Does the Toyota Prius still matter?

I'm getting a little tired of various anti-Prius articles declaring the era of the 40+ MPG non-hybrid vehicle.

When all it takes is just a little research to find out that while there are now ICE vehicles that proclaim to offer 40 mpg, this is the "highway" proclaimed MPG. The city MPG is always significantly lower. Which make the "combined" MPG of these mileage ICE wunderkinds still significantly below the combined MPG of a Prius.

But they keep on saying it, as in "Why would you buy a Prius when there are so many ICE 40 mpg choices?" but conveniently leaving out the obvious. 50 is a bigger number than 40, and then if you want to talk about what for most is the "Real World" combination driving of City and Highway...there is no ICE only vehicle that can offer you 40 mpg.

I'm not anti- ICE....I say keep pushing the efficiency envelope. But let's be honest when talking here. We do not "Yet" live in the world of the 40 mpg ICE vehicle. In fact in my very quick and rudimentary research, the only pure ICE vehicle, which comes close to the 40 mpg claim is the Mitsubishi Mirage and it does that with a very Spartan and econo-box 3 cylinder engine. It's less competition on any level to The Prius and more competition to a scooter.

Has the "Green" market grown...certainly. There are now more Hybrids, Plug In Hybrids and Full Electrics. Does this expansion of choices take away from the panache of being A Prius? Sure the Prius's success as well as being an aging model, with competition against Hybrids, Plug In's, and Full Electric vehicles and the lack of exclusivity as well as being a mainstream success means owning a Prius probably won't get you that Wow! He's driving a Prius! Look that perhaps it would of garnered not so long ago.

But as a standard Prius owner, none of that matters to me. For now? The Prius Matters. The Prius Matters to me.
Not all of us are living in an environment that is welcoming or convenient to Plugging In. Which leaves us firmly on that Standard Prius Hybrid Technology bridge.

 

What's wrong with asking a question?

Is the Prius still relevant? No I don't think it is. When it was introduced to the World in 2001 there was nothing like it. To Americans it was amazing that a car could get 3x the economy of anything else in their market. To the rest of the World it was amazing a car could get 50% more than anything else on their market.

Toyota got complacent and sat on their laurels AND the loyalty of their existing hybrid owning customer base. Now there are vehicles that exceed the Prius on official stats, though in reality they don't quite make it in the real world. But they cost a LOT less to buy. Then there are options for those who really want clean air such as a wide selection of BEVs and PHEVs which make the Toyota offerings look positively rubbish. I like(d) my Prius and it does a job. But there are so many alternatives out there that it would be rude not to consider them.

I could bore you all with price comparisons, but I won't. The Outlander PHEV and the new Golf Plug In both cost LESS than the PIP and signficiantly out spec it.

If the gen4 Prius isn't a quantum leap, then Toyota have dropped the ball. In 2 years time I will probably be discussing the benefits of my new BEV on a non Toyota based forum.

 

The Golf plug-in has to be sold in numbers to be matched to the PiP, both in reliability and maintenance issues.
There is no "out spec", except for the BHP delivered by the Golf. Everything else shows a much smaller car, with a ridiculous boot, and a MPG in CS mode that significantly ashames a hybrid.
Do not forget it holds a 1.4TSI (not very famous) and a gearbox DSG-alike (same doubdtful history of performance and problems)...
If I were with the Golf for a long trip, in my normal Prius I would beat it in MPG, and no electric consumption needed.

(the same applies for the Volt)

Efficiency, room, praticability in one car? PRIUS. Still is.

Agree here.

 

It all depends on the gen4 doesn't it

The gen3 is over 5 years old now, nearly 6. Obviously it can't compete. But Toyota are holding their cards very close and the competition haven't been sat around doing nothing for 5 years either.

eGolf, Golf GTE, Audi eTron, VW e-Up, Outlander PHEV, BMW i3, Nissan Leaf and eNV200 Combi/Nissan Evalia, Renault Zoe gen2 with longer range etc etc. Then the traditional fare of hybrids from Honda, Peugeot and Citroen. Plus many others I've forgotten.

Yes, it all depends on the gen4 Prius as to whether a Toyota is sat on my drive for another 5 years.

 

I don't think it's that. I think Toyota has known for quite some time that there's only so much juice you can squeeze out of the lemon (the ICE and its low thermodynamic efficiency) and has turned to hydrogen due to CARB and anti-nuke reasons at home.

 

agree with doug ^^^ probably not going to get much more out of the gen IV in terms of efficiency.

but yes, the prius is still relevant and will remain for quite some time, even without the gen IV. until they have a true rival, it's just a little loss here and there to the multitude of wannabe's.

 

I guess my answer is why even care about the answer to that question?

I mean, I've always said, and believe that I bought my Prius because I wanted an efficient vehicle. This happened to be a hybrid.

But as far as being relevant? or "Still mattering?"

On one level why does that even matter? I did NOT buy my Prius as a social statement, or to gain any credentials with any group.
I think the vast majority of vehicles chosen, bought, and owned by people are not really relevant as anything but being a vehicle.

I'll concede that in great part due to the success of Prius there are a vast majority of greater choices among hybrids, plug in hybrids and electric vehicles than there was a decade ago. I'll concede that being the established icon of the Hybrid market with the longest track record and biggest mainstream sales has by default dampened the "cool uniqueness" of owning a Prius. You can only be the "new kid on the block" for the short time that you are the new kid on the block.

But personally? I don't find those things to be relevant...to my desire to own and operate a Prius.
The Prius is still relevant to Toyota, and to me as an owner, and that's what matters.

 

I still think Prius hybrid is da bomb and hard to beat.

Now the US Congress sort of said "not invented here; not interested" and proceeded to give large subsidies for Plug-ins instead, hoping the US could take the plug-in crown.

