Featured Consumer Reports' Highest-Rated Car-Ever

I don't think reliability was "ditched", it just was considered "average" for today and deemed not disqualifying. Average reliability in 2015, would have represented the best reliability 30 years ago. Look at the complaints many have to do with rattles or things not sounding right, which tesla fixes under warranty as they should. 30 years ago your car was supposed to rattle and grumble, and just not be quite right.

But JD. Powers, Consumer Reports, delta, etc allow you to examine the data, and decide if it is important to you.

Motor trend, Car and Driver, and now consumer reports also report what they think they are the best cars in every catagory. Motor tredn gave the model S car of the year in 2013, Car and Driver names it to their 10 best, and now consumer reports says the car is so good, they had to change the scale. If you have to have a mobile tesla mechanic come out, or go into the shop once a year for them to fix something under warranty, its not a big deal for these organizations. If the car wasn't drivable or didn't get fixed, or say you couldn't refuel it for weeks because the charging at your home didn't work, that would be a big deal. But none of those problems that people said would happen to the model S materialized, its a toughly modern, reliable, high performance, luxurious sports sedan. Like other cars in its segment the biggest problem is it is expensive.

They are trying to drive readership like all publications. If all they did was review corollas and focus's, you know the under $30K super reliable, what's the point. If anyone is suckered after motor trend gave it car of the year in 2013, car and driver gave it ten best, anyone that is suckered are those thinking that plug-ins are only a tiny niche. The model S blew consumer reports scoring system away. It was that good.

The Prius was also a niche vehicle for the first 6 years of its life. All those magazines loved reviewing it. Motor trend gave it the car of the year in 2004, and it was well deserved. Prius was also car and driver 10 best. The magazines loved putting the prius and the model S in those top positions as it drives readership, and the cars deserve it.

2004 10Best Cars - 10Best Cars - Page 12 - Car and Driver

 

Totally different.

It took time and sacrifice by Toyota to establish the market they eventually established for Prius.
But Prius was nearly ALWAYS marketed as a obtainable, usable "Peoples Car".
What made it a niche vehicle early on was nearly ONLY it's technology as a Hybrid. But as I think we are witnessing with each passing generation of The Prius, Toyota's aim was ALWAYS mainstream.

The Tesla?
Probably fair to include it's definition as a niche vehicle because it's an Electric.
But it's also $125,000 plus.

If it's a niche vehicle, it clearly isn't in The Prius family.
Toyota has always marketed The Prius as a vehicle viable to be parked and used from your garage.
Right now? At $125,000...The Tesla is a niche vehicle for those that usually have a "stable" of vehicles. If you're parking it, it's probably in a multi-car garage, in front of a very, very large house.

I don't think there are a lot of similarities between early Prius adopters and todays early Tesla adopters. There's at least a 100,000 dollar difference between the products.

Arguably they were/are both niche vehicles. BUT I'm not going too far in any similarities between the NO COMPROMISE Tesla,....and the early Prius, that actually flashed a Turtle Symbol from the dash board when the battery was strained to sluggish return levels.

I think what The Tesla IS..and what the goal and aim for The Tesla is, for the company quite a bit different than what The Prius was, and the goals and aims Toyota has more or less reached for Prius as a Brand.

 

It would be interesting to see what components actually cause the "reliability" issues. It may not take Tesla very long to fix issues with components built in-house. It would take longer to fix issues with vendors making parts not up to Tesla standards. This was an immense problem of the early Tesla vehicles. For example, the first Tesla battery packs were suppose to be built in Thailand for low cost labor and they quickly shifted to building the batteries in their own facilities. So far all evidence shows a very strong push to either get the vendors making high quality stuff or move fabricating it in-house. I certainly remember all the recalls and issues with my 2001 Prius...which I still think is a great car. Toyota addressed all the emergent issues and incorporated permanent solutions on the 2004 and later models.

 

How did you arrive at that number?

 

From the Consumer Reports Article itself which sites the vehicle they tested at $127,820.

I rounded down because I'm a thrifty guy.

 

That obviously is the very high end model. In all fairness, the base model is far less...and the base model is only slightly less impressive.

 

Well, we're discussing the vehicle consumer reports is reporting...which IS $127,820.

And I don't think it matters much. At this point, the products Tesla produces are expensive. Any way you cut it. Far less expensive is what?
$100,000? My point is still the same. The Tesla at this point is not a vehicle that is affordable for the masses.

 

When I hear peoples car, I think Volkswagen, which directtly translates to peoples car. I kind of cringe at the it costs so much more than a corolla.

