Atrial Fibrillation surprise

daniel · Nov 10, 2013

Greens, yum! I love brussels sprouts. Also beets steamed with their own greens. Beets might not fit with your fasting, though. I make a salad by shredding cabbage and carrots with some red or yellow bell pepper and V-8 juice. I also use a tiny bit of salad dressing. The dressing might not fit your protocol, but balsamic vinegar would help. The cabbage would give you some roughage.

mojo · Nov 10, 2013

If you only eat vegetables you can eat as much as you want .
Look into "green smoothies".Vegetables blended with a small amount of fruit tastes sweet like a milkshake.
Using a commercial blender like a Vitamix or Blendtec .

bwilson4web said: ↑

Agreed. I'm using V8, broths, and at least one lemon per day along with plenty of water. Last night after eight days, I had four cups of salad (mixed greens, cucumber, yellow pepper, and tomato) with balsamic and anchovies (no oil.) I wanted to get some fiber in my gut. Near as I can tell, my fasting protocol is running ~100 calories per day but 100% of the potassium, calcium, and sodium.

I'm working on a nutrition spreadsheet to make sure the usual vitamins A and B complexes are covered. My daily lemon handles vitamin C (and my personal treat.) Cereals are great B complex sources and fiber but the calories are out of my range. So I'm taking a look at cabbage, bok choy, collard greens, kale and other greens.

Bob Wilson
Click to expand...

mojo · Nov 10, 2013

I started using seasoned rice vinegar on salads and I dont miss oil at all.

daniel said: ↑

Greens, yum! I love brussels sprouts. Also beets steamed with their own greens. Beets might not fit with your fasting, though. I make a salad by shredding cabbage and carrots with some red or yellow bell pepper and V-8 juice. I also use a tiny bit of salad dressing. The dressing might not fit your protocol, but balsamic vinegar would help. The cabbage would give you some roughage.
Click to expand...

JMD · Nov 10, 2013

Someone mentioned they needed to lose some weight quick thus the Cabbage Soup Diet.

I would talk to the Dr first.

Cabbage Soup Diet Recipe

Wb MD says the diet is lacking in calories and nutrition and most of the weight loss is liquid and not fat so weight gain will resume once you get off the diet. The human pallet is complex and eating the same food for a week will be hard to keep up.
The Cabbage Soup Diet Review

A good balanced diet is much better

ETC(SS) · Nov 10, 2013

Some people use lemon juice on salads.
Good Stuff.

I just listened to an NPR podcast on Pre-Diabetes (Southern Remedy - and it's a free d/l)....and one of the take-aways is that it's never too early to start monitoring for some of the symptoms of type-II diabetes.
Something that I (guess I) already knew but didn't really think about is the fact that a lot of the vascular damage that occurs with t2d actually starts happening long before many people start thinking about getting a blood glucose meter.
This isn't just an obesity or a geezer thing.
If you look at the BMI charts, there is a LARGE area (with me standing in it!) where you are overweight, but not obese.
Like most Americans....I can pinch a little around the middle.
I'm still normal for blood pressure and cholesterol (for now) BUT......

*sigh!*
...guess it's time to dust off the exercise equipment, and start eating better myself.

THANKS A LOT BOB!

I'm looking forward to the reports to come.
Go git 'em Marine!

bwilson4web · Nov 10, 2013

ETC(SS) said: ↑

. . .
*sigh!*
...guess it's time to dust off the exercise equipment, and start eating better myself.

THANKS A LOT BOB!

I'm looking forward to the reports to come.
Go git 'em Marine!
Click to expand...

Get a dog or two . . . they'll love your power walks. <grins>

So I'm still assembling my food-sheet but this was my second, experimental dish:

Column 1

0 [tr][th]food[th]cal[th]Vit A[th]Vit C[th]fiber[th]Vit D

1 [tr][td]yellow pepper[td2]50[td2]7%[td2]569%[td2]7%[td2]0%

2 [tr][td]spinach boiled[td2]41[td2]354%[td2]29%[td2]17%[td2]0%

3 [tr][td]salmon can[td2]60[td2]0%[td2]0%[td2]0%[td2]66%

Source: Google search "<food> calories"

Put the spinach in the microwave to cook or heat if canned. Cook it down for density and stuffing.

Cut the pepper into three sections so it has natural pockets.

