Next voltec, what do you think of the new rumors

Who cares about "he said, she said".

The truth is the bottom line: final sales numbers at the end of the year.

Enuf said.

DBCassidy

 

It matters when people say the Volt failed because it didn't beat the Prius.

 

Who is GM anyway?

Hype was allowed to take on a life of it's own. Whenever something was said, it was always intentionally ambiguous. There hasn't been any accountability. Anyone of responsibility left the project. Enthusiasts were enabled.

Look at what's happening was the next generation, the same nonsense is repeating. We all know the what's required. That shouldn't need to be said.

Success will always be defined by sales. The business requires high-volume profitable sales. Being green cannot be achieved without those sales.

 

I didn't follow what GM said or didn't say in the run up of the Volt. I knew they had regular announcements from posts here. I really didn't care beyond them actually releasing the car or not. There was enough doubt about the Volt even doing that back then.

What nonsense is repeating? I know GM wasn't transparent about the serial hybrid detail, and may have over promised on things with the first Volt, but what have they done that is the same in regards to the upcoming generation.

The only thing I've seen that they said about the next gen was lowering the price by $7500 to $10,000. The was by the former CEO, I believe, and was before the $5000 price reduction on the current model. Everything else I've seen was speculation by people outside of GM. Have I missed something?

So then, GM regularly released, maybe misleading, details about the Volt. Now, they are keeping quiet. How is that the same? Because they aren't actively squashing rumors? Shouldn't Toyota be doing the same in regards to 60mpg ones for the next Prius? Or are they to busy regularly releasing announcements about their upcoming FCEV with no more substance than the last one?

Companies might have some more options than an individual when comes to controlling rumors, but not much more. Or they may simply see a benefit in the rumors, free publicity and all. There is little of the same nonsense from before on GM's part this time around.

 

At least some of what John perceives as nonsense from GM during the Volt's development was probably inherent in the unusually open design process of the original model. As Trollbait noted, GM is following the more typical secretive policy in the design of the new model. They've said hardly anything about it on the record except for comments about lowering the cost.

I've never been involved in a new complex hardware design like a car much less one with a novel transmission, new large battery pack and unique control software.

I would imagine that there is a level of uncertainty during that multi-year car development process about exactly what performance and efficiency you will achieve and sometimes things don't work out as perfectly as planned.

I've never seen anyone from GM say this, but there could have been some uncertainty about whether they could make the clutch engagements work well enough in the Volt transmission. It wouldn't shock me if they had an actual backup plan to just run it as a simpler serial hybrid.

There are hints from the Telegraph reporter who reviewed an engineering development test car in the early summer of 2010 and first reported the parallel design based on a loose-lipped GM European engineer. He reported the Volt had poor acceleration at highway speeds but it was due to some clutch shifting not being implemented in the control firmware yet. Or something. This was only 6 months before the first cars were delivered to customers and 3 months before GM publicly disclosed the parallel design.

Volt shock - Telegraph

Not talking about the parallel power splitting capability could have been a case of under promising. But as we can see, nobody ever interprets it that way. GM is just criticized for not disclosing the power split design from the beginning.

 

well, we're coming up on the two year anniversary of this thread. still, i have no idea how these rumors get started.

 

Funny thing about RUMORS is that they always tend to spawn from a KERNAL of truth/fact, etc., only their applied AMPLIFICATION-factor is grossly way out of proportion.

 

It is unfortunate most people are unaware of the past. To those of you who have openly stated not having followed Volt until later in the process, THANK YOU for stating that. It's far better than back when we pointed out the parallel to Two-Mode development and having been accused of trying to promote Prius rather than getting any type of constructive acknowledgement. That's what the nonsense emerged from.

Having witnessed the entire process twice already and seeing the pattern start for a third, it's a very real issue finding an effective way to convey that information. Items get argued down simply due to lack of detail... the very content I documented to the extreme back when those previous events happens, as they were unfolding. Even the act of looking back afterward presents a perspective different from that of not knowing yet.

Long story short, I expect quite a bit of criticism from the resulting over-simplification. Not addressing all the reasons why is a problem we've already seen repeat.

Then, of course, we have the problem of some people not having the background. Unless you've studied economics, accounting, and engineering, there are aspects of discussions being missed.