The prius was never a bug, or corolla. They decided they didn't want to just build a higher mileage econobox. It was supposed to be affordable, and Toyota and the Japanese government were rich enough to subsidize it for a long time. Tesla is the first american car company to survive this long in 100 years. Let's not pretend that they will get the help japan gave toyota, or can afford to sell cars at a big variable loss like toyota did.

I have always hated the term mainstream. The prius in 2003, sold 43,200 world wide. That was the break out year of the prius, the introduction of the much improved gen II. 2003 is 2018 in tesla years (first prius 1997 end of year, first production (roadsters were hand built) car 2012). This year which is like 2000 for prius (sales 19,000) tesla should sell 50,000 vehicles. It is a lot less niche than the prius. In 2018 the much more mainstream model 3 should be in volume production. Tesla already is set to introduce their second bev, that took toyota much longer.

You don't mean mainstream, the gen I prius was a lot less expensive than a tesla. Its sales were much lower than the model S. Maybe you mean lower priced, not mainstream.

The model S 70D with autopilot (way more nicely equipped than any gen I,II, or III prius) is $80,000 before federal tax credit of $7500 and state incentives. How did you configure your car?

Its often the only car for many people. Where are you getting this stuff. Yes lots of people with a house and a multi meaning (2 car garage). Most prius owners also have a house and a 2 car garage. Go figure.

No it isn't the prius family. It took 15 years for toyota to get there from the first prius. Give the company some time. As for sales volume its blowing the gen I prius away. The prius was based on some immature technology. Telsa leveraged lap top batteries which were mature in 2012, but it also built a much more desirable car than the first gen prius. Those batteries are still expensive, that is why it raised more cash and is building the gigafactory to drive the prices down.

just for grins, the growth of toyota hybrids didn't happen right away

 

Well I don't know why anyone would bother to hate the term "Mainstream"....it's just a term.

And with all due respect, don't tell me what I mean.

Yes, I mean mainstream.

Maybe you don't perceive it, but there's a big gap between a Tesla and a Prius. And part of that gap, even if comparing the genesis of both products, is the intended audience, the price, and the immediate goals for that product.

I never said Toyota intended the Prius to be a VW bug or Corolla, but given the price and utilitarian sedan configuration of the first gen Prius they clearly intended it to be much more a common commuter than the luxury and expensive appointments of the Tesla project.
And I think Toyota HAS worked to mainstream the Prius as much as possible. They are proud of the total amount they have sold. I think they'ed be happy to say....The Prius is The Corolla of the Hybrid Market.

 

Many of the 'problems' listed for a reliability rating are minor issues, and are no where near the level of leaving you stranded. In which case, reliability doesn't equate to dependability. My 2005 Prius had the loose window trim pieces. That would be counted as a problem by the likes of CR, and factored into their reliability rating, but I never worried that the car wouldn't make the 600 mile trip to my parents.

 

You apparently didn't read the review, or see the video.
They didn't rate it on the future, they rated it on what it delivers today.

You may disagree with the emphasis, or lack thereof, of reliability or cost.
They covered both of these points in the video. However, even with those blemishes, the car still scored insanely high.

There are about 100,000 Tesla owners, over half of that in the U.S. And believe me, they have heard from a number of them not so pleased with some comments they made. They touched on that in their video as well.

You might do better to actually watch the video.

Someone brought up True Data's rating and mentioned 36 2013 cars. Was that a typo??
A sample size of 36 is highly unreliable. I would hope they get larger sample sizes that that.
I suspect even CR has a larger sample size of 2013 Model S owners than that.

 

"Mainstream" is a term many don't like because it is so vague.
The Prius is not Mainstream by some definitions, heck, hybrids aren't mainstream by some.
Neither are sports cars, or coupes.

Jon, as I recall, defined mainstream as 50,000 sales/year. This at least defines it, although nobody else likely has the same definition. So every time you use it, you need to define it again.

Is the Corvette mainstream in your definition?

 

The discussion has veered away from your starting point somewhat. Nobody is claiming the Tesla is cheap or the Prius is unaffordable. Here is the quote I'm not fully in agreement with:

I don't think they have "suckered" very many folks at all. Who is unaware that the Tesla Model S is an expensive high end auto? What CR did was check out first hand a car from a company claiming they are planning to make most of the Model S capabilities and technologies affordable in short order. While you may point out they are testing a high end auto (quite correctly) the counterpoint is they are testing one of the first automobile designs from a brand new car company using a completely unique production drive train. Seems worth checking out how this might be received using the Model S as the best proxy for a Tesla mainstream car. Doing that is not a deception, but a public service.

