1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Won't start, "check hybrid system" on Gen III

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by rogerv, Oct 2, 2014.

  1. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Daughter's car in Ohio, 70k miles. Towed to dealer after attempting jump start. She was told it was "an internal power supply for the hybrid system computer" that failed, something they rarely see. First thing I thought of was the 12v, as the car is about a week shy of three years old. The dealer is hoping to get the part overnight, but is providing a loaner, supposedly at Toyota's expense.
    My search resulted in failed inverter stories. Any suggestions or other input appreciated. I will update once she has a completed repair order from which to give me parts info over the phone or email, as I'm flying a bit blind for now.:rolleyes:
     
  2. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2006
    11,341
    3,596
    1
    Location:
    Northern VA (NoVA)
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    ...could be a blessing in disguise... if it's covered via warranty i guess you can thank the vehicle for not waiting until 101k miles to do this...
     
  3. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Update: she got the car back today, repairs and loan car covered under warranty. Quoting from the paperwork,
    "Check warning lamp on hybrid battery, car won't start."
    "p3004 detail 800". (Would this be the code thrown by the computer for the malfunction?)
    "R&R IPM PER EOE"
    Parts:
    Transistor Kit, P
    Grease x 23 7884
    Plug Kit, Inverter
    Adhesive TSE3971
    Seal Packing
    Gasket
    Unfortunately, at this time I can't determine the total labor hours involved from the phone picture I was sent, although it appears that they charged 3.6 hours for diagnosing the problem.
    Just got a note from my daughter saying the service writer told her the cost would have been $4500.00 if not under warranty.
     
    #3 rogerv, Oct 6, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2014
  4. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    110,156
    50,059
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    what year is it?
     
  5. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    2011, purchased on 10/11/2011
     
  6. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    56,686
    39,235
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Could the jumpstart cables been reversed?
     
  7. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2013
    16,525
    8,428
    0
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Probably a symptom associated with the inverter extended warranty
     
  8. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    My daughter asked the AAA guy if he was familiar with the Prius and he said he had jump started many. He did it directly to the battery, not at the underhood connectors. From what I have read here, cross connecting the cables severely damages the hybrid system computer, something I imagine the techs would have picked up on during the diagnosis. Yes, it was covered under the 8 year- 100k mile hybrid system warranty.
     
    Mendel Leisk likes this.
  9. jdcollins5

    jdcollins5 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    5,131
    1,340
    0
    Location:
    Wilmington, NC
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    I would take the IPM Per EOE and the Transistor Kit to mean that they replaced the Inverter Power Module. This is what the EOE software upgrade was meant to help prevent a failure of the transistors in the Inverter Power Module.

    Part of the EOE recall was to test the power module and replace if necessary.

    Your daughter is fortunate to have the IPM replaced under warranty now.
     
  10. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Thanks for the info. I don't remember her mentioning any recalls, but will ask her about it. She has had the car in to the same dealer where she bought it every 5k miles for service, so I would think they would have caught it even if she didn't bring the car in response to a written notice. She was indeed lucky to have it fail during the warranty, but now it makes us wonder what lies ahead once she passes the 100k mark. She is hoping to get ten years and 250k miles out of this car. Having to spend $4500 out of pocket would be difficult for her, if that is indeed what this repair would have cost. Even at close to $100 labor per hour, it seems high to me. :confused::(
    I read the notice on the recall, and in part it says if the inverter failed prior to the recall repair being done, Toyota would replace the inverter at no charge. Hers didn't go into "limp home mode" as described in the notice, but rather just wouldn't start. So for whatever reason, her car was either not part of the original recall or just didn't get the repair done earlier this year, or worse yet, had it done and still failed!
     
    #10 rogerv, Oct 7, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2014
  11. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Upon further reflection, I wonder if the service writer said, "four to five hundred dollars" which seems more reasonable. I will have to ask her. ;)
     
  12. jdcollins5

    jdcollins5 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    5,131
    1,340
    0
    Location:
    Wilmington, NC
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    $4500 was probably correct. Some Gen 3 owners have begun receiving letters from Toyota stating that the IPM warranty was being extended to 15 years.
     
