Prius Plug-in and Volt Pros and Cons

Of course. But there are costs for the electricity. When you talk about the blended total per mile rate of 100 mile trips, the Prius will win over the Volt, which gets 25% poorer ICE-based-mpg and requires premium fuel.

There are myriad graphs and analyses on the Internet to confirm this.

For the commuter with a longer than 11 mile trip but shorter than 35 miles, the Volt will indeed pencil out better. But it holds substantially less cargo, 20% fewer humans, and quite frankly, is not economical once the ICE runs.

I think the Volt is a neat car for those using it as a quasi-BEV.

 

The presently selling Volt (starting in 2013) is EPA rated with a range of 38 miles, not 35. The EPA rated range of the Prius Plugin is 11 miles but includes about 1/50th of a gallon of gasoline or about 1 mile worth of gas.

A 100 mile trip in a Prius PHEV would therefore, according to EPA, go 10 miles on electricity and 90 miles on gas at 50 mpg and would therefore consume 1.8 gallons of gas.

A 100 mile trip in a Volt would go 38 miles on battery leaving 62 miles on gas. Using combined mpg of 37 mpg that 1.68 gallons of gas. More realistically, at the highway EPA estimate of 40 mpg it would be 1.55 gallons of gasoline. Any single trip of 100-150 miles is highly likely to be overwhelmingly driven under highway conditions and both cars allow easy driver control to allow EV miles to be used for city driving and hybrid gas engine miles to be used on the highway.

The actual break even point is a 150 mile trip which would be 140 miles on gas at 50 mpg or 2.8 gallons plus 10 battery miles for the Prius PHEV. The Volt would be 112 miles on gas at 40 mpg using 2.8 gallons of gas plus 38 miles on battery.

So, any single trip in the Volt would use less gasoline than the Prius PHEV between 10 miles and 150 miles long.

And actually, I'm tipping the balance in favor of the Prius since it's actual EPA highway mpg is 49, not 50.

Comparisons based on other criteria like fueling costs and CO2 emissions require additional information or assumptions and vary by region.

 

Actually, no. Looking at the releases & comments prior to rollout, it was to fit the needs of 80% of daily driving.

When the EV range fell short, the "daily" was changed to "commute".

That omits any driving other than going to & from work. How realistic is that?

Also, the 80% statistic fell apart when other surveys ended up showing the percent was much lower. The original consumer sampling was too small, giving the skewed results.

 

You didn't answer the question.
I am trying to address the question about a car being bad simply because it gets poor gas mileage after it runs out of its temporary range.

So again, pretend both cars are Prii. If you wish, the Prius A is my dream 2nd gen PiP.

So Prius A-automatically fueled to 50 miles each morning. 35 mpg after that range.
Prius B-50mpg at all times.

A and B are identical in all other ways (price, cargo & passenger room, appearance, etc)
Which would be your preference?

 

You left out the extra cost of electricity for the volt. The 38 miles Volt EV -10 miles Prius EV= 28 miles EV more for the volt at $ 0.12/kwh comes to approximately $0.91 so I am not going to do the algebra but the break even is closer to 120 to 130 miles.

 

Bill, we know you're on the Internet. You've found a place to post all about the Volt on a site dedicated to the Plug-in-Prius. I would imagine if one of the PiP owners went over the the Volt forum and incessantly nitpicking the foibles of the Volt it would be considered quite rude.

However, I can't let your quote above go by. From the Chevy Volt page and I quote: "Engine, Range Extender, 1.4L Internal Combustion Engine (83 hp [62 kW]), requires premium fuel (STD)" - Build an Electric Car: 2014 Chevy Volt | Chevrolet

Yes, you have the Internet. And I can find you 1,000 incorrect medical "facts" and false medical claims on the Internet without much trouble. You seem to be able to find the same regarding your choice of a Volt. And then repeat them.

However, the authoritative source is the manufacturer. Case closed and I bid you adieu.