Put a layer of salmon in each section.

Fill with spinach to make a mound.

Eat as is or zap in the microwave to warm or even cook to taste. Garnish (i.e., season) with whatever strikes your fancy. Remember a garnish is a seasoning, not another layer.

My first dish:

Column 1

0 [tr][th]food[th]cal[th]Vit A[th]Vit C[th]fiber[th]Vit D

1 [tr][td]black beans[td2]227[td2]0%[td2]0%[td2]60%[td2]0%

2 [tr][td]salmon can[td2]60[td2]0%[td2]0%[td2]0%[td2]66%

Source: Google search "<food> calories"

Mix beans and salmon on a plate.

Heat in microwave.

Season to taste.

What I'm doing is combining complimentary foods to mix fiber and vitamins into a balanced mix. Seasonings come next and will range from hot peppers to other small volume but intense flavorings.

As a treat, a pan of beef broth, 10 cal/cup, and a diced onion boiled and then simmered until translucent. Without salt, it is a semi-sweet soup, a desert. Again, future spices to give variations . . . perhaps a clove.

My interest in Vit D is I want to avoid dairy . . . way too many calories of the wrong type. FYI, salmon also has 46% Vit B-12 which avoid cereals and their high calorie counts.

Bob Wilson

daniel · Nov 11, 2013

mojo said: ↑

I started using seasoned rice vinegar on salads and I dont miss oil at all.
Click to expand...

On regular tossed salads (lettuce based) I don't like any oil. Seasoned vinegar or lemon juice are plenty good. If those are not available, I eat those kinds of salads with no dressing at all. But on my shredded cabbage and carrot salads, which are a staple with me, I do use about a tablespoon of dressing along with about a cup or a cup and a half of V-8 juice in about ten cups of salad. (I have an 11-cup food processor, and it's nearly full when I'm done making a salad.)

Note: Some oil is essential to a balanced diet, but I believe you get enough of that if you eat whole grains and legumes.

The Electric Me · Nov 11, 2013

Bob, I wish you the best of outcomes with your health.

Your advice concerning how to handle the ER is spot on.

Unfortunately, my Mother, (now passed away) had many years of failing health that led to her spending a lot of time in hospital ER's. I was usually the one accompanying her.

ER's will rightly and correctly prioritize need and attention. So basically if you go to an ER with a problem that is not deemed immediately life threatening, or not causing immediate pain, you most often have found yourself in a "hurry up and wait" situation.

I think a lot of people, that don't spend a lot of time in ER's think that "Emergency" Room...means you will get quick and immediate attention, but that isn't really the case, depending on what ailment you as a patient are demonstrating, and what the situation in The Emergency room as a whole happens to be in.

The truth is most often...if you are not wheeled into an ER...you have walked into a situation where patience and a lot of time will be spent.

As far as your own personal medical challenges? From observing my mothers challenges and other family members, I think knowledge is power. Knowing as much about your condition and potential therapies is valuable. Doing research on your own is not only possible, relatively easy, but vital.

I also treat doctors and medical staff with respect, but I don't treat doctors as "gods". My grandmother and Aunt came from a generation where simply being a "Doctor" was considered a station almost beyond reproach or question. I saw that sometimes their medical attention was lacking simply because they were passive and simply accepted whatever a doctor said or suggested.

My mother on the other hand actually enjoyed "medicine", I think she would of made a good nurse or doctor. Even before the popularity of the internet, my mother would read the Merck Manual...I thought in many situations she had more knowledge sometimes than the doctors and nurses surrounding her. If she did not like what she was hearing from a Doctor or Nurse, or the therapy being applied, she would advocate for herself, with enough knowledge to support her case. Not being passive, led to her typically getting better medical care.

So anyway, knowledge is power...and in the ER...patience is often needed.

JMD · Nov 12, 2013

Hey Bob hopefully you have a good accurate scale at home recording all that weight loss

Keep up the good job on the diet. I have a feeling you will do great

shcolton85 · Nov 15, 2013

Very interesting thread. Will be following how this develop for sure.

bwilson4web · Nov 16, 2013

Well I'm doing more applied research and investigation. A key motivator is I want to keep my plane and return to flying.

