Neat and Obscure facts about the PiP

The PiP test mule fleet have/had (I still see one in a great while) greater EV range than the production PiP's.

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source?

 

What do you want ... a toyota pdf spec sheet?

the larger test mule packs/fact was simply what toyota told us, when they let some of us (organizations and a few select individuals) test them. So you're S.O.L. if you need something more. One of the local groups driving them around here in our area posted the higher range on their web site:

CCSE’s Toyota PHV Demonstration Program

As I recall, the larger pack protruded up into the bottom 3" of the rear cargo compartment somewhat (I took some pics of the larger pack, that I can't find at the moment), but in part, the pack was larger/heavier due to the larger use of the nickel battery chemistry. Here's a shot of the one I was driving ... charging in our garage, off of our roof top PV solar array:



It'd take a little less than 2 hours to charge for depleted to full. Their larger pack was still under 5kwh (according to the Toyota peeps that talked to me) - but since the mule's traction pack was heavier, the range wasn't too much more. The best I did in EV mode before the ICE came on was just right at 19 miles - mixed city and freeway (not exceeding 55mph).
Also helping EV range on cold mornings, the ICE wouldn't have to turn on ... because they had a heat pump, in stead of having to rely on heat via forcing the ICE to come on to generate heat. The forward charge port was much easier to access public charging too (VERY limited back then) ... especially in parking garages that require "head in only" parking (local ordinances).

 

That's incorrect. The PiP test fleet model had bigger battery (5.2kWh vs 4.4kWh) than the production version but it was over 200 lbs heavier. It uses narrower SOC swing as well.

Per Toyota's official press release, the production PiP has about 15% more EV range.

Significantly, the biggest change in packaging from the Prius Plug-in Hybrid test-fleet model is the smaller, more efficient battery pack in the production model. The new battery pack is approximately one-half the weight of the demonstration-phase vehicle, yet provides about 15-percent more range.​

 

The mule's pack size - whether 4.9kWh or 5.3kWh is a nit I won't pick. I'd heard both quoted, but reason I didn't quote from that marketing bit/link is because it doesn't state 5.3kWh. Either way, the mules had larger packs and hopefully the 'nit' doesn't obfuscate the (already a small) point.
As for Toyota's claim that the production traction packs have greater range (despite having less kilowatt energy) ... I duno ... it sure seems like I remember those of us here on PC who had 'em for test drives were getting greater EV range than production PIP's are getting. I tried searching for some of our old write ups on PC (including mine) but after the software transition /migration - it doesn't seem like I can find any of them . . . frustrating bummer . . .
maybe our EV Mule range was higher than Toyota's production claims because Toyota lent the mules out to those of us on PC with years of successful hyper-mile'ing posts

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There is no need to nitpick. The actual specification said 5.2 kWh.

Dan measured the SOC swing of the fleet model with Scangauge II. It swings from 80% full to 26% empty (switch to HV). 54% usable. The production version has 85% full to 23% empty. 62% usable.

Fleet Model -- 5.2 kWh x 0.54 = 2.81 kWh usable

Production Model -- 4.4 kWh x 0.62 = 2.73 kWh usable

The 208 lbs difference would surely give the production version more EV range.

 

Wow, 2.8 useable sure seems to fly in the face of the range we were getting. That'd mean we were getting in the neighborhood of 6+ miles per kwh ... which is hard to reconcile in light that I've never done better than 5 mile/kWh. And from that old post, Dan claimed to use 3.8kWh to charge ... which would mean there was around 25% charging loss (using 120v ... which is supposed to have no more than 10%-12% loss over 240v).
Very good archive find !! Sorry for making you work however hard you had to, to find that .
Keep me on my toes

 

No worry, it only took a few mins.

 

I would swap out my pack for a larger one and lose that small amount of cargo space.

 

+1
Of course with that higher energy source/bigger pack comes a bigger price tag

 

I don't think that the weight really makes a difference. It's also possible that smaller "useable capacity" gives greater EV range.

The single battery capacity value is a simplification. Actual battery capacity depends on the discharge rate, with greater capacity at slower discharge rates and lower capacity at high discharge rates.

The pre-production Prius Plug-in used a regular Liftback NiMH battery with 3 LiON batteries. The 3 LiON batteries were discharged in series (deplete the first one, then the second one, then the third one) and I suspect they were used in parallel with the NiMH battery. This would reduce the discharge rate of the LiON battery which might explain higher actual usable capacity and EV range.

The production Prius Plug-in uses a single LiON battery, so the discharge rate would be higher.

 

Okay something new for all of you guys who live or work on a hill and have to drive down in neutral after charging to avoid turning on the ICE. Have recently discovered that the computer will not turn on the ICE if the AC is on and fan on max as you drive down a hill. The battery will actually continue to take additional charge (above 85% soc as per the readout on SG2)!!!! I have actually watched my battery go up to 87% soc! This is great for me in the summer.. not so sure about the winter.. but hey...


Try it out and see if it works for you. The hill I drive down from work is only about 1/2 a mile at a fairly decent grade which enters a neighborhood where I have to slow to 25mph… this would always kick on the ICE if I didn't put the vehicle in neutral.

 

Hahah lol wow

 

That is a shocker. I have a 2 mile (750 ft) hill, and I will certainly try that next time out.
Aside: First fillup; 723 miles; 8.6 gals so 2 gals left despite the blinking light. But I can say that the MPG reported by the trip odometer for the tank was quite close to the simple division of miles/gallon. Actual was 83 mpg and I think TripA reported 84. In any case it was quite close. I seem to recall that not being the case in my 2005 Prius.

 

OK. I tried it tonight. AC full, fan full. It did seem to have an effect although at a stop light at bottom of hill the ICE came on even though the display showed no arrows from the ICE. I guess that is because when the car is not moving that display does nothing. I am not sure if it is totally definitive, but it seemed to avoid the ICE coming on when driving. A bizarre solution....

 

Just to finally settle this a year later - it's still on the right hand window in my RHD car, so definitely not a defogger.

 

And how I wish that it was a defogger. So annoying to have that window fog up when you're changing lanes.

 

Well it's because the error is in gas measurement, not miles traveled measurement. As you drive more and more electric miles per tank, the error in gas measurement plays a smaller and smaller role.

 

Stanwagon, do you have a scangauge2? I'm curious what the top state-of-charge was before the car decided to turn on the ICE to absorb some of it.