 

Even assuming your numbers, you forgot to factor the 20% less human carrying capacity and substantial cargo limitations.

Again, enjoy your Volt. But do you need to justify your decision on a forum not related to the Volt? As I said to Bill N, if a PiP owner went to the Volt forum and started hammering on the limitations of the Volt, it would be rude.

 

This is quite true, although it's worth noting that the official GM recommendation for the Volt and Ampera in Europe is to use "regular" 95 RON Octane gasoline which is equivalent to mid-grade gas in the U.S. Presumably one could feel confident using mid-grade instead of premium.

 

I generally try to keep the Volt out of Prius PHEV threads that I contribute to unless someone else mentions the Volt first and I feel that potentially misleading information is being posted or something someone else posted about the Volt is missing relevant context.

I hope I've made it clear in my posting over time that I'm a strong supporter of the Prius and hybrid technology generally and that I like the Prius PHEV and think its a perfectly fine car for a variety of driving conditions and requirements. I participate on PriusChat because I'm long-time Prius owner (since 2000) and I enjoy the discussion. In my opinion, both cars excel in their own various different ways.

 

Here are how the Volt and PiP would stack up on a 100 mi trip using the data from:
Argonne TTRDC - D3 (Downloadable Dynamometer Database)

I believe it would be difficult to achieve this efficiency in real life, but it should be a fair comparison of the relative efficiency of the two vehicles at least under similar conditions. Driving more aggressively or at higher speed would likely increase the Volt's advantage as the PiP would use more gas sooner.

For cost estimates, I'm using the latest US averages reported by DOE 11.88c/kWh AC, Regular $3.66/gal, Premium $4.01/gal.

Urban 72F, 14 consecutive cycles = 104.4 miles
2013 PiP: 2563 AC Wh + 1.256 gal regular = $4.90
2013 Volt: 13012 AC Wh + 1.205 gal premium = $6.38

Highway 72F, 10 consecutive cycles = 102.5 miles
2013 PiP: 2323 AC Wh + 1.324 gal regular = $5.12
2013 Volt: 12753 AC Wh + 1.155 gal premium = $6.15

On an MPGe basis, the Volt seems to come out ahead between 19 to 80 miles highway, and 18 to 73 miles urban.

On a cost basis, using the same current averages, it looks like the Volt comes out ahead from about 18-65 miles for both urban and highway.

Rob

 

Average cost for mid-grade is $3.84, so knock about 20c off the Volt cost if you go with mid-grade instead of premium.

Rob

 

So, you once again repeat something in clear contradiction to the manufacturer as evidence the manufacturer is wrong.

 

FWIW as far as I can tell there seems to be little agreement on the Volt boards about using less than premium fuel. Some say it's fine. Others report loss of power and reduced mpgs when running 87.

 

I can't wait till they have engine problems and get a big "Warranty Denied!" for intentionally (and publicly, in Bill's case) using the wrong fuel. Just wait for it.

 

Did you assume the same interior space? Somehow 50 miles battery pack (~20kWh) gets crammed into a magical place?

50 miles charge appears magically? Not possible over night with a standard outlet.

Charging at night demand fossil fuel from power plant. Selling your solar electricity in day time can cancel out, ONLY if you don't sell the solar RECs.

Prius A would cost the same? Hard to believe.

There is another choice, Prius C - ~11 miles gas free (3 hrs with standard outlet) and 50 MPG on regular gas after that. The same passenger and cargo capabilities. Cost the same after incentives.

Since I do either very short or very long trip, Prius C is ideal for me.

 

People with 20 miles or less commute has better choices, PiP or Energis with better gas mileage, passenger and cargo capabilities.

Only 20-38 miles are left for Volt. Even that competes with Leaf and many other EVs. If I recall, 20-38 miles commute only makes up <30% of all commute. That's why Volt is struggling to sell even with heavy incentives.