Corolla Hybrid for China Revealed

Maybe this is our Gen IV?

 

Gen IV Prius will have 1.8 minimum...

 

Sorry! Maybe this is our gen IV without the USA motor of 1.8 or bigger?!

 

Chinese developments are more concerned in producing cheap HSD setups locally than efficiency/design goals we've been used to every new generation Prii.
Toyota HQ is working since 2009 on the gen IV Prius, many steps ahead.

 

The current-generation Corolla sedan in China shares the same model code (E18x) with EU's Corolla sedan, its basic dimensions are the same with US model (E17x), and it is a significantly bigger car than Auris (E18x) or Japanese market's Axio (E16x).

The drive-train and hybrid system are almost the same as Prius Gen III, but not Auris Hybrid's exactly same.
It is the first time major THS components been assembled outside Japan, with lots of key parts imported from Japan.
Cutting costs is known for sure, but there are rumors it adopts some newly developed HV tech from Pirus Gen IV.

They will start selling very soon, like a month or so.
And in my opinion, the paddle shift switches are weird for an entry-level hybrid car much cheaper than Prius, even just for the top model.

CNcorollahybrid1 by Grus posted Sep 17, 2015 at 1:11 PM

CNcorollahybrid2 by Grus posted Sep 17, 2015 at 1:25 PM

ShiftLever by Grus posted Sep 17, 2015 at 6:09 PM

PaddleShift Switch by Grus posted Sep 17, 2015 at 6:07 PM

 

Grus,
I can't tell if you are reporting news that isn't out yet. I think you are saying the chinese corolla hybrid is a 1.8l engine like the prius and auris, but not like the japanese hybrid corolla (same engine and motors as aqua/prius c). That makes sense to do on a new car for the chinese market, use the better engine. I can't see a link with this information though.

 

anyone know the price premium over a non-hybrid corolla?

 

Sorry I didn't make it clear and loud, yes, the ICE is 1.8L.
All the things I mentioned above have been out there for a while and can be verified,
except the thing I marked clearly with "rumors", although that's what I really care about and wish could find some evidence later.
The non-hybrid Corolla 11G has began selling more than one whole year in China, with 1.6L and 1.8L petrol engine options.
The hybrid Corolla for China was officially revealed in Shanghai Auto Show April 2015, without detailed tech figures, like the Prius 4G in Las Vegas event. Now it is attending small auto shows all over China and exhibiting in some dealerships, still without detailed specs, like the Prius 4G in Frankfurt auto show. That's where the above shot-by-reporters photos came from, except the HV battery assembly photo which was leaked from a basic training material for dealership.
But there are some government websites similar to fueleconomy.gov providing basic info about fuel economy test / emissions certification / ... etc., including curb weight and engine displacement. These websites are open-accessible but all in Chinese and not come with user-friendly interfaces or google-translate-friendly, I don't know if you still want the links.
Luckily every vehicle in China comes with a “Production Nameplate” required by administration, here is a photo taken from one exhibiting hybrid Corolla, I made the annotations myself.

CorollaHybridCNnameplate2 by Grus posted Sep 18, 2015 at 11:08 AM

So why there were many medias talking about "1.5L Atkinson cycle engine" ?
In my opinion, Toyota's hybrid cars are not popular in China, so most customers and reporters do not care it much.
When some reporter in China first heard "Corolla Hybrid" and Toyota didn't provide detailed tech figures, if he or she googled it, no matter in English or Chinese, the first thing pop-up would be Japanese Corolla Axio Hybrid, not European Auris Hybrid, and there was no hybrid Corolla sedan outside Japan. It's reasonable if someone just copied the Axio's HSD specs, and others followed the first one. They didn't care enough to dig more. Then someone translated these things to English, like the first link in this thread ... Oops ...

No official MSRP published yet，maybe later this month. It's still in the pre-selling-exhibition phase, and the MSRP could be changed in the last minute.
MSRP is important but doesn't mean everything to the final purchase price. For example, the non-hybrid Corolla 11G often gets a 10%~15% OFF MSRP in China now, but the Highlander 3G often gets a 5% ABOVE MSRP.
And the hybrid ones do have some more standard equipment other than the hybrid system.
However, if you are still interested, 10%~15% MSRP-price-premium compared to the 1.8L non-hybrid Corolla seems to be a reasonable guess.