  13. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    But the repair order only shows a total of 3.6 hours labor, and their rate is listed as $95 per hour. I originally thought the 3.6 hours was just for diagnosis. Hard to imagine something like 40+ hours labor per car with 70 thousand recalled. If you have any info on the letter, I would appreciate hearing about it. Do you know if there is a mileage limit extension as well?
     
  14. macman408

    macman408 Electron Guidance Counselor

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2010
    1,179
    367
    1
    Location:
    California
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    V
    The inverter is an expensive chunk of hardware, $4500 wouldn't surprise me too much. Labor is only a small part of the cost here. Also, 3.6 hours is probably the amount that Toyota will pay for this particular issue. In general, those times are on the short side - if your mechanic isn't at the top of his game, he might take a little longer to diagnose the issue, or if he hasn't done many of these repairs, it might take him some extra time to take apart these pieces of the car. If you're paying for it out of pocket, it's likely that you'll get billed for the actual time spent. Toyota is in a position of power, and can dictate to the dealerships how much they'll get paid - and if they take longer than that, it's their own fault.

    The 15-year warranty on the IPM is for unlimited miles. But since hers was just replaced (and undoubtedly had the recall performed as well, if it hadn't been already), it's not likely to fail again. The warranty is basically just good news for anybody who had the recall performed, but didn't have it fail yet - it may have been left in a marginal state, only to fail in a couple years. There were a couple folk around these parts who were even planning on avoiding having the recall service performed, because they'd rather just have their IPM fail sooner and get it replaced under warranty. Now there's not really any incentive to do that.
     
    jdcollins5 likes this.
  15. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    I admit to being a bit confused on this issue.:confused: From what I tell from the repair order, only the transistors in the inverter were replaced, not the inverter itself. That sounds to me like the same work as would have been done under the recall, notice of which she never received, BTW. Is it possible not all the 2011 cars were subject to the recall? She has been at the same address, etc. since she bought the car, so that shouldn't have been an issue.
    I appreciate the input from all of you.:)
     
  16. jdcollins5

    jdcollins5 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    5,131
    1,340
    0
    Location:
    Wilmington, NC
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    The EOE safety recall was basically a software upgrade to reduce the stress on the Inverter Power Module or power transistors. The IPM was to be tested and if failed the test then it would be replaced. Most that reported on here just had the software upgrade. There were only a few that had the IPM replaced.

    Only the IPM, or p0wer transistors, are included in the extended warranty, not the entire Inverter module. The IPM is a sub-unit of the Inverter module and can be replaced without replacing the complete Inverter module.

    It is possible that your daughter's car was not included in the recall or the dealer could have just completed the software upgrade during a normal maintenance visit.
     
  17. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Ok, thank you jd. I ran the VIN on Toyota's recall info site, and it shows nothing open at this time. Of course, if the recall service was just done and the dealer fed the info into the system, it should show the car clear of any recalls.
    In an earlier post, I mentioned the high cost to Toyota for 70K vehicles. It was actually more like 700,000 cars in the recall. Damn bifocals!:LOL: Or maybe just not paying close attention to what I'm reading?:ROFLMAO:
    Anyway, I will have my daughter look over her service records from earlier this year and see if she can find where the software upgrade was done. In any case, it sounds like she should be ok with this particular issue. I will also suggest that she contact either the dealer or Toyota directly to see if she has the extended 15 year warranty, which would put her mind (and mine) at ease.
     
  18. kknguyen1168

    kknguyen1168 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2011
    453
    35
    0
    Location:
    san diego
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    R0gerv

    I you can confirm that she has extended to 15 years warranty please let us know.


    V/r

    Khoi Nguyen
     
  19. rogerv

    rogerv Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2008
    1,639
    317
    14
    Location:
    Simi Valley, California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    Will do. She did have a recall done back in April. It was listed as "ECU Reflash." Is this related to the "R&R IPM per EOE" listed as the work just done?
     
  20. jdcollins5

    jdcollins5 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    5,131
    1,340
    0
    Location:
    Wilmington, NC
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    III
    Yes, the ECU reflash is the same as the software upgrade mentioned above. The reflash or upgrade was done to reduce stress on the IPM transistors and to try to prevent failure. Your daughter's transistors failed in spite of the reflash.

    This is the very reason Toyota has extended the warranty on the IPM.