It is true the competition has increased with aluminum F150 etc.

 

This question is pretty much the same thing as the, 'beginning of the end' thread . . . . questioning whether or not the Prius "is". AFAIK, it's still the only non-hybrid car EPA rated at 50mpg combined . . . and no one else has touched that. Oh geee - it has the same body style. If that's the line for relevancy, then guess what, non of us is/are relevant.
For that matter ... nothing matters.
(Ecclesiastes 1)
are you walking on sunshine yet?

.

 

I believe the Prius still holds the edge in reality over perception. Guerrilla-marketing might sway Joe Sixpack into believing he is getting something better and cheaper than a Prius, but fleet managers and taxi companies still look at real-world statistical evidence; and for economy and reliability, the Toyota Prius still maintains a substantial lead.

 

The Prius and full hybrid powertrains generally are more relevant than ever and will play a much larger role in the next 20 years than in the past 20 years.

ICE cars, even the latest and greatest small cars, realistically average no better than 33-35 mpg whereas a Prius does 40-50% better with 48-51 mpg. Just look at Fuelly.com.

It's inevitable that we will start taking rising CO2 levels seriously and will jack up gas prices and increase CAFE targets even higher. The most likely path will be to phase out conventional ICE powertrains for all but the most expensive and the very cheapest cars (low initial price but high operating cost).

Not everyone will be able to conveniently plugin a rechargable car. FCVs will be relatively more expensive, less convenient (fewer stations and smaller range), and no better at CO2 reduction so Prius-like full hybrids will fill the gap as conventional ICE cars are withdrawn from the market.

 

We have the new fit (36 combined with a cvt transimission, 32 with a stick), that has more passenger room than the liftback. Yes manual transmission gets worse mpg, but if you want it, mpg is good, Its too new for fuely, and there is self selection bias, but 35.6 mpg for this new model and that probably includes some sticks. Prius for the same time period (2015) is 45.6 mpg (but other years are over 50). Let's use epa. Over a 15,000 mile year a prius will use 300 gallons, fit 416. This comes to 1555 gallons over 200,000 miles. But consumer reports, car and driver, etc all like the fit better. Sure you can't get some luxury features you get on the prius, but you can get off the dealers lot in a fit for a lot less money, better acceleration, more usable cargo with the seats down, etc. Go to cars with trunks and it gets worse. If you want to use less oil though, instead of save money then choices are different. Volt gen II will probably burn about 121 gallons or save about 2400 gallons over 200,000 miles over the prius. The i3-rex will burn less, the outlander phev due next year a little more, and bevs nothing at all outside hawaii and a few mainland counties.

but plug-ins count as more than one car for cafe purposes, so you get more of a cafe boost producing regular cars + phevs than hybrids ;-)

While many choose cars to use less oil, producing less ghg polls very poorly. It is mainly used as an excuse not to get a plug-in and get a SUV because electricity is so dirty. The majority of hybrid buyers today do have plugs or potential plugs avaialable. Certainly there is a place for hybrids but in the US their probably is a ceiling bellow 10%. The price needs to drop significantly to break that. Low gas prices favor plug-ins over hybrids,plugins are simply too new. In a decade they won't be.

 

I tend to keep cars 10 years these days. Just told my insurance company that I was averaging 10k miles/year. So at 10 years I'd have around 100k miles at 41+ MPG driving a mix of city and highway with no attention to special hybrid techniques. I have a v, the heavy bulky roomy Prius.

In 10 years, will a Prius still be the answer? We don't know but imagine the amount of generating capacity the US grid would have to add to satisfy the charging needs that would be required to replace all the gas consumed today. How many hundreds of billions of investment would that take?

Prius sales are down because of end of model cycle fatigue, gas prices drop, horrid winter in the midwest and east (22F here tonight). Far too many are rushing to buy macho cars/trucks with their sudden gas-prices windfall. But taxi drivers all over the world are still buying Prius and you know they are cost per mile conscious. Crude is up, oil prices here up ten cents in the last week.

Will be fun to see what the auto makers come up with over the next 10 years.

 

if electric prices skyrocket, that will make for an interesting effect.

 

That's why many are going solar . . . so no energy provider can stick it to you.

 

that's great for those with the ability and desire. the other 99.9% won't be buying ev's unfortunately.

 

Does the Toyota Prius still matter?
Toyota is still building them.
People are still buying them.

They must still matter to somebody.

Of course if the G4's look anything like the press photos?
I'll be buying a Volt or a leftover G3 for my next vehicle.

If there is a G4?
Priuses will still matter.

 

Our mpg ratings kill those of the stupid Fiat 500 and Smart car...and they use Premium fuel and are tiny. If we didn't get a Prius I'd get the 40 mpg Mazda 6 or 41 mpg 3. For a free oil change at the local Chevy dealership on my 99 Z28 I took a test drive in a new Sonic Turbo that had a rating of 29/40 with the manual. The salesman and I took a 17 mile trip on the car that had 12 miles on it when we left. Driving like I had an egg under my foot and driving gently it only indicated 17 mpg! The salesman said that our Prius might only be a little better...so we went for the same drive in it...having reset the trip b odometer...no hyper-milling. He was totally blown away to see 55.1 show up.

When we bought the car gas was right at $4 a gallon and at that price it was saving us $280 a month in gas cost savings compared to our 01 Voyager. When it dropped to $2 a gallon we are still saving $140 a month! If I had designed the drivetrain I imagine that currently available non-cvt transmissions would generate better economy yet.

 

Toyota put a lot of thought into the Prius. Toyota now needs to step up and exceed the pure electric standard of the Nisson Leaf and other pure electric vehicles. We own and drive a Nisson Leaf. All the accouterments (heated steering wheel and seat, plug-in) are very nice.