If you were thinking of purchasing a C-Max over a Prius v, read this

Again, what does this have to do with the Ford Motor Company of today?

Bill Ford (II?) that is an executive there now is a vegetarian and pushed for green cars. Should we string him up because his grandfather was a dick?

They may have had to fight for it, but Jewish victims of the Nazis are getting reimbursed by the German government and businesses.
Claims Conference - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Germany to Pay 772 Million Euros in Reparations to Holocaust Survivors - SPIEGEL ONLINE
Didn't see anything for their other victims(gays, gypsies, mentally and physically infirm) though.

Japan had their own death and slave camps during WWII. Their companies profited from them. There is no compensation for the victims because the US gave them immunity from it in the treaty. Toyota built trucks for the Japanese army during the war, and at least had indirect benefit of the work camps for materials. But it's ok to drive a Prius because no Jews were harmed in the company's history.

 

A similar case occurred with consumer reports which showed Ford's reliability figures drastically lower because of problems with the electronics, mainly issues with the firmware and apparently relatively poor user interfaces. That struck me as a little unfair because of the issues I mentioned before. A blown transmission is one thing (something Ford IS notorious for), flaky firmware on the trip computer is another - annoying, even maddening, but far less impact with regard to ultimate reliability..

 

Huh? You may want to do a little more research. Many C-Max owners, including myself, are routinely getting EPA mileage and better. Also, the Hyundai mileage debacle is a completely different issue.

I understand this is a Prius forum but can't you at least be somewhat happy that the numbers of hybrids on the roads is increasing. Why so much negativity over a silly mechanical device that carries people from point A to point B?

 

because it sometimes doesn't make it to point b?

 

Yes, I take no enjoyment out of this reality.
Even though I own a Prius and have long followed Prius and Hybrids, I'm not going to take any happiness from JD Power ranking The C-Max as horrible.

You'll notice the headline say's "JD Power ranks hybrid as worst car for quality". For many people reading that headline it will simply confirm what they may believe anyway....that hybrids are not good. They'll lump Prius, Fusion, all of them together.

Even as a Prius owner, I'd much rather hear about the success of competing hybrids, because I think the tide raises or lowers us all together.

Oddly just the other day a Ford C-Max parked right next to me in the parking lot. As I approached my vehicle and The C-Max, I thought the C-Max looked very nice.

I hope they work out any problems they have and it becomes a good product.

 

After a fix, Ford's telematics system still gets poor marks on the user interface. Since the C-max has it, some of the problems in the JD Powers survey are likely because of it. The design is an issue, but there's a difference between wanting something to work better and it breaking.

Cute I think if that was the actual case with the C-max, it would have been reported here before this news, though.

My suspicion is that Ford dropped the ball on quality control with the early ones off the lines. If so, the number will be better next time. The Fusion, and thus MKZ, release was delayed do to a recall of head light lenses. Perhaps, unannounced, making sure the QC was working there was also a reason.

 

I've heard it said that, indeed, powertrain and chassis have gotten good enough that it's the brake noises, voice recognition gaffes and buzz and rattle things that make the difference these days.

Mercedes-Benz learned this all too well several years ago with their Comand navigation and telematics software. Pulled them to the bottom of the initial quality surveys for a long time.

 

Well..... The difference is that you have to hypermile like crazy to get to the EPA estimates. Hypermiling with the Prius (c, LB, v) will yields between 10-20 mpg (25-40% more in the case of the Prius v) over EPA estimates. Per Fuelly, the average C-Max owner is getting about 15-20% LESS mpg per TANK than EPA.

Because this is the internet silly!! That's what people do. Actually, on your C-Max forums, we see the same negative sentiments regarding the Prius. I agree that we should all "just get along" but in today's society the sentiment is "mine is always better than yours".

I considered the C-Max to replace one of our others cars but Ford's gaming the EPA test steered me away from the C-Max. Interestingly, I bought the Prius v in 2011 with the assumption that I would be getting about 40 mpg. The vee wagon has more than exceeded my expectations!

Do you have a Fuelly profile? Can you post a link? Is your handle "Recumpence" (aka Matt) on the C-Max forum?

 

not only better, but bigger too!

 

Yep. There are no details. For all I know, almost everyone could've complained about "poor" fuel economy and it being impossible or near impossible to get EPA ratings. If everyone complained, that's already 100 complaints out of 100 vehicles.

If people had MyFord Touch issues and assuming 50% of the total population of C-Max Hybrid have MFT and had trouble with it, well, that + the other 100 is already 150. Then add to another other "problems" be it actual defects, perceived quality problems or something they consider "difficult" to operate, can push it up even higher.

I posted about some of this at JD Powers: General Motors is the car company with the best quality | PriusChat and stuff that can be perceived as "quality" problems.

 

Couple things about Ford:

* In Fusion / Hybrid, they are still using a keypad on door pillars as an entry method? Seriously? Bit antiquated dontya think?

* Have a look at the Ford website organization, particularly the specifications tables. Looks as if it was put together by high-schoolers or SLT. i.e. they list specs, but you don't even know what model, S, SE, SEL they belong to.

* I'm not a fan at all of Prus v interior. The steeply raked pillars, weird console, center gages do not work for me at all. Same goes for the Prius line interior. It may be 'To go before' , but no one else is copying the interior. Hardly trend setting.

* The Bluetooth voice recognition in my 2011 Prius is horrible. Most of the time have to try 2,3,4 times to get it to recognize. My car was produced well over 2 years after first production of 3rd gen Prius.

 

Exactly what I need in Virginia is a hybrid that that has a good depreciation rate (less annual taxes)!

 

Where do you keep an expensive to replace key fob when swimming at the beach? It's far from bleeding edge, but it works. I don't have to run back into the house if I suddenly need something from the wife's Sable.

 

I agree. We had Ford products for 18 years with the keypad in the door and it was excellent and convenient. I'd be happy to have that feature in a future car.

 

If it ain't broke....
Smart key type systems actually aren't really revolutionary. They are just a natural evolution of the remote entry fob that has been around for decades. I think Ford has a patent on the entry keypad, which has kept others from using it.

 

I wonder if they do. I recall some non-Fords back in the mid-80s had them too. One that stood out to me specifically was the 1986 Nissan Maxima. The family of a friend of mine had a pretty loaded one w/that. Back then, cars w/speech synthesized warnings were the hotness (e.g. "Your door is ajar", "Right door is open").

It seems like Ford is the only one left using the keypads now.

 

my 92 year old father loves it on his '92 continental.

 

Ok, I've only ever noticed it on Fords, and they are the only ones that still appear to be doing it. Seems antiquadated now, but it does has advantages over the not having to go into your pocket for a key fad.

 

It's also nice for sending kids back to the car to fetch such and such, not mention a backup if you accidentally locked the keys in the car.

 

In defense of SKS, you actually can't lock the keys in the car. You'll just be left wondering why the doors keep unlocking until you figure it out.