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Advise on whether I should keep my new Insight or get a used Prius...

Discussion in 'Honda/Acura Hybrids and EVs' started by That_Prius_Car, Jan 15, 2014.

  1. That_Prius_Car

    That_Prius_Car Austin Kinser

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    Hey guys,

    as some of you may know, I leased a new Honda Insight in August of 2013 and traded in my blue moon pearl 2002 Prius.

    Firstly let me say that I only bought the Insight because I didn't want a used car because I haven't had good luck from used cars. Toyota wasn't giving me a good trade on my 2002 Prius that was in MINT condition. Honda was giving me a good bit more and offering a better price for the Insight, so I pulled the trigger thinking "Oh! This will be different! I've always owned Prius' and now I can say I've owned a Honda hybrid too! They're great cars!" I pretty much talked myself into it. There was no pressure from the dealer.

    I now have 2,600 miles on the car and needless to say, I can't stand it. I just can't handle the IMA system. I personally think it's plain dangerous pulling out into an intersection where it hesitates as the engine HAS to start back up to get going, then jerks forward as the CVT engages. I got the base model that lacks cruise control, steering wheel mounted controls, yadda yadda.
    So lately, I had been looking at used second generation Prius' and this one Toyota dealer called "DAY TOYOTA" in Pittsburgh has always been so helpful and kind to me. They don't pressure you and they're very soft spoken and kind. So my sales lady Karin called me to tell me they had just gotten in a used 2007 Prius with 101,000 miles in mint condition that had one owner and would be priced at about $9,000 to $10,000. So I drove up today to look at it and it is in excellent shape. Even crazier, the man who had traded it in was at the dealer when I was there today so I got to speak with him first hand about it. He was about 77 years old and he said he drove it to see his grandchildren in Vermont, yadda yadda, and that he had all the service done at Day Toyota every 4,000 miles (even though I usually go 2k-3k longer after I put in synthetic) and he just replaced the 12v battery last summer, and put new tires on it 15,000 miles ago.

    It's really a great car and has the options I want. It has no dents and very little hood dings, none that I even noticed really. I can just tell it was really well cared for.

    So here's the question. my Insight's payment is $282.24 a month for three years at 10,000 miles a year.
    I owe $17,000 on it and the dealer is only giving me $14,000 (they have a used Insight on their lot they've had for almost a year with 30,000 miles for $12,000 that has not sold) and I can finance the Prius for 5 years and the payment she said she could work out to be between 290-308 a month, but that's for five years. Then when it's paid off, I could sell it for 4,500+ (I take REALLY good care of my cars.) and make that money I lost initially back. Whereas, the Insight, I'd be stuck with a car I didn't like for 8 or more years paying ~200+ a month. I see the Prius as an investment and I realize a return eventually. Whereas others are too near sighted and look at what I'm losing now instead of later.

    Can someone PLEASE give me advise?
     
  2. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Here's my advice:

    1. It is really costly for you to change your mind about the car you are driving. Each time you purchase a vehicle represents another profit opportunity for the dealer and a way for you to be separated from more of your financial resources.
    2. You are thinking about buying a used Prius which is supposed to be priced at $9K to $10K, and the idea is that you will pay $300/month for 60 months. Hence, you will be paying a total of $18K.
    3. Since you want to terminate the Insight lease early, it sounds like you will have to pay $3K to get out of that lease. (It was a mistake to lease the car if there was any significant likelihood that you would not keep the car for the entire lease term.)
    4. $10K for the Prius plus $3K for terminating the Insight lease = $13K.
    5. Doesn't it seem silly to you, that you are asked to pay a total of $18K for a transaction that should only cost $13K? This is a really bad deal for you and a great deal for the dealer.
    6. The Prius may in fact be worth $4.5K after five more years. Whatever the value is, that is irrelevant to my analysis in #2 through #5 above.
    7. If you are determined to early-terminate the Insight lease and buy the Prius, you should arrange your own financing instead of accepting the dealer finance offer which has an extremely high interest rate associated with it.
     
  3. That_Prius_Car

    That_Prius_Car Austin Kinser

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    Actually, there is no lease termination fee that I'm aware of, the payoff on the Insight is just what is owed on it to get the title which is 17,000. So I'm caring over 3k onto the 10k dollar Prius. Plus, I have excellent credit and my interest rate was decent. 2.6% I believe. I gave her my info but told her not to run anything until I was sure.

    But yeah, the rollover is only 3k which is a lot, but I can afford it. Just want to get out from this car and lease and consider it a lesson learned and wanted advise.
     
  4. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Regardless of what you call the Insight payoff, the bottom line is that you need to pay $3K to be rid of the Insight, and $10K for the Prius. That is a total of $13K. If you are being charged a 2.6% interest rate over 60 months, the monthly payment should be much less than $300.
     
  5. That_Prius_Car

    That_Prius_Car Austin Kinser

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    That's what I was thinking also… I sat in the chair looking at the paper she handed me puzzled because I figured it would be cheaper.

    I forgot, we have to add 6% to the sales tax, and she also factored in tags, title, registration, ect.

    So it's working out to what she said for me.
     
  6. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Yes. If the total transaction costs $13K, then the monthly payment should be $231 over 60 months. To the extent that the actual number is greater or less than $13K, just prorate the monthly payment accordingly.
     
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  7. Bingee

    Bingee Member

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    Your not happy with what you have , found a deal that will make you happy , go for
    It , no more night after night thinking about the mistake ... As for the money ,
    Some times money does buy happiness
     
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  8. That_Prius_Car

    That_Prius_Car Austin Kinser

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    Ah, yes yes yes, I see.
    Thank you!