The biggest problem, though, is not having goals or even an audience clearly identified. Failure is inevitable when particulars are not provided for the measure of success.

I do. There are countless quotes in my hundred of pages of blogs pointing out the emergence of false beliefs. With Volt in particular, there were some rather intense fights which came about from those of us who questioned sources and pointed out claims without merit.

Sadly, there are also greenwashing efforts. My all time favorite is how Toyota clearly stated in a presentation how lithium-based batteries were still too expensive to be used profitably and people would intentionally misled by making the claim that those batteries could never be used. It was a blatant disregard for what was actually said. They didn't care.

Then when Volt rolled out, there was a huge effort to undermine PIP by making people believe the plug-supplied electricity wouldn't be used at all once the engine started or you exceed 62 mph. No matter how many times the correction information was provided, the same people would keep posting greenwash material.

So, simple things like rumors, are easy to see how they get out of hand. Consider the reality of most people taking what they read at face value, never bothering to confirm facts or follow up. It's really disappointing to learn how common that is.

 

2016 Chevy Volt spotted testing its electric beating heart

 

The wide wheels look interesting, but the paint job's got to go.

 

LOL! The 110 plug hanging from the front grill has to go as well

 

Here's a photo of the driver.

 

What? You people got something against the "new" generations' Black & White PAISLEY paint schemes?

 

And yet the Volt outsells the PPI in most months simply by offering it to customers without any regional limits. Isn't failure inevitable when there are self-imposed obstacles between the customer and the product?

The world is full of fools. I try to filter out there opinion when possible. That can get tedious, and more so when trying to combat false rumors. They have been part of human nature from the beginning though. They were circulating, and still are in some areas, about hybrids when they arrived. They were also out when horseless carriages started showing up. They probably even existed when people started clambering onto the backs of huge, powerful animals.

GM had a part to play in this with the first Volt. For the second generation GM has been playing differently by keeping mum as these companies usually are with model development. A decrease in price and an increase in range is all that can be traced back to GM so far. These could have been reasonable deduced just based on the progress of battery technology. So why are you accusing them of the same old, same old from the first generation? GM's behavior has been different. There will always be rumors, but that is pretty much outside of GM's, or anybodies', power to control. Knowing there won't be more than rumor there, I don't visit the 4th gen forum. Do you speak out against it there?

 

$5,000 of tax-credit incentive has no influence? Whatever.

Rumors are a powerful marketing tool. Simply dismissing & ignoring them enables their influence. Combat is necessary. We asks questions and insist upon supporting material.

 

QUOTE: "Enquiring MINDS want to KNOW...the rest of US are just NOSEY!"

 

Yes it does have one, but Toyota has chosen to go back on their plan of expanding the availability of the PPI. With it available in the region where 60% of Prius sales occur, it isn't an unreasonable assumption that its sales could increase by 40% if the PPI was available nationwide. People are buying now, despite the incentive advantage the Volt has.

You have stated that PPI sales are low because the public is confused on its operation and Toyota's vision of a PHV, and this will turn around as word of mouth from satisfied owners spread. Wouldn't this happen quicker if more people had the opportunity to become satisfied owners and spread their words?

Fourteen states is not mainstream.

If someone sources a message thread that is admittedly discussing rumors as fact, I will call them a fool. If the belief is that GM is the source of these rumors, then supporting material is needed or risk being called a paranoid fool.

So, are you now going to call for supporting material whenever someone mentions the 4th generation Prius getting 60mpg?

 

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" -- Marcello Truzzi & Carl Sagan.

"Ordinary claims require ordinary evidence" -- PriusChat.

 

Rumors are rumors - get it?

DBCassidy

Who, what, where, why is there GM? The Volt never was given goals to achieve in the current market place.
It holds true today. What is its' market. Who is the product geared to? Where will this product grow in the market? Why is GM not doing the above.

One of the things Government Motors is doing is defying logic. Oh, the other is placing themselves under a global looking glass with the ignition switch fiasco!

Government Motors has been givened every form of corporate well to survive. Yet, hide from the public the 10 year secret of the switches.

One can reasonably ask - What else is Government Motors hiding from us???

DBCassidy

 

We've learned that advancing the established markets (particular states) is the better course.

I have been, but rumors of strongest influence have originated from outside this forum. So, the well informed have been fighting the battles here.