2012 Chevrolet Volt Racks Up 250,000 Miles, One-Third Electric, Rest At 39 MPG

If you counting the pollution for the electric production, then you need to account for the pollution of gasoline production. If getting the electric generation fuel, then the drilling and mining of the the petroleum source.

From the wall or pump, the EV will have no pollution. Of course making the electricity from coal will pollute more than refining even the heavy crude tar sands is by the time it reaches the refinery. But, depending on the local conditions, more pollution at the power station can be preferable to pollution within residential and metropolitan areas.
From the source, the difference in pollution between coal and tar sands, oil shale, and other nonconventional crude sources may not be that great.

With electric, there are options for the individual to use cleaner sources. That isn't so for gasoline. We may be able to boycott stations using tar sands gas, but as the cleaner, easier petroleum sources get used up, more and more dirty, unconventional sources will be used for gasoline. There are options for renewable gasoline and diesel, and the means to make them from cleaner natural gas, but relying on just economics to push them means burning through that unconventional crude first. Even with them, the total production levels will likely necessitate a fleet of plug in cars.

 

He wasn't comparing electricity vs gasoline. He was talking about Volt electricity usage on top of gas.

Emission from gasoline of both Volt and Prius would be about the same. However, the extra electricity that Volt used for 86,732 EV miles would emit 25,152 kg of CO2 (@ 290 g/mi).

 

Ah, the "from the plug" statement had me thinking we were looking at outlet or pump to wheels. In that case the EV miles add nothing to emissions. Just like FCEVs have emissions for pump to wheels.

If CO2 were the only emission to care about, it wouldn't be 25 metric tons more emitted. The 290g/mi value is calculated off some average commute and includes some gasoline usage. It would be down to around 17.6mt. Just subtracting out the tailpipe levels will leave the GHG from production of the gasoline used still in the value. Your values for 44813 zip code were 290g/mi w/ 84g/mi for tailpipe; I got 290 w/ 87 using 43203. There is also a 20g/mi difference in the average new vehicle. Beyond Tailpipe Emissions: Results

I now see the site you used doesn't ask for model year. Presumably in it is going by 2015MY consumption, and what ever latest data set they are using for the energy and fuel production. In 2014, the new vehicle average MPG reached 24.1 Average New Vehicle Fuel Economy Hits Record 24.1 Miles Per Gallon, Says EPA. The increase from 480g/mi to 500g/mi is likely due to increasing percentage of dirty oil shale and tar sands in the fuel supply. Which will just get higher.

Back to this Volt to Prius comparison. The 53mpg for the Prius could be erroneous. We don't know why he gets 2mpg over EPA combined in the Volt. The assumption is that his driving style is the reason, but it could that the longer commute means a larger percentage of highway miles. If that were the case, he would likely get lower than the 50mpg combined for the Prius with its 48mpg highway(49mpg for the PHV?). That would be more gasoline burned in the Prius than the Volt of around 350 to 440 more gallons.

Then the terms emission and pollution are being used. Carbon dioxide isn't the only emission coming out of a tailpipe or smoke stack, and the others might be more pressing to some people because of their relatively immediate affects on the environment and public health. Emissions, in this contest, covers air pollution. While there is also ground and water pollution to consider.

In truth, I responded because this is a comparison that really didn't need to be made in a thread about a single individual's car. Yes, the Prius or its PHV could be a better choice for those with a long commute, and lower emissions and fuel consumption are the main priority. It has already been hashed out in the many Prius/PPI vs. Volt threads.

This is an individual that already has the car, and may not have had this long of a commute when he bought it. With a family, there are some solid reasons to sell the house and move. There are also solid ones to not trade in a new car to buy another new car. His average CS mode fuel consumption of 39mpg already puts uncertainty into the generic Prius to Volt calculations. He reports getting 40 miles, with "a bit less" in winter, per charge. A comment mentioned his wife is an accountant, so TCO was likely more important than emissions or pollution in the buying decision. The GM employee family discount can be a big factor in that calculation. The car needs only one oil change in 38k miles; that's 1:3.8 to a Prius. At a great oil change price of $20, that's $76 and about 2.8 gallons of fossil fuel saved.

He went and bought a second Volt, but lets assume he would get something more suitable for his current commute. Considering his circumstances, it would likely be a Cruze diesel over a Prius. Highway fuel economy would be close, and the current diesel and regular gas prices in Ohio are nearly the same. The Cruze ECO would also be strong contender, with the Malibu as a maybe. The GM employee discount would have them all starting below the Prius base price.

The Prius plug in simply isn't sold in Ohio, or any of the neighboring states. Maybe their girds are just too 'dirty'. But it has just been shown here that it would mean less carbon emissions than this man's Volt.

 

The bottom line, his Volt (just the car) emitted more pollution than a Prius owner with a home (electricity usage).

I guess this is the unintended consequences of plugging in, the cost of electric drive experience. Isn't it ironic that the cost of EV experience is higher emission?

 

The bottom line of the OP article is that the Volt can go 250,000 miles without the need of any major repair, like any other reliable ICE car on the road today. It needed just wheel bearings as a repair. The maintenance costs were lower than an ICE car because of the very extended oil change intervals and regenerative brakes. The big news is that there are no problems with the battery or hybrid system.

This is just as important as the news of that gen1 Prius taxi going 200k or 300k miles without incidence.

This Volt's owner is in a small subset of American drivers that have a super commute; that is greater than 50 miles one way, and longer than an hour. Using it to draw any conclusion about a model's or car type's use will be misleading.