 

Thanks for the confidence that I'm stupid enough to comment without reading the article.

Underestimate me much?

Yes, they "rated it as the vehicle it is today"...duh..since they have no time machine and cannot go to the future and rate vehicles that don't exist yet.

BUT if YOU read the review, you'll notice they use phrase's very much applauding the break through nature of the vehicle. Such as:

" It's significance as a breakthrough model that is pushing the boundaries of both performance and fuel efficiency is dramatic ".

They close by describing it as:

" An automotive milepost. It's a remarkable car that paves a NEW unorthodox course, and is a powerful statement of American start up ingenuity"

Which would strongly suggest to me that from Consumer Reports perspective they are giving GREAT credit to the Tesla at least being the future of electric vehicles as they would like to see it. They rated it as the vehicle it is today, they like it because of what it "may" represent for the entire future of electric vehicles.

The use of the terms breakthrough, and mile post as well as the commentary on Tesla being an American Start Up company is what lead me to comparisons to The Automobile of The Future in 1940...The Tucker, and what I clearly think Consumer Reports is saying could be the automobile of the future in The Tesla.

I like the Tesla. Even though I have never ridden in one, and I'm 3 or 4 Lottery Grand Prize wins away from ever being able to afford one.

While I take Consumer Reports review with a grain of salt, I have no direct criticisms of it. Everything they said the Tesla can do? Is my guess exactly what it can do.

I suppose my only disappointment potentially, is that Consumer Reports is deliriously in love with The Tesla, based on performance standards that are comparative to Internal Combustion Engines. In other words, they love it, because it's fast, and quick. Even faster and quicker than most ICE vehicles. So they can find no way to NOT love it.

I suppose fine. No compromise is good. It's probably THE FUTURE.

But in a totally different and very personal to me viewpoint....I would like excitement created out of efficiency and non-fossil fuel burning capabilities...1st....and the fact that it can beat most ICE sports cars off the line- 2nd. In my personal opinion, until we embrace the importance of alternatives to fossil fuel burning engines as the primary importance, "we" and Consumer Reports haven't really reached out to the future as far as I think we need to do. I kind of feel a begrudging aspect to Consumer Reports review, as in they love it, because it beats ICE vehicles at their own game. Which kind of disappointingly appears to still be 0-60 times, acceleration and handling....with electric efficiency only as a "bonus" after thought.

But if it takes Tesla and "No Compromise" electric vehicles to pave the way to THE FUTURE and more wide spread acceptance across the board? I'm OK with that.

Tesla has built a ground breaking, mile post, break through vehicle today. One that is unique and NOT vastly affordable or available to the masses.

If Tesla the company thrives? And we are still talking about the products they are building and creating 10 years from now? That will be the real "Review" of Tesla.

 

I don't think you are stupid, I just don't think you have seen the video. I'm glad to hear you read the article.

CR did not rate the car as high as they did solely because of the 0-60 times. They actually said it had reached the levels of diminishing returns.
They rated it as high as they did because it delivers the whole package.
It is a large family sedan than can comfortably seat 5, plus two kids that also...
Delivers incredible performance that also...
Delivers great efficiency that also...
Gives an incredible drive quality.

And, I agree with you, it would be wonderful if in the future people only cared about efficiency.
The vast majority, judging by the 3% market share of hybrids, could car less.
So if Tesla can get people out of 15-20mpg sports cars, SUVs and trucks and into a 95-100mpge car that gets cleaner every year, I'll sing their praises.

 

The interesting part of this ad to me was the average 40 mile commute cost of charging they cited as $2.00. With gas now at $1.999-$2.149 locally, it hardly seems like charging is the bargain it was when the Tesla program was being planned. Which makes the economics of buying a car that is at least twice as expensive initially even after subsidies more problematic.

The other interesting item was the 20 minute 50% charge using a supercharger. Or only around 100 miles more charge. So my planned 616 mile Sanford NC to Tampa trip in one day would require 4 stops assuming my destination had a charger and my initial charge stop would actually be around 200 miles from home. That is an extra hour assuming the best case.

"Mainstream" to me means affordable to 80% of the people initially, affordable to run, well proven and relatively convenient. I don't consider a sports car or most luxury brands to fit that definition. Prius was initially a niche car, now more mainstream not because it sells in huge volumes but because it could be considered by most folk.