 

After a decade of 'Prius vs Corolla' faux comparisons trying to figure out the hybrid premium, finally, 'Corolla hybrid vs Corolla ICE' is about to be revealed in China.

I hated those false comparisons because they never put the stock Prius parts like keyless entry, cruise control, alloy wheels, automatic transmission, spoiler (functional!) on the stripped down, smallest Corolla (or non-Toyota POS.) So the 'hybrid premium' was always inflated by a factor of two. Then using these inflated 'hybrid premium', gas had to reach $3/gallon for someone driving 15,000 miles per year while I was burning through 18-20,000 each year.

We actually bought an Echo, $14,000, in 2001 with as close as we could get to the overloaded, Prius, $21,000. In 9 years, we barely put 30,000 miles on that 32 MPG (on a good day) Echo, my wife's goin' for groceries car. Eventually we sold it for $3,000 to buy our second Prius

In contrast, our used $17,000, 2003 Prius has gone 120,000 miles at 52 MPG and I'll drive it to work in the morning. It would have been more but that Echo had fold-down seats for fishing rods. The EU Prius had a fold-down seat.

Bob Wilson

 

We have had "Auris hybrid vs Auris ICE" in Europe since 2011. There was a bit of "hybrid premium", about 10%-15%, compared to the smaller 1.33VVti and roughly the same price as the 2.0 diesel option/ 1.6 valvematic petrol.
Right now the same thing happens to the Yaris HSD, priced equal to the 1.4D4D option.
Considering the hybrid gets automatic gearbox and less reliability/maintenance issues, it's a no brainer for many customers so far, every 3 Yaris sold one is HSD.

 

Yes, I think it's China only, at least for now.
And according to Vehicle Emission Control Center of MEP (China), the 8ZR is for Corolla Hybrid only and manufactured in TFTE (Tianjin FAW Toyota Engine Co.,Ltd.).
But I think the 8ZR code will appear in Toyota's Global EPC System very soon.

When Toyota's hybrid cars come to China, some engines do change their codes.
For example, Prius G3 & CT200h => 5ZR, Camry Hybrid => 4AR.
5ZR is made in Japan, 4AR is made in China, and now all THS ICEs in China, from Prius to LS600hL, do not have EGR.
I do not know the reasons.

The faux comparisons of 'Prius vs Corolla' happen in China all the time, too.
And FYI, the soon-coming Corolla Hybrid in China do have some "premium" options that Prius G3 in China don't have, like the paddle shift, the AHB, the "credit card key", ... etc., but the rear seat-backs can not be folded down like Auris Hybrid. According to someone met with its Japanese designers, it was explained as a compensation to meet Chinese customers' demands of passenger volume. So they made a mini Camry Hybrid.

Well... that kind of "no brainer" won't happen in China in the near future.
Most of the non-hybrid Corolla sedans sold in China were 1.6L petrol models without VSC, they are significantly cheaper.
It seems that Toyota want to sell Corolla Hybrid in China as a less-expensive and high-tech "premium" sedan, and there are no tax incentives for Toyota's hybrids in China.

 

Don't need fold down's with one of these bad boys ...



.

 

Thanks for the information. It doesn't sound like a link will do me any good.

It looks like the 5ZR is the chinese version of the 2ZR-FXE (prius engine), maybe the 8ZR has some or all of the improvements for the gen IV prius engine. I don't know if toyota has announced that engine code yet. Main differences from the current 2ZR-FXE that were announced for that are different piston cavity shape and higher energy spark plugs more aggressive cooled egr.

AFAIK, there are a few things that are dofferemt for china. The gasoline is allowed to have more sulfur, the emissions control is not as strict, the driving pattern is different. I'd expect only slight differences in the engine itself, but perhaps different firmware and emissions control equipment.

 

Hummm, now if China would allow only low emissions vehicles to operate during their "blue skies over Peking days" . . .