I agree with john1701a in that it isn't a competition between different alt. fuel cars, but alt. fuel cars vs. traditional ICE, but here we are using a statistical outlier of a driving pattern to show how one alt. fuel car is 'cleaner' than another, and how plugging in is dirty.

Our statistical outlier drivers 76k miles a year.
That is 19,000mt of CO2 a year for a Volt.
21,280mt of CO2 for a Volt in Ohio.
16,568mt of CO2 for a Prius. It is a lot less.
But...
The reality is this person would not have bought a Prius if the Volt wasn't available. As a GM employee, he most likely have gone with a Cruze if staying to a similar sized car.
One with the 1.4L turbo would emit 19,988mt/CO2.
The diesel would be 30,172mt/CO2.
If he bought the average new vehicle, he would be emitting 36,480mt/CO2 a year.

The market share for hybrids is around 3%. Their share among Toyota's sales might be 10%. The fact that this man bought a Volt, and is generating reports about how this new technology is as reliable as, or better, than an ICE car to help allay the public's fears of the new and different is a good thing.

 

Does it say anywhere if he's using solar to charge the car?

 

39 MPG? That's it? Man that is pretty embarrassing and rather dismal!

DBCassidy

 

Yes, one good data point. It also tells us that it results in high energy consumption and emission and tax payers money was used to allow him to "drive like he stole it" -- in his own word.

I did not see it but he probably charge at home overnight and at his work during the day.

If he has solar panels, that's a $20k option of the car as it was not designed to be clean using "stock" electricity.

 

Has either one of you looked at the consumption figures for the 95 plus percent of people are buying and driving?

These are the gasoline cars sold from 2014 to today with a combined MPG of 40.
Fuel Economy
The only non-hybrid is the Mitsubishi Mirage. Hybrid market share has been in a rut since before the gas price drop.

Up the combined MPG cut off to 45, and the 4 pages of cars drops to 5.
Fuel Economy
Of the cars on those lists, only the Prius liftback sells over a hundred thousand year. Of the others, the more successful ones will sell half of what the Prius does.

Sixteen point two million vehicles were sold last year. The average combined MPG of those vehicles was 25mpg. The Volt doesn't meet your high expectations, so what? Better this man is driving a Volt instead of a 25mpg sedan or a FSP pick up truck.
Detroit automakers all post December sales gains
Average fuel economy has hit a plateau

The plug in credits are working as intended. Want to discuss them further, there is a link to a thread in my signature.

 

It's nothing personal against the Volt driver. It’s fantastic that he’s driving such a fuel efficient vehicle instead of one of the countless numbers of other less capable vehicles.

The critique is rather directed at the articles showcasing him reaching 250k miles in a Volt.

As noted:

2012 Chevrolet Volt Racks Up 250,000 Miles, One-Third Electric, Rest At 39 MPG

“An impressive feat”


and also, for example:
2012 Volt Has Gone 247,585 Miles, Farther Than Moon is From Earth - HybridCars.com


These articles suggests two possible reasons why this was some special milestone:

1) The Volt just did something amazing, like first car to 250k miles that also did something technically impressive, not previously done

or

2) We didn’t expect the Volt to make it to 250k miles, but yay, it survived

Hopefully they weren’t shooting for proposition #2. But #1 isn’t right.

Lot’s of other Priuschat members here own a Volt and their driving stats are much more impressive than this guy. It’s nothing against him, just don’t think there is much for the authors to brag about here on his behalf.

But why should one be impressed with this “feat” and why are the article's authors so excited about it?

I personally think the Volt is a great vehicle and would have strongly considered it if matched my commute better.

 

If you look at the articles as being for the masses instead of us that are "in the know", you'll see their point.

 

The impressiveness is in going the 250k miles, not in EV ratio or emissions. Yes, other Volt drivers are better on that front, but a hurdle to plug in adoption, and to hybrids still in some circles, is the life of the battery. Remember, the rumors of hybrid batteries needing to be replaced before 100k miles.

 

In no small part propagated by GM and its fans. Karma

 

Is that total miles at 100k or EV miles at 100k? That's a pretty low bar if total 100k miles (gas + EV). Total EV miles at 100k would be a bit more reasonable for a battery pack the size of the Volt. But are we there yet?

 

i think the rumors were in connection to hybrid batteries. seeing that the volt has over 80,000, i think we know the answer.

 

But these were not directed at the masses, rather to folks like us. The OP article is a from "greencarreports" and the one I mentioned is from a website dedicated only to hybrid cars. BTW, the OP article writer seems to have lifted a good portion of content from Jeff Cobb who wrote the hybrid car article.

Point taken on the 100k hybrid battery issue.

However, the titles and articles strongly suggest that the battery issue was not their main point. If that were the case, the titles would have been something along the lines of "2012 Chevy Volt approaching 100k miles EV, showing batteries holding up despite initial concerns". That was also not the thrust of these articles.

Both the titles and content of these articles emphasized, instead, the impressiveness of the 250k miles total. The battery thing was more of passing commentary.

 

39 = 39 is still dismal mpgs' no matter how you slice it.

DBCassidy

 

I agree, but any GM car getting to 250k miles is news.

 

Well, in that case, hopefully we see many more Volts hitting 250k miles in good shape. Even if for mostly reasons ICE, having this PHEV prove to be a harbinger of quality/reliability for GM would be welcome.

GM may then earn back trust that has thus far kept some from otherwise buying the Volt.

 

More like pissing off the taxpayers after they realized the taxpayers are still paying the billions of the "bailout" loan. The loan the Treasury Dept. let Government Motors off (forgave) the hook and screwed over the taxpayers once again.

Don't you just love the government?

DBCassidy