EV experiences

Wishing I had a shorter commute. My old commute of 4.7 miles (when I had a Gen II) penalized me for that by rarely getting over 42mpg. My new commute of 30.1 miles (with the PHEV) penalizes me by rarely getting better than 70mpg. When I say penalize, I mean it in the sense that Gen II might have been better optimized for a commute of 30 miles, and the 4.7 mile commute would've been perfect for the PHEV.

The stars just never align themselves when they need to.

All of that said, however, I doubt the Gen II would regularly get 66.6mpg on the same 30 mile commute. And it never came close to that in a shorter (all EV for the PHEV) commute.

What the PHEV gets you over a regular Prius is extended EV range. My experience after almost a year is that it's definitely worth the few added months of payments to have that capability.

 

I think that saving $3500 over 10 years, plus the $2500 federal rebate...thus $6000 savings, should be enough for a long term thinker to save. Plus you get the benefit of a bit of protection on higher gas prices. You even get a bit of protection (for some drivers) of choosing when to get gas more, since you can opt out of filling up for a few days (or weeks, in my case) as gas prices go up and down.

Mike

 

Can you provide more details on E-9A...prices, how easy it is to adjust to this schedule, etc.

Mike

 

with Time-of-Use (eg., E-9A) there are 3 levels, off-peak, part-peak and peak but when they are applied depends on Time of Day, Day of Week, and Season (summer/winter). on top of that, the rates for these 3 levels are Tiered. it's all spelled out in detail on PGE's website
Pacific Gas & Electric - Tariffs (pick the latest one for current rates)

charging at late night is cheapest by far, so that's a given. on the winter weekends, the off peak rate is also in effect until 5pm so a 2nd charge in the daytime makes sense. as mentioned by others here, once i hit Tier3, I will only charge at late night (it is possible for Tier3 peak or part-peak charging to come really close, if not exceed the cost of not charging!)

 

Thanks. I see the rates and the other tab with the times for each of peak, part-peak and off peak...but what are the baseline levels? My current PG&E has a baseline of ~380 kwh/month. Do you get a seperate pool for baseline in each of the peak/part-peak/off-peak etc that adds up to about 380 kwh/month?

Mike

 

I'm not overlooking anything. You made a comparison with ATs, implying that because people will pay for ATs people will pay for PEV. As I pointed out AT is a convenience, while short-range PEV isn't. People are always ready to spend money for convenience, as shown by the number of cars purchased in this country. The question is whether people will spend more money to drive a better Prius. If you take away all of the sales driven by HOV lane access and the heavy discounting in the Northeast what would the sales numbers look like?

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With this thread being called "EV experiences" and you posting the above I thought the EV experience was part of justification for paying over-the-odds for the plug-in. Given that the vast majority of the market doesn't care about emissions and efficiency (see hybrid market share, see low number of people cycling the short EV range of the PiP), given that the PiP doesn't save money, given that most people don't like driving the Prius (see market share), once you take away the HOV lane access and the big ZEV discounts the only thing I can see selling the PiP is the EV experience and I doubt that in its current form it can overcome the Priusness.

 

This may clarify...
SF Bay area: PG&E do I need to get into a different rate plan?

 

[/quote]
" To most people". Unfortunately, most people do not understand the real range of the PIP, or in some cases refuse to believe you. I predominantly drive the car in EV , because I can, my MPG Exceeds 100 mpg. However from time to time I go on a longer trip and then the mpg goes to hell. But I have never gotten lower than 65 mpg. Even at the 65 mpg figure, people may not believe me. Not only are ice drivers not interested in mpg, many don't know how to figure it out. There is one class of ice driver that doesn't have the cash to fill up thier car, no less fill it up twice to obtain a mpg figure. These drivers can only look at the bottom line when buying a car. $ 15 K compared to. $32 K, No contest. Seventeen thousand buys a lot of gasoline. This group may number 40-80 million drivers!

 

My feedback after 2 months and 2200 miles:

When I bought the PIP I was simply looking for a fuel efficient vehicle, I didn’t even know the PIP existed and never drove in a Prius before. I needed a car asap because my old maxima died after 230k miles. I walked into Toyota to look at the Prius C. ~50mpg starting at 19k.... sign me up. I immediately walked away because it was too small, I was shown the std Prius. After figuring the 4k rebate from Toyota on the PIP, the 2,500 tax credit, and the fact my wife wanted a back up camera, the PIP was the same price as the std... I bought the PIP after a 2 minute drive in HV mode (when the engine shut off at lights the sales guy said that was EV - he had no clue and neither did I).

