2016 Prius Eco

No, g.

 

you can't have g without e.

 

I like the 15" wheels - they are more fuel efficient compared to 17" wheels.
And the ride will be softer.

 

10% cheaper than what? I think you have been defrauded by the land of the Scam in one more way. In the vast majority of the United States of Germany (or Europe if you want to keep the guise) there is no regular unleaded gasoline 91 RON octane available (87 AKI by US standards). The cheapest we can buy is super unleaded (95 RON octane) which is the fuel grade Lexus LFA is designed to produce the following sound.

Fuel grade prices relate around world in a comparable way. If people could buy the cheap 91 RON octane gasoline, ze Germans would lose a vital competitive advantage against cars equipped with naturally aspirated port injection engines, an area that Toyota shines.

Another reason why people drive diesels has to do with the brainwashing about clean diesel against dirty prius. Everybody remembers Clarkson the legendary BBC Top Gear journalist who wondered "what is the prius good for?" "If you have a need to save the planet buy a golf diesel, I promise it would be better". Then had Billy Bob shooting 0.5 calipers at prius.

Another one was to order the local governments across the States, to give consumers incentives to buy those "clean diesel" cars.

I don't know who revealed this "fiasco" and I would not exclude if that was part of a ze Germans strategy, as maybe it would be difficult to hide the deaths from runaway diesel cars in US and wanted a good excuse compared to their other options, to abandon the US market (diesel cars have huge torque compared to gasoline cars and you cannot stop a runaway diesel just by switching off the key, like in gasoline SUA incidents.) Also I dont believe that this fiasco affected them negatively in peoples minds and customer preferences.

On a side note today, if someone asks me about diesels I respond that diesel is the future. I use every fraudulent claim that has been used against prius and in favour of diesel, since the first day, war declared against prius.

For the agents clean diesel was the future until recently. Today the lovely child of Goldman Sachs Elon Musk and his Tesla company is the new mentor.

By the way, Tesla model P85D 700hp is considered a credible supercar by the agents, but 1) it is worlds slower than even grand tourer cars like 450hp Lexus RC-F around track- according to gearheads standards who criticize underperforming cars, but rave about Tesla and 2) it cannot even finish a 24 hour race in a credible position.

 

It has to do with taxes though, most of European countries tax diesel lower... hence the prices:
Fuel price in Europe 2015 • Autotraveler.ru

So for instance Germany:

If there wasnt difference in fuel tax + VAT, diesel would be more expensive than 95 petrol in Germany.

But once again, diesel popularity in Europe has nothing to do with hybrids at all... Hybrids arrived on Euro market that already had around 45% diesel engine sales, and have been constantly growing since them. After fuel tax laws and emission cheating that makes diesels more affordable than what they should be, only other reason hybrids are not sold more in Europe is that Toyota is only manufacturer really pushing them and Toyota is 4.x% of European car sales vs 14% in the USA.

If we consider that only Toyota is pushing hybrids, then hybrids in Europe are doing actually well and growing every year. They would do even better if Honda did reasonably well in Europe (they dont, they sell horribly) or if Ford would offer their hybrids (they dont).

Maybe this emissions fiasco will get European manufacturers that hold the market share in Europe to push hybrids, but their hybrids currently are not that great anyway... So when it comes to hybrids, we are left to Toyota really and in certain countries where incentives are huge, we also get some PHEV models that sell all right due to taxbacks.

Realistically, if you want larger vehicle or suv (A6, Q5, etc) which are popular now, only real choice is diesel. As you can see, for instance in Germany or France, cost of petrol is 10-20% more expensive than diesel, plus you get CO2 taxes that favor diesels vs petrols (hybrids are mostly not available in this class), and then you have weak emission testing that makes diesel engine $1k cheaper than what it should be... so people simply buy diesel, it is natural choice. In those cases, hybrids simply dont exist aside from Lexus, which is expensive and tiny part of sales plus again, with fuel itself 10-20% cheaper due to tax laws, hybrids are hard to push.

In smaller segment, Toyota has good prices for Yaris and Auris diesels, so they sell really well and Toyota hybrid sales are up again this year, by 16% in flat market. They sell the best in countries where there is no tax difference in fuel and small diesels are about the same price as small hybrids, so they make a lot of sense... if you like Toyota brand.