Bob Wilson

 

The Chinese government has just began to require manufacturers providing public-accessible tech info like techinfo.toyota, this process may take a year or two. Looking into EPC data and comparing part numbers one by one is another way, but it needs a lot time and only cover the mechanical part. Maybe I could revisit this question sometime later.
The fuel standards are evolving, but it is China, so the actual conditions may vary a lot from gas station to gas station. One half-rumor explanation of lacking cooled-ERG was mainly because of hard-to-tell gasoline quality. But they start to install EGR on 6AR-FSE engine this year, maybe Toyota finally found the actual gasoline quality had evolved enough to bear.
And yes all Toyota cars come to China need be tested and recalibrated for drive ability / fuel economy / emissions purposes. There is a big facility called TMEC (Toyota Motor Engineering & Manufacturing China, 100% owned by TMC) doing those jobs now.

The administrations are starting to make rules similar to Rome or London in mega cities, but often mixing with local protectionism and various political reasons. Peking for example, the BEVs get preferential treatments now, while PHEVs and HEVs do not counts at all.

 

The Nikkei Business Publications has published an article recently,
トヨタ自動車の中国戦略 HEVをガソリン車並みの価格に
sorry the full text is for paid members only and in Japanese.
The major points from the report:
1) The starting MSRP of Corolla Hybrid for China is even lower than a 1.8L non-hybrid Corolla ( now the hybrid's starting OTD price from dealer is a bit higher, and the optional equipments of hybrid/non-hybrid are different ).
2) The major THS components are manufactured or assembled in China ( for example, P410 transaxle by Toyota Motor (Changshu) Auto Parts Co., Ltd. ).
3) The NiMH battery cell and PCU are adopted from Prius Gen IV, while transaxle from Prius Gen III.
4) TMC aims to sale 3,000/month of Corolla Hybrid in China ( only about 5,000 CKD-type Prius Gen III from 2012 till the end were sold in China).

I rencently take some photos myself from a dealer's exhibit car, and the sales number is not bad in the beginning months.
under the hood


The PCU（by Tianjin DENSO Electronics Co., Ltd.）


The NiMH battery assy. ( by Sinogy Toyota Automotive Energy System Co., Ltd. )



And will we see similar ones in other market areas?
For example, the MSRP of Prius is ~$24,000 in the U.S. and Corolla is ~$17,000,
would a ~$18,000 Corolla hybrid be attractive enough?

 

I don't think toyota would sell a corolla hybrid that cheap, but yes a make in america corrolla hybrid might be picked over the prius c.
Compare Toyota Corolla VS Similar Competitor Vehicles

We can compare and see a corolla LE is $4400 less than a camry LE at $19,500, and $5470 less than a prius. Toyota is making a good profit on all these cars, and I don't think they want to cut into the margin to move people to a corolla hybrid, that is different in china, where they are trying to buy mind share and market share.

It should cost less to transform this to a hybrid than the camry though, but if its the same delta it would be $23,220 still motors, psd, battery will be less expensiv. Maybe its $22,700 to give toyota the proper profit margin. I think it would sell. Most of the engineering is done, and there is a flexible plant in mississippi. I think you use the new prius engine (more efficient) and lithium battery (less expensive to ship and takes up less trunk room). But will toyota corporate do it.

The major reason I think they won't is it will kill the prius c, which mainly was there to be less expensive than the prius liftback. With a corolla hatch I don't see people either moving to that or the gen IV liftback if they want better handling and a hatch back. Aqua is doing worse this year with the new prius, so this may mean less japanese employment.

It also may canibalize prius lifttback and camry hybrid sales. It has convential styling lower price and a trunk which may move people to it if they don't like the looks of the new prius. I don't think they will do it, but it would be good for the us hybrid market.

 

Yes, a nice departure from the front-end "hourglass" styling tedium:



Toyota designers love to latch onto strange design elements, repeat them doggedly, as if repetition will somehow...

Off my meds again. Anyway, though I read something about an Australian version, that was a hatch?

@Grus Your engine bay picture is from the new Corolla hybrid? It looks very similar to third gen Prius. I believe the latter is using a Corolla engine with some modifications?