For an FAA medical, the AOPA reports atrial fibrillation requires 3-month waiting and extensive testing including wearing a Holter EKG monitor for 24-hours as well as stress test and other diagnostics. Fortunately, my recent incident showed no underlying heart problem. This might have been idiomatic but I need facts and data. I've made an offer on a 3-channel Holter, recording EKG meter to find out if it is coming back as I had no symptom before the ER visit. I'm already recording other key metrics:

I know this is a busy chart but I need the dense information.

Exercise, the dogs love our longer, faster walks. For now, a daily, 30 minute walk. For example, this is a GPS recorded, 1.5 mile path along a nature trail:

The altitude variations are not to mile scale but gives an idea of the terrain track.

Weight is coming off nicely using my own, semi-fasting diet using small portions of balanced foods. So I have a spreadsheet listing calories and nutrients, especially minerals, in my favorite foods. My 'complementary' foods cover vitamins for metabolism and minerals for electrolytes as I am keeping well hydrated (love club soda.) I am typically eating 150-300 calories during the 'low' days and then have 'big' day up to 450-550 calories, typically oriented around a big, salad. For example:

Column 1 Column 2

0 [tr][th] [th]yellow pepper raw[th]salmon 2 oz[th]black beans[th]Bob's stuffed pepper

1 [tr][td]cup[td2]0.5[td2]0.25[td2]1[td2]1.75

2 [tr][td]cal[td2]50[td2]60[td2]227[td2]337

3 [tr][td]Vit C[td2]569%[td2]0%[td2]0%[td2]569%

4 [tr][td]fiber[td2]7%[td2]0%[td2]60%[td2]67%

5 [tr][td]Vit D[td2]0%[td2]66%[td2]0%[td2]66%

6 [tr][td]protein[td2]4%[td2]23%[td2]30%[td2]57%

7 [tr][td]Vit B12[td2]0%[td2]46%[td2]0%[td2]46%

8 [tr][td]Mg[td2]6%[td2]4%[td2]30%[td2]40%

9 [tr][td]K[td2]11%[td2]4%[td2]17%[td2]32%

10 [tr][td]Fe[td2]5%[td2]2%[td2]20%[td2]27%

11 [tr][td]Vit B6[td2]16%[td2]2%[td2]6%[td2]24%

12 [tr][td]Ca[td2]2%[td2]4%[td2]5%[td2]11%

13 [tr][td]Na[td2]0%[td2]9%[td2]0%[td2]9%

14 [tr][td]cholest[td2]0%[td2]7%[td2]0%[td2]7%

15 [tr][td]Vit A[td2]7%[td2]0%[td2]0%[td2]7%

16 [tr][td]fat[td2]1%[td2]2%[td2]1%[td2]4%

17 [tr][td]sugar[td2]0%[td2]0%[td2]0%[td2]0%

Interesting, one primary problem is a bad mental habit of 'thinking about food.' It takes a little mental discipline to focus on other subjects but this is becoming easier over time. BTW, when I was in junior high school, I had practiced fasting for 3-5 days and those uniformed practices are coming back. For example, dressing warmly to compensate for the lower metabolism.

Attitude has a lot to do with it. My wife is in poor health and as her primary caregiver, well I wasn't paying attention to myself. I had a physical in September and only weight and pre-diabetes was found, a fairly easy problem to fix (cut out the taste pasta lunches.) The surprise was the symptom-free, atrial fibrillation as I have no interest in becoming a 'drama queen', another boring hypochondriac.

I've had a 'wake up' call so I am treating my own health with the same practices I've applied to understand our Prius. Life, you grow older so deal with it. If I have to give up the plane and flying, so be it. But it will be based upon facts and data.

Bob Wilson

daniel · Nov 16, 2013

One issue to be aware of is that the faster you lose weight, the harder it is to keep it off. This is physiological, as the body tries to maintain a steady state, and the more rapidly it moves away from its accustomed weight the harder it tries to restore it. It sounds like you are very motivated, and that means you are likely to succeed. But be aware that it will take determination to maintain the weight loss as the urge to return to old habits becomes stronger.

As for thinking about food, Weight Watchers (of which I'm a member) says that we typically think about food some astronomical number of times per day. I forget the number, but it was huge.