Since then I have learned to drive the car ... on the 2200 miles my ratio is 30 EV / 70 HV and 69 MPG. Like others, my EV distance has dropped to 9.3 and I am not happy about it, although I tracked going 10.4 miles on a 9.3 range yesterday.

Knowing what I know now, having the taste of EV, I wish I had a full EV. The Plug-in Prius is an eye opening gateway car for me. On the other hand, perhaps it is best to ease into full EV as battery technology improves.

 

This morning it was finally above freezing- it was 37deg. So, the ICE didn't fire up early- I got a full 10 EV miles out of the 9.3 estimated EV range and at the end of my 28mi commute to work I was at 86mpg!
Just getting above freezing even by a few deg has a huge effect on the EV range of the PIP.

 

A quick counterpoint: My wife took the 2012 PiPa today, because she was going on a 300+ mile road trip, and wanted to save gas...Her car is a 2003 Acura MDX, which I have not driven since I bought the Prius in November 2012. I know she is going to "ruin" my 56% EV/ 44%HV on this trip, but she'll get somewhere around 50MPG, vs the 18-20MPG she would have achieved with the MDX.
Driving the MDX after 3 months of PiPa:
1) Does this thing even HAVE brakes?
2) OMG, I feel like I'm going to tip over, this car is on stilts!
3) Wow, nice acceleration! I bet I'm getting like 1MPG right now though!
4) What is that annoying vibration? Oh, it's just the 3.5L V6 ICE idling at the light.

Conclusion: I miss my Prius!

 

For what it's worth, I was also frustrated at first with the change in EV performance in the winter, until I came on here and posted some questions and finally figured out how to drive the thing to get better mileage. The downhill-on-a-full-battery ICE start was really having a huge impact on my MPGe because I start many trips with a short but steep downhill and then don't drive very far. Now that I know to put it in neutral while descending the hill, I have been getting 999MPGe on all of my short solo trips (I can stand to sit in a car at 65F; my wife can't). I've even learned how to achieve 999's without driving like a little old lady now that I have a better understanding of what's going to blow me out of EV mode. The cold-weather PiP experience is a ton more satisfying now.

In addition, an understanding of just how much impact the heater has on your mileage has helped a lot. My wife cranks the heater up to 75 and is disappointed that not only does that kill the gas mileage, the car never actually gets anywhere near that warm (sorry Toyota, but the heater in this car is pretty pathetic -- efficiency just isn't conducive to generating waste heat, I guess ). If I exercise a little restraint and set it to something like 68 or 70, my mileage goes way up (80+) for "EV with the ICE warmed up" trips. I do look forward to the summer, when we can quit using the heater so much and do a lot more pure EV driving.

 

+1
About as bad as the heat in my 1972 Datsun PL521 Pickup Truck. Pathetic is a very appropriate.

 

You guys do realize that there isn't really a heater in this car? It's just using the coolant.

 

I'm fortunate. I just about have the ideal situation for the current Prius Plug-In. My Prius stays in the garage when not in use (other than work). My one way commute is 9.8 miles, mostly flat. I have a level 2 charger at home and work. I currently have 635 miles in five weeks of use. My EV percentage is 48%. I've had plenty of one way EV only commutes, but not round trip. Today, that changed. Full EV in the morning and my return trip this evening. For some reason, I've had better luck in the evenings with full EV. Several mornings, ICE came on without heat or hard acceleration? With full EV this morning, I felt confident I could do the same this evening. It rained all day and as I drove home. Didn't know how that would affect my mileage in EV mode. As I pulled into the garage, I had .6 juice left, compared to last nights .4, and many EV only trips with just .1 left. I must admit, I'm getting max use of each charge and better at maximizing EV mode and mileage. Still on my dealer provided full tank of gas with one bar remaining. My next goal is a 1000 mile plus tank. Exciting stuff.

 

my heater works fine, same as my last two pri, down to about zero degrees.