    I can afford it. But would you guys do it?

    It does… I never found anything to complain about with my Gen.II Prius and I loved it. I would just have to keep this one until it was all paid off.
     
  9. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Hmm, the choice is between continuing the lease on an almost new Honda Insight or replacing it with a 6 year old Prius that already has logged 101K miles. From what you have written, the monthly payments will be about the same (although I do not understand how that could be, see my previous comments above.)

    If you really can't stand the Insight, then I suppose you will need to make a change. However, you say that your luck with used cars is not very good which is why you decided to lease the new Insight 5 months ago. Therefore, I hope that you have a four-digit contingency repair budget available in case the Prius starts to develop problems.
     
  10. That_Prius_Car

    That_Prius_Car Austin Kinser

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    To the Prius' defense though, the ones I had issues with had rebuilt titles. The ones I had no issues with had good backgrounds. This one is all clean.
     
  11. dorunron

    dorunron Senior Member

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    Consider this fact.

    2600 miles in five months time equals out to about 6000 or miles per year. I am trying to base this on what little data is provided.

    So with five years time passing, that would make the Prius 12 years old and at least 130K on the odometer.

    You haven't said anything about the traction battery or the transaxle being replaced in that car. Either one of those will be a hefty 3 to 5 K repair figure that could very well be incurred during your time of ownership on said Prius you are considering.

    Does it make sense to buy a used car and finance it for five years with high mileage such as this one? IMO it is a big risk that you are taking.

    If you don't like the insight, go ahead and get shed of it and pay the 3K difference. But don't go out and buy something used with high mileage and finance it for five years. If you have to finance, have good credit and can afford it as you say you will be better off buying a new 2014.

    Then you won't have to worry and you will be free from the Insight. Your payments will be higher, but like you said you can afford it.

    If you have 5 to 8 K in the bank you could spend on repair of that Prius if needed and don't mind spending it down the road, then go ahead and get it. But in the long run you are paying out way too much money in my book for what you will be getting. You would be better off completing the lease and not take a loss, then finding something you like at that point rather than refinancing the 3K plus taking a risk on with a high mileage used car.
     
  12. That_Prius_Car

    That_Prius_Car Austin Kinser

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    Given, lot's of people go to 200-300k miles with no issues other than small things. I know I run a higher risk, and this car has had a great history. I was very fortunate to talk to the previous owner today. I'm just really kicking myself about this Insight. I go downstate sometimes to my grandma's and that no cruise control is just awful.
     
  13. vskid3

    vskid3 Active Member

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    Have you considered selling the Insight yourself (if you can, I don't know how that works with a lease)? Maybe you can get more that way.
    As has been said, with a Prius with that many miles, make sure you have a few thousand set aside for repairs.
    Do all CVT Insights have the same "stumble" issue off the line, or is it just the way you're driving it? Have you asked about it on an Insight forum? Seems like its working well for you mileage wise, if that's your only issue, I would see if there's anything you can do about it, first.
     
  14. dorunron

    dorunron Senior Member

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    I do agree that there a several in the 2K and 3K groups. But be aware that there are also quite a few post's here on PC about transaxles failing and traction batteries needing to be replaced. The bulks of the reports range anywhere from 8 years and 101K miles to 10 years and 150K plus, however there are also reports of failures in less time and miles.

    I understand you are unhappy with the Insight.

    But you do need to understand that anytime you "refinance" such as what you are considering, you will be losing money. Plus in the end you will have a car that will likely need to be traded soon and have to spend more money. Take a few moments to think about the what if's and the future. It's all about risk. You would be better off paying off the 3K out of your pocket then refinancing the amount.

    If you really want to save money, consider completing the lease and saving some money towards a down payment on a new Prius. If you were to do that and put down a large amount of cash, your payments would be considerably lower plus you could get the next gen Prius you dreamed of. That was your thoughts three months ago according to your post here on PC.

     
  15. VicVinegar

    VicVinegar Member

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    As much as you may dislike the Insight, I think you'd be putting yourself in a very undesirable position financing a car like that.
     
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  16. PriusGuy32

    PriusGuy32 Prius Driver Extraordinaire

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    Exactly what I was popping in to say!

    I once bought a 2004 Sebring Limited (4 door, not the drop-top) brand new at the chrysler shop with my dads discount. Traded in an SUV for it. Right away, I hated it. Even though I bought it brand new, off the dealer lot with 14 miles on the odometer, I had constant transmission problems. :mad:

    10 months later, I traded it in for my 2002 Envoy. I got the Envoy for a very good deal, it was 2 years old and I was able to get it wholesale. Therefore, the most unfavorable hit I took on the negative equity on the Sebring was a less jagged pill to swallow.

    I never looked back. Kept the SUV for 8 years, just sold it last year to get the Prius. I paid it off early, in spite of the negative equity rolled over.

    If you can afford it like you say, then what are you waiting for Austin!? :D
     
  17. zhenya

    zhenya Active Member

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    Where does the $17k owed figure come from? Is that the current buyout number from Honda? If so, you might consider buying out the car and selling it yourself - you'd likely come out much better than just taking the dealer's offer.

    The other option is to try and sell the lease via one of the sites that specializes in this.
     
  18. PriusGuy32

    PriusGuy32 Prius Driver Extraordinaire

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    Why not sell the lease? There are websites dedicated to this kind of issue.

    We bought a lease from somebody before, a GM vehicle - we paid $300 fee, everything got switched over to my name and we took over the payments. Turned the lease in at the end of the term, all was well.