised toyota did not include di in the gen IV, instead it found efficiency in more massively using cooled egr. Toyota is less sophisticated in di then other manufacturers, but has a pfi/gdi atkinson version of the camry hybrid system in the lexus ISh. Port injection can be used on cold starts and high loads high rpm, gdi for steady going, so this may be the lowest pollution highest efficiency way to run an engine.

A dual clutch is probably about the most efficient transmission out there that offers multiple speeds. They do cost more than manuel transmissions or slush box step automatics to make. A planetary gear is normally 97%-98% efficient. The prius hsd though also has a less efficient electrical path. That path is probably around 85% efficient in the prius, and the path of engine, mg, battery, mg is probably 80%. Both ioniq and prius use the battery path. As more power flows through the electrical path though the prius transmission becomes less efficient. At 65 mph I'm sure that dct with proper gear ratio is more efficient. Accelerating from 0-15 that psd path will be more efficient as you won't be losing power changing gears.

Lithium batteries are better in about every catagory. Toyota dealers and some here have made wrong claims that nimh are better. Lithium beats nimh for power density, energy density for both weight and size, usable state of charge, lower charge leakage. Toyota is using the better tithium chemistries in all but the base gen iV prius here.

That said once put in a system like the prius it doesn't make that much difference. Toyota has sunk a lot of money into nimh production, and it is hard to switch that much factory equipment. There is a good reason for a slow transition, but if you want lithium, toyota has got it.

 

If this Video hasn't been speeded up,it will beat the gen.4 Prius on acceleration with no problem at all,but I guess it is speeded up a bit !
The cargo space seems to be less than that in a Prius .

It would be kind of embarrassing for Toyota if it turns out true that Ioniq beats the Prius on fuel efficiency all tough it has 30 hp more than the Prius !

Hyundai Ioniq exterior-interior, tech specs revealed

It would be embarrassing for Toyota if it turns out to be true that the Ioniq beats the new Prius on fuel efficiency although it has 30 hp more to offer !
I hope Prius stays the King,but I am not quite sure now !

Hyundai Ioniq exterior-interior, tech specs revealed

 

It is showing speed from 80KM/h, that is 50-65MPH in gear acceleration, not from zero. But I do think in gear acceleration would be better than Prius.

I think Toyota main goal was to reduce HSD costs and in that quest they reduced the power and increased fuel efficiency. But I wish Toyota kept same fuel efficiency but more HP to make it more likable.

Fuel economy, Ioniq might match Prius on highway, but I do not think it will be able to match Prius in local/city.

 

Yep, that's not 0-100 and not mph. And notice that quite long shift duration. There will be 3-4 of those before you reach 100. And I wonder how smooth it will be.

 

Greenwashing efforts will attempt to do that anyway.

Simply excluding emission-rating is the most common method. Ignoring that SMOG vs. MPG tradeoff happened often in the past.

More power comes by doing what? Sadly, most people don't bother to ask how. Of course, many wouldn't understand what the answer means anyway.

 

Yes I know it's only 80-110 km/h but it sure happens much faster than in a Prius and that why I guess that Part of the video has been sped up .

 

How does the ioniq create more hp? Its engine uses di and likely higher maximum compression and rpm, producing 10 more ponies. It's battery is larger capacity, so it can shift power, and provide more power than the less powerful prius battery. Battery differences are unknown. Max battery at max engine hp on the prius is 26 hp, we expect the ioniq is higher but don't know how much. At most it is 45 hp, so a total of 150 hp versus 121 hp but its probably less of a difference. An hsd will apply more of the hp from 0, so all hp is not equal. Until we have 0-60, 5-60, 50-70 times we have no idea. The only keytime that I would guess the ioniq would be much better is freeway passing.

I doubt there is much smog from the hyundia, nor much mpg given up.

I don't think the gen IV prius engine is embarassing though. Prius has always been on the lower side of power, and has sold well in spite of this. I would expect the gen IV to do the same. This ioniq is not going to be a speed demon. The biggest difference is probably the more powerful hyundai battery, which adds to hyundai's cost to make it, and is probably required more in the hyundai hybrid system. Toyota could fairly easily add a more powerful battery but chose lower cost as a trade off. The panasonic battery used in the ford fusion, is likely just a larger size of the one used in the prius, and it should provide the same power as the hyundai.

Soon we will have the benchmarks. If one is 9.8 seconds and the other is 8.5 seconds, I doubt it will be a show stopper. If one gets 55 in the city and the other gets 47 in the city but 53 on the highway, it still is a very efficient car. YMMV.

 

Actually, if you look at these videos:

And compare it to Hyundai's, we get acceleration times from 80 to 110:

Ioniq: ~3.04s
Prius 2nd gen: ~3.36s
Prius 3rd PiP: ~3.42s

Hmmmm....
I expected a bit more for 40Hp difference or so.