Good luck. Losing weight was one of the hardest things I've ever done. But with your determination I know you can do it.

bwilson4web · Nov 16, 2013

daniel said: ↑

One issue to be aware of is that the faster you lose weight, the harder it is to keep it off. This is physiological, as the body tries to maintain a steady state, and the more rapidly it moves away from its accustomed weight the harder it tries to restore it. . . .
Click to expand...

This semi-fasting is designed to get my weight to a sustainable level and find out if I pass the FAA flight physical. Curiously, I don't 'feel hungry' as much as breaking a bad habit of thinking about foods. If I can pass the FAA flight physical, I will have to transition to sustainable habits to keep flying and the plane. Otherwise I'll have to make a new plan:

Light Sport Aviation - effectively a performance limited plane, it only requires a driver's license.

Ultralight - a kite, even more limited, at least I'll be back in the air even if not a practical cross-country craft.

Sell the plane.

Bob Wilson

daniel · Nov 16, 2013

I can tell you from personal experience and from observing others that maintaining weight loss is in some ways more difficult than losing weight. I know you can do it, because you are determined. But you'll be better able to do it if you are aware that the problem exists.

When you are losing weight you have a goal and there's light at the end of the tunnel. Once you've reached your goal, you enter a new tunnel with no light at the end because it requires a lifetime commitment to a lifestyle change. Be prepared with a plan for lifetime sustainable eating: A plan for a balanced diet that allows you to eat all the things you enjoy, but in moderation, so you don't gradually replace all that hard-lost weight.

They keys are having a plan, and regarding it not as a diet, but as a lifestyle.

Chuck. · Nov 16, 2013

Is psychological addicting really another way of saying habit?

I say yes.

A recent book Power of Habit - Charles Duhigg mentions the cycle of habits...they can be changed. For instance, ice water for Diet Coke - you just have to get satisfaction out of the new habit.

JMD · Nov 16, 2013

I recall reading that an adult man needs 1,500 calories per day just to maintain health. Anything less may impact health by lowering the immune system which can invite colds, flu etc that may impact the heart and health. If you consume 1,500 calories and have moderate exercise in many cases just a good brisk walk every morning you should lose weight.

For many a proper diet, just cutting out Coke a Cola and Junk Foods like Potato chips and substitute with Water and Fruit snacks will cut your weight.

I'm no DR and certainly if you have any medical conditions one should proceed with caution you want to be your best friend and not your worst enemy. In many cases just calling the Dr's office and speaking with the Nurse on call with your questions may be all that is required to make good choices.

RobH · Nov 21, 2013

Bob-

I think you would find this site interesting: TrueNorth Health Center

It is a medical center that uses water fasting as a medical treatment. One of the documented results is a significant reduction in systolic blood pressure. Their primary product is in-patient fasting, but they also have a variety of DVDs, books, etc. describing fasting.

bwilson4web · Nov 21, 2013

Thanks,

RobH said: ↑

I think you would find this site interesting: TrueNorth Health Center
Click to expand...

It is interesting. I've been reading some NIH papers but their approach is a little different with one 'show stopper'

. . .
Fasting is defined as the complete abstinence from all substances except pure water, in an environment of complete rest. Rest must be encouraged since even moderate activity can significantly increase the metabolism, altering optimum adaptation to the fasting state. To maximize the benefits of fasting, unnecessary mobilization of nutrient reserves must be avoided.
. . .
Click to expand...

So I could do the weekends but during the week, I need to work.

My semi-fasting starts with the foods I like entered in a spreadsheet with not just calories but also the vitamins and minerals. I then combine them to achieve the daily minimums of vitamins for metabolism and minerals for electrolytes. Then plenty of club soda, just like water but more filling. So I'm running between 400-500 calories per day with a breakfast and others as needed. I do take days off of about 50 calories.

Now one side-effect of lower blood sugar means getting chilled easier. Worse, when I fall to the lowest ranges, I feel really crappy. Fortunately it doesn't take much, less than 100 calories, to get back into 'normal'. I prefer those calories not being a sugar because that tends to 'bounce.'

FYI, I just ordered a 3 channel, Holter, recording EKG unit from China. I've finished my first reading of two books on Holter meter operation and analysis and feel comfortable that I'll be able to analyze multiple, 24-hour, EKG runs. Fortunately atrial fibrillation is easily spotted. I'm doing this for my curiosity as the 'gold standard' will be the cardiologist calls. If you haven't noticed, I'm not one who remains willfully ignorant.

