Michelin Defenders poor MPG

Try the Energy Saver A/S that is offered by Michelin. I am running the P185/65R15 86T series and am getting excellent results. I did not notice any drop and am actually seeing the MPG improving. Was running the stock Integrity's

I am also running the air pressure at 40F, 38R. Max pressure on the sidewall is 44.

I was running 42F, 40R on the Integrity's.

 

wait for them to break in a little, but don't wait more than 29 days! ditto on the energy savers.

 

...what a coincidence I was just discussing this tire with F8L off-line on PM.
Defender is an extremely long tread life tire, much like the GY ComforTreds I still have on my car. This type of tire saves you money because you basically skip a tire change. Whereas the A/S you make money by the great MPG but they don't last that long and are pretty expensive. Take your pick. I am tempted to try the A/S soon because I have MPG envy and our miles per year is falling below 15000 (used to be 20000) so maybe I can get 3 year out of them.

 

My perception was the Defenders were about the same rolling resistance as the X (assume you mean Michelin X), and that both were "ok", but not really into LRR territory.

For a decent LRR tire you might try Bridgestone Ecopia EP422, assuming you're looking for 185/65R15. They're $88.99 per right now at Costco (US), and there's a $70 off on four coupon. Costco will take that off at the till.

(I don't work at Costco, just looks like a good deal)

 

I bought my Defenders in April. I also experienced decreased MPG at first. Was getting 45 and went to 40. I would say after 1000 miles the MPG started to increase. Now I have nearly 8,000 miles on them and I am back to an average of 45. Keep in mind I drive normally. I don't hypermile or drive terribly slow. For me I liked that they have a long tread life and warranty. Just give them time and they will break in, otherwise, exchange them for the energy savers.


iPad ? HD

 

FWIW, before I switched I did a lot of study, asking questions and what have you. I narrowed it down to two choices. The one's I bought (Energy Saver A/S) and the Bridgestone Ecopia 422. My thing is I wanted the best MPG as number one priority. Yes, the Michelin's do cost more, but I chose them over the Bridgestone's because of the tread pattern. Maybe I did not spend wisely, but I feel I got a good set of tires for the application I am using them for. (Prius and best MPG possible)

I would have bought the Defender however Michelin rates the rolling resistance a 8 versus a 10 for the Energy Saver A/S. Even though the Defender has the longer tread wear rating, I was wanting to get the best MPG possible. Plus it seems that every 90K rated tire I have ever bought ended up dry rotting before I wore them out. I don't drive a boat load of miles like some do.

 

If you go on day 29 and they don't have the Energy Savers in stock on that day, then what? I would go today and have them special order the energy savers if they are not in stock.

 

I had a similar experience with the Michelin MXV4's a couple of years ago. The Energy Saver A/S was not available at the time. The Michelin website listed the MXV4 at their highest fuel efficiency rating. It turns out that they are LRR only in certain tire sizes but not in mine. I was told by Customer Service that they were "close to LRR".

I took an immediate 5-6 mpg hit but knew that I needed break-in time. It took me 20k miles before the mpg began to increase again. At 35k miles I am still at 2-3 mpg below the OEM Yokohamas.

Even though the Defenders have the great mileage warranty, I will definitely go with the ES A/S next time. I would rather have the higher mpg even though the math says that the Defenders probably have the lower life cycle cost.

I would want to change to the ES A/S before the 30 day period is up. I really miss the higher mpg.

 

I think you have to wait a little while to find out how the Defenders perform in terms of fuel mileage since new tires are intrinsically less efficient than worn ones:

The NHTSA Tire Fuel Efficiency Consumer Information Program Development: Phase 2 – Effects of Tire Rolling Resistance Levels on Traction, Treadwear, and Vehicle Fuel Economy states the following on page 5:

"In any discussion of rolling resistance, it is important to consider that the rolling resistance level of a tire evolves during use. It is reported in literature that a tire’s rolling resistance level, and therefore its effects on vehicle fuel economy, can decrease by more than 20 percent from a new tread to completely worn.[11],[12] Therefore, calculations of the benefits of lower tire rolling resistance derived from measurements of new tires will likely understate the benefits to a vehicle in terms of absolute fuel economy over the lifetime of the set of tires."

The specific reasons are:
-- worn tires over-clock actual miles driven due to their lesser diameter.
-- the tread of worn tires flexes more easily than the thicker tread of new tires (contrary to common opinion, tread flexing is a major contributor to energy loss, thus the increased fuel consumption with wider tires).
-- as tires age, the rubber becomes harder and its hysteresis (measure of energy loss when flexing) actually decreases.

Driving characteristics also influence the advantage of LRR tires. If you do a lot of highway driving, air resistance will tend to dominate, and the advantage will be less. If you're a suburban driver LRR will really help. But if your driving is substantially urban, where you spend a fair amount of time standing still, LRR tires will have a lesser effect.

This is not to say that other tires are not more efficient than the Defender; I'm just saying comparisons can be really complicated.

 

^ In a previous experience, going from (OEM) Bridgestone Insignia SE200_02, which were a special limitted edition LRR version, to Bridgestone Ecopia EP20 (touted as LRR), our mileage didn't skip a beat, ie: there was NO drop in mileage with the install of the new tires.

While there's likely some validity to the "wait a while, let them break-in, the mpg will return" statements, I think it's overblown. Much of the "return" of better mpg is due to driver's trying all the harder, imho.

 

that's pretty sweet!

 

I have bought my tires from Sam's for years now and always had good service. Never any hassle with what few road hazard warranties I have ever needed.

So I am not surprised with them ordering on day 30.

 

When I got our set, I ended up checking more than one source. I can't say that any Michelin dealer will honor the exchange program, but it would be worthwhile to look into it. The Michelin Dealer (Beasley Tire) in Houston could not get the Energy Saver but a local retailer who sold multiple brands had them in stock. (American Wheel and Tire).

My point is to try to locate a alternative source of supply of the tires and then go from there. You might be able to get them to have the tires shipped to Sam's so they can exchange them. The wording on Michelin's website says if you bring the tires back within 30 days with the receipt to the original seller, they will mount a new set of tires.

Quote from Michelin Web Site:
30-Day Satisfaction Guarantee1

Available on all MICHELIN passenger and light truck replacement tires. If you're not 100% satisfied, bring the tires and original sales receipt back to the place of purchase within 30 days for a new set of tires.

Tire Warranty | Michelin Tires

 

amazing how difficult these tyres are to come by.