Apparently price of Rav4 Hybrid will be very similar to price of Rav4 diesel, so that will also up the sales next year, as well as next Prius introduction which will sell great likely for 2-3 years while it is hot.

 

who are 'the agents'?

 

I see this attempts as trying to skip one step in "greener drivetrain" evolution. VW also anaunced that they will focus on electric, but IMHO this will take a lot longer than anyone thinks, in the mean while Toyota will overtake the market will normal hybrids and they will not lag behind when time for (PH)EV comes. I mean VW GTE is surely a nice car, but without the plug consumption is off the chart, not to mention complexity of TSI and DSG, GM did well with the new Volt in this regard.

As for the fuel prices in EU In our country max price is regulated and structure of the price is known and published on .gov site, these are today's prices valid for 14 days:
Regular 95:
- max retail price without taxes: 0.43636 EUR/L (retail margin included around 0.085 EUR/L)
- contribution (?): 0.00600 EUR/L
- OVE (for renewable energy): 0.00911 EUR/L
- excise duty: 0.50378 EUR/L
- CO2 benefits: 0.04147 EUR/L
- 22% VAT: 0.219 EUR/L
---------------------------------
- at the pump: 1.21600 EUR/L

Diesel:
- max retail price without taxes: 0.44256 EUR/L (retail margin included around 0.08 EUR/L)
- contribution (?): 0.00400 EUR/L
- OVE (for renewable energy): 0.00990 EUR/L
- excise duty: 0.41746 EUR/L
- CO2 benefits: 0.04493 EUR/L
- 22% VAT: 0.202 EUR/L
---------------------------------
- at the pump: 1.12100 EUR/L

Price difference without taxes between petrol and diesel fluctuates, sometimes it's the same or even diesel cheaper, sometimes petrol is 10% cheaper, it's simply a question of supply and demand. But the pattern seems to be when the oil price goes up also price difference goes up (+10% in 2008), when oil price is low both fuels cost roughly the same before taxes.

 

New Jersey Turnpike Authority

Fuel Price
REGULAR GASOLINE - 87 Octane $1.969 (Effective 11/06/2015)
MIDDLE-GRADE GASOLINE - 89 Octane $2.299 (Effective 11/06/2015)
PREMIUM GASOLINE - 91 Octane $2.419 (Effective 11/06/2015)
DIESEL (ULSD) - Ultra Low Sulfuric $2.199 (Effective 11/06/2015)

Read the above, specifically the prices of the 91 AKI and diesel and if you cannot see the light, then I am sorry I cannot help you more.
87 AKI = 91 RON
91 AKI = 95 RON (the cheapest you can buy in USG "aka Europe")

Now tell me, In US diesel is cheaper than gasoline 91 AKI. Is this any different than the place you live?

 

Yes, if I lived in UK or Switzerland, but what is your point?

 

This is usually the case with every new thing that comes out, but what I wanted to point out was that, more than a decay ago prius was a step to greener drivetrain evolution too. But it was diminished by the agents as garbage in an attempt to slow down Toyota as much as possible.
Anyway, it is your right to believe that diesel "fiasco" will affect german automakers in a bad way. You don't understand that USG (ze germans) are going to set the rules in market to eliminate their big enemy which is Toyota and even use their agents to brainwash public opinion again... despite of videos like the following

Auto express (supposedly gear heads who love testing fast and fun cars on track) are raving about its precision.

Mercedes C350 plug-in hybrid review | Auto Express

" the Mercedes C 350 Plug-in can be very cheap to run. It delivers a sharp turn of pace, too,"

"Based on the C-Class saloon, it’s pretty much a no-compromise vehicle... "

"That’s highly respectable for a sports saloon (the new C 450 AMG Sport is only one second quicker)..."

 

he doesnt get it, or doesnt want to read all the links i put up

 

Pfffffffffffffff! Regular gasoline 91 RON will never be more expensive than super unleaded 95 RON or Diesel , just like a Fiat panda will never be more expensive than a Ferrari italia or a luxurious Maserati.

I used 95 RON because in most areas inside USG, 95 RON is more expensive than diesel and a reason people buy diesels. If there was a choice to buy 91 RON, the price of that would eliminate the fuel economy gains of diesel engines. The high price of buying diesel cars and maintainance cost would have made them inconpetent against 91 RON gas cars. I describe this in post #164