Bob Wilson

bwilson4web · Dec 6, 2013

Medical insurance claims and payments shows up 30 days later and often looks like unlicensed medical malpractice:

Column 1

0 [tr][td]CITY OF HUNTSVILLE HOSP B[td2]$21292.07[td2]$1085.14[td2]%51

1 [tr][td]EMERGENCY PHYS GROUP[td2]$745.00[td2]$45.20[td2]%2

2 [tr][td]HEART CENTER INC[td2]$320.00[td2]$13.90[td2]%1

3 [tr][td]HEART CENTER INC[td2]$1025.00[td2]$26.66[td2]%1

4 [tr][td]HEART CENTER INC[td2]$229.00[td2]$30.00[td2]%1

5 [tr][td]HEART CENTER INC[td2]$360.00[td2]$45.60[td2]%2

6 [tr][td]HEART CENTER INC[td2]$600.00[td2]$47.60[td2]%2

7 [tr][td]HEART CENTER INC[td2]$337.50[td2]$337.50[td2]%16

8 [tr][td]HUNTSVILLE HOSPITAL ANEST[td2]$750.00[td2]$150.00[td2]%7

9 [tr][td]NORTH ALABAMA HOSPITALIST[td2]$146.00[td2]$79.00[td2]%4

10 [tr][td]NORTH ALABAMA HOSPITALIST[td2]$270.00[td2]$139.00[td2]%6

11 [tr][td]PHYSICIANS PROFESSIONAL F[td2]$36.00[td2]$3.20[td2]%0

12 [tr][td]PHYSICIANS PROFESSIONAL F[td2]$36.00[td2]$3.20[td2]%0

13 [tr][td]RADIOLOGY OF HUNTSVILLE P[td2]$16.00[td2]$14.00[td2]%1

14 [tr][td]Rx[td2]$5.50[td2]$5.00[td2]%0

15 [tr][td]Rx[td2]$17.27[td2]$17.27[td2]%1

16 [tr][td]Rx[td2]$21.44[td2]$21.44[td2]%1

17 [tr][td]Rx[td2]$256.26[td2]$76.88[td2]%4

18 [tr][td]total/my cost/percent[td2]$26463.04[td2]$2140.59[td2]%100

Source: insurance website

Initially denied HUNTSVILLE HOSPITAL as "Out-of-network" - pointed out it is listed as "In-network" on their web site.

Initially denied PHYSCIANS PROFESSIONAL as "Out-of-network" - went to hospital and got a sheet showing they are attending physician company hired by the HUNTSIVLLE HOSPITAL.

Stealthy denial of HEART CENTER INC anesthesia - in progress but already sent a message to have it reviewed.

To convert my heart beat from AFIB to normal heart beat, they use a procedure called "T&E". First they first check for any blood flow or structural problems using ultrasound and an isotope-based, chemical stress test. The last test puts a scope can go down your esophagus to look at the heart from the side and check for blood clots. If everything is OK so it won't risk the heart or kicking out a blood cloth, they use a defibrillator to 'shock' your heart back into normal rhythm. These last steps are NOT something anyone should be awake.

The problem is anyone who is awake will have an involuntary gag reflex against the esophagus probe. The patient will be choking and likely to go into dry heaves as well as panic induced, elevated heart rate. Worse, shocking the heart on someone who is awake and gagging would be called torture in the subsequent malpractice trial . . . and civil trial.

I sent a note and will follow-up with a phone call that anesthesia is an important part of this procedure. Without anesthesia, the patient would be gagging and anxious. I suggested it be reviewed by medically trained staff. If someone still insists on claim denial, lets have them undergo a T&E without anesthesia.

If I am unable to persuade them to do the right thing, this insurance company is located in California. Every State has an office that oversees the performance of insurance companies. In my state that means they just cut-and-paste the insurance company 'claim'. Perhaps California has a different practice. My aunt is a retired lawyer and I will ask if she can recommend someone to represent my counter-claim. <GRINS>

Bob Wilson

JMD · Dec 6, 2013

Maybe sign up for the HMO plan during open enrollment. My wife has cancer caught early 7 years ago. Aetna HMO covered everything. Surgery, radiation etc. It was in network also.

Sometimes HMO can have a deductible depending on the plan

Atrial Fibrillation surprise

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