Here comes E15

Your owners manual says not to use it. I wouldn't until Toyota recommends it.

 

i haven't seen it, but somebody in the midwest used it and their 12 volt battery froze.

 

Meanwhile, since 40 percent of U.S. corn goes into biofuels, Americans pay an estimated $40 billion a year more at the grocery store.

 

Become like the Germans. They don't eat corn, it's cattle food. Buy another vegetable for dinner.

 

Why are we talking E15? I see EPA on 30-Nov-2015 did increase ethanol mandate (not good) but I am not expecting to see non-availability of E10.

EPA Keeps Pressure on Renewable Fuel Usage with 2016 Requirements - Gasbuddy Gas Prices

The increase in ethanol mandates still gives us about E10 on average, but there would probably be less E0 available. More E15 pumps available for those who want to use it.

 

Unless your vehicle can use E15 - stay clear of this political, environmental disaster!. Not good for the engine seals, nor the environment. But very good for enticing farmers to grow corn to shove into your gas tank. Also, I wonder how much more we will be paying in increased food prices each week at the store?

DBCassidy

 

Recently EPA increased ethanol mandate, probably because gaso sales are up due to cheap gaso. The problem will come when/if gaso sales head south again, and then we will be at lofty ethanol% to meet EPA ethanol volume targets. Congress needs to revamp the law before this happens. The current law was an error anyway so needs to be addressed.

 

Feds Push More Ethanol Into Gasoline, But Can Your Car Take It?

Would this void the warranty too?

 

I believe my TCH has a warning on the cap for nothing greater than E10. I'll have to check it later to verify.

So if I can only find E15 what do I do?

 

Ethanol reduces MPG's and increases food prices. The only winners are the lobbyists and the corn producers. It is another failed policy that defies logic. Let me keep banging my head against the wall, maybe it will stop bleeding, if I try harder.

 

toyota: most. i wonder about gen IV?

are there any studies showing mpg effects of ethanol? is it a complete filler, or does it just have less energy than gasoline?

 

Ethanol lowers MPG. From no Ethanol to 10% Ethanol there is a 3% drop in MPG per EPA...

How Does Ethanol Impact Fuel Efficiency?

It's the other scary things that come with it that are the big deal. Attracts water, corrosive, classic cars and small motors are hit hardest by ethanol.

 

My guess would be "no."

If the government mandates everything go to E15 and you can't get E0 or E10 and it harms your fuel system, I'm sure courts would rule against the manufacturer citing use of E15 as a warranty violation when it's the result of the actions of the government. It'd be more of an issue for people who have newer cars that are out of warranty. They will have little recourse.

How long is the fuel system covered in the Prius under the factory warranty?

 

Right now the EPA's own website touts E15 as being "Just another gasoline choice", proclaiming no station is being required to carry it, nor any consumer required to purchase it.

Well as long as possible, I'm NOT using it. So the EPA approves it? That means little to me. The EPA didn't build my vehicle, they aren't responsible for any potential failures or warranty coverage.

Unless or until Toyota actually approves it for use in my Prius, I'm not using it. Even if Toyota did approve it, I'd probably not use it.

 

I think 6 years 60k powertrain warranty, and if government mandates they cannot make it retroactive, only from that point on. Many pre 2001 cars would have issues, so will many loan mowers, generators, etc

this is not what the articles say. They say it will be a replacement for E10 to make up for "just another choice" E85 quotas noone is taking.

 

Wow, lots of govt. distrust and bogus info. about this.

First, the corn used is not edible. It's grown to produce corn syrup, which is used as sweetener in many foods, such as soda. So there is NO impact on food production. Yes, some producers of edible corn sold it to alcohol producers because they got a better price for it. But that applied to Mexico mostly. In the US edible corn is a minor percentage of production. Meanwhile many farmers who may have gone bankrupt due to poor markets now have an excellent market that pays well. They are still in business, and can switch to "food production" in a few months if prices get high enough for food products.

Alcohol burns producing less energy than the mix of hydrocarbons gasoline is made of. As I recall it is something like 80% of the energy. So you will get lower mileage when your vehicle burns it in proportion to the percentage. For example, at least 90% of E10 is "gasoline", and up to 10% is ethyl alcohol. You loose up to 20% of that 10%, or a few percent mileage.

Alcohol does indeed absorb water. It's used as "gas line antifreeze", as it absorbs any water in your tank and the alcohol then mixes with the rest of the fuel, allowing your engine to burn it and get rid of the water harmlessly. Because ALL fuel systems in modern cars are sealed systems very little water is absorbed out of the environment. So it actually gives you a benefit, keeping water from building up in your fuel tank. Unless it's handled carelessly. Leaky underground tanks for example.

Alcohol can indeed damage seals in the fuel system. Ethyl alcohol is least damaging, followed by isopropyl alcohol, and the worst being methyl alcohol (wood alcohol). Their exhaust components also follow in that order for toxicity. I do like the smell Pearl S makes before the cat. system warms up. Smells like an alcohol burner.
All modern cars use seals compatible with alcohol in the fuel. They may degrade slowly if too much is used, but that's a very long term issue.
In the near term, the question is "can the fuel system computer compensate for the drop in energy expected and change in oxygen burned due to slight differences in the fuel?" I suspect most will have no problem. Note that several members have been using E85 for several years. So far nobody has admitted to damage from that.

But we live in "free" countries, and are "allowed" to have opinions and express them. Go for it!

 

some lady said her 12 volt battery froze.

 

Toyota has already "approved" E15 for use in the 2014 Prius. It's on the Fuel Cap and in the Owner's Manual. Perhaps they saw the handwriting on the wall. I have to believe it's also approved for the 2015's, maybe someone can confirm.

 

Well I was selfishly speaking about my model year or older. And as far as I can tell 2013 and older has NOT been officially approved.

Until I get some official word from Toyota, this would preclude me ever running